Chisoxfn

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 11:03 AM) That's how I feel unless of course Burnett was then flipped for Wagner then while I'd still hate to part with Brandon I would do it.

I know one thing...Kenny doesn't want to deal Bmac. The question is will other teams step up and force him into it. Personally, I think he should just back out if thats the case cause like I said, when you break the deal down, its questionable as to the type of upgrade it is. Had Duque pitched like piss last night, I'd be saying different things, but if its Contreras that Burnett replaces, I don't thin kthats a significant upgrade to the rotation. Of course if Contreras turns into a stud reliever, well than that would be something. I like Burnett, just not sure I want to give up Bmac. I'd gladly deal outfield depth though (just not named Chris Young). My question is, does Fla really need an OF prospect?

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 10:53 AM) I haven't read through this whole thread so this probably was mentioned. But I just woke up to the radio and Bruce said the Sox are closing in on a deal for Burnett but it's Damaso and Brian Anderson. To me that's a no brainer, I still stick by my guns that Damaso won't be traded unless Kenny has another left handed reliever lined up. Now thats a deal I'd do all day long.

QUOTE(Heads22 @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 10:53 AM) There's three teams there that have to be just scary to face. And Seattle's not that bad.... Lo and behold.....Jason and I agree on something.... Haha. NL Central isn't very deep, but I do think right now St. Louis and Houston are as good as any other 1-2 in baseball divisions (only as good or better imo are Angels/A's, and Sox/Twins). The East divisions are top to bottom probably the strongest with the NL being the strongest.

QUOTE(Ozzie Montana @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 10:45 AM) I think the red sox are concentratin more on J.C Romero because when Schilling is ready they'll probably put him in the rotaion and they can have J.C in the bullpen. If they could pawn of Millar for Romero that would be a steal. Mueller for Romero makes some sense though. Twins have a really strong bullpen so I think they could overcome giving up Romero as well, although it could bite em in the ass. BoSox could survive without Mueller or so I'd think. They like the Greek God of Walks (Youkalis).

QUOTE(beck72 @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 10:38 AM) IMO, BMac is expendable because the sox already have 3 control pitchers as part of the rotation for the next few years. MB, JOn, and Freddy don't overpower opponents. BMac also relies on his control in order to be effective. While I don't think signing AJ to a long term deal is smart, it makes sense for this yr as the sox try to win it all Disagree, Freddy is an overpowering pitcher.

I chose the AL West...although I could also make a case for the NL Central and the Al Central. The reason I say the NL Central is because St. Louis is really really good and frankly Houston is a scary team now that they've gotten rolling. AL Central is really solid too with the Sox (best team in baseball) and the Twins (wild card leader). Which has the best races...thats the eastern divisions (Both AL/NL).

ESPN News has a Red Sox reporter on and says that despite reports, they aren't that hot after Burnett. Doesn't think Arroyo would make sense but mentions the Red Sox have some quality pitching prospects down in the minors. Basically put, doesn't think the Red Sox are big on Burnett.

QUOTE(Milkman delivers @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 10:21 AM) Hahahahahaha. Jenks was in our minors for like half a year, and Politte was never ever in our minors. Thats exactly what he said

QUOTE(EvilJester99 @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 10:18 AM) I was actually kind of hoping he would sign a minor league deal to stay with the Sox and maybe work some of his problems out in the minors and maybe come back to the big club sometime or another.... The Sox woudln't of had to do that. I think they knew they weren't going to use Shingo and wanted to give him a shot to catch on somewhere else. Shingo had all his options left so they could of sent him to the minors. Instead they designated him for assignement and removed him from the 40 (opening up a roster spot).

QUOTE(daa84 @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 10:18 AM) check up on your chisox minor league history, cotts came from oakland, jenks from anaheim, garland from cubs, and politte was already a mlb veteran when the sox got him from toronto. only buerhle is the true homegrown outa that bunch You could make a case that the Sox developed Garland. When the Sox acquired Jon he had been considered a bust at that point, however the Sox saw a good arm with potential. He made some adjustments and turned things around and quickly became one of the best pitching prospects in baseball. However, I think the Sox deserve some credit in terms of Garland. Cotts pitched in AA for the Sox for a full season and was lights out. Sox have done a lot with him as well in terms of developing him. However your right, they didn't pick him up.

No no no. Teams just don't want to trade for him. I think they know they'll get a shot to negotiate with him and are just going to wait for that. Shingo will be picked up.

QUOTE(Ozzie Montana @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 10:16 AM) Im watching ESPNNEWS and Steve Phillips says nothing new. Orioles, Red Sox, and White Sox interested. Says he'd be best fit in Baltimore and that Jorge Julio would really appeal to Florida. Phillips is just repeating what he said last time. Actually I think this is just a replay, but maybe not. Cause its basically word for word from the last time.

QUOTE(daa84 @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 10:06 AM) if thomas is gonna be out for a while longer, and personally, i feel that that could very well happen. id welcome griffey with open arms, and put griffey strictly at DH and do the same rotation where everett gives pods 1 day off a week, dye 1 day off a week, rowand 1 day off a week (with pods in center) and griffey Jr. 1 day off a week. question is, will JR dish out that kidna money? and will we have the guys to deal if we lose our best bargaining chip (at least who cincy would want most) to florida in bmac I don't think it would take that much to get Griffey. IF your willing to take on his contract, the Reds will unload him with open arms, imo. I've been saying for a while (not speaking in terms of the Sox) but Griffey would be a key player at the trade deadline and may just be the best guy to trade for (at least offensively speaking). Once again, I'm speaking in terms of baseball in general, not saying he'd be the best pickup for the Sox. Omar Vizquel and Billy Wagner would be the best the Sox could do, imo. A close 2nd would be Vizquel and Schmidt (if they could get them giving up Contreras and a few minor leaguers, I'd do it). Of course I don't think either of these would happen.

QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 10:04 AM) Just explain to me how Burnett has been a better pitcher than Contreras this season. He hasn't. Thats the problem. The way the Sox are going to work this trade (with jose sliding into the pen) Burnett isn't replacing Duque, rather Contreras and there is no way anyone is going to tell me that thats a major upgrade. Don't tell me how Contreras is going to s*** his pants in the post-season either, cause last I looked, Burnett hasn't done anything in the playoffs himself. This move makes ZERO sense. Don't trade for Burnett.

QUOTE(daa84 @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 09:58 AM) chisoxfn, i dont mean to come off like i am writing him off, im simply saying now maybe the perfect time to deal him, because im not sure he is as good as some out there think he is. i mean he is in some peoples book right behind the felix hernandez's, and im not sure if thats how i would classify him Put it this way, I wouldn't trade Felix Hernandez for AJ Burnett. I'd potentially deal Bmac for Burnett. However, I still have quite a few doubts about how this move really makes the club better. I think they'd be best looking for a good reliever (maybe even keeping Marte and dealing Viz for a better reliever) and a bat.

QUOTE(Ozzie Montana @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 09:56 AM) I like our lineup today. Only thing I'd do different is flip flop Rowand and Guchi. But I'm with you, I really like the way this lineup looks.

QUOTE(daa84 @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 09:53 AM) here is one reason i like this deal. brandon mccarthy is a strong pitching prospect. but lets face the facts here. this guy is one of the more overrated prospects. most people say you cant tell how a pitcher will really pitch until he hits AA ball. and what has he done at or above AA. 3-1 3.46 29Ks in 26 innings in AA in 2004, are good solid numbers. stud prospect numbers? not quite. career in AAA: 3-7 5.17 ERa in 78.1IP with 94 Ks. certainly impressive K rates, but still the ERA and 14 homers is alot granted the bandbox in charlotte. even his #s at low A ball werent dominating, 8-5 3.64 94 IP 113 Ks. again, the k rate is the only outstanding number. the only place he truly dominated was at high A, and had a good showing in like 20 innings of spring training when hitters are trying to get in a groove. IMO the white sox know that his status as an elite prospect is probably overrated. dont get me wrong, i wouldnt mind holding on to him, i just think his market value is higher than his real value right now, and thus i dont mind selling high Totally disagree. I have my reasons for it, but no one and I mean no one should be writing off Brandon McCarthy. He's pitched back to back good games and is getting back on pace. He's had some stuff come up, but he's bouncing back and is going to be a very good major league pitcher. Fact is Brandon was in over his head. He got limited time in AA and than was shot to AAA. He's starting to get things figured out and he's going to have a huge 2nd half (whether for Charlotte or another AAA team).

Book it...Sox are going to explode today. I see between 8 and 10 runs and a big win.

QUOTE(VAfan @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 09:48 AM) Griffey, Griffey, Griffey. As a DH replacement for Frank Thomas, he would be more expensive, though with Frank's recent run of injuries, probably not less reliable. He has no future in the outfield. His ZR number is about the worst in baseball. I just don't see how you get that deal done when KW thinks he already has the equivalent player -- Carl Everett -- in the lineup. I'm not saying Everett is the same player, just that KW thinks he is. Plus we have Ross Gload as an extra LH bat who can fill the same roles. The marginal value Griffey might add is not worth the complications of his contract. If the Sox are willing to bench Thomas/Everett than I think this would make a lot of sense. Griffey is better than both of them (although Everett has been huge for the club this year). Plus it adds that lefty bat and I'd stick him in the middle of the order.

QUOTE(whitesox61382 @ Jul 23, 2005 -> 07:31 PM) Trade deadline moves: Arizona gets: Anderson, Tracey, and Gonzalez(SS) Sox get: Tracy LA gets: Crede, Haigwood, and Owens Sox get: Perez Texas gets: Contreras and Young Sox get: Soriano Offseason: Sign Furcal Resign Konerko Resign AJ Resign Soriano Resign Politte 2006 team: LF Podsednik SS Furcal DH Soriano 1B Konerko 3B Tracy RF Dye CF Rowand C AJ 2B Iguchi Can you imagine how exciting it would be to watch this offseason? The mixture of speed and power would be amazing. There would be a possibility that the top 3 hitters could combine to steal 150 bags, plus you have guys like Dye, Rowand, and Iguchi who are capable of stealing double digit bags. With the exception of Podsednik, all the other hitters are on pace for double digit HR, and three(Soriano, Konerko, and Dye) are on pace for 30+ HR. This lineup could be a 200/200 SB/HR lineup. You have a nice balance to the lineup, and all the players are in the prime of their careers(none of them are over the age of 31). LH Buehrle RH Garcia RH Garland LH Perez RH Hernandez/McCarthy The Sox would retain the big 3 from this year, and add another solid lefty to the mix. They still have McCarthy as insurance in case one of the starters struggles or goes down with an injury(a nice insurance policy to have). RH Hermy RH Politte RH Vizcaino RH Jenks/Baj LH Marte LH Cotts The Sox keep the nucleus of the solid pen of 2005. With a young arm like Jenks/Baj being a wild card with their potential to dominate. IF Uribe IF Ozuna/Harris 1B/OF Gload C - whoever OF - whoever Sign a decent backup catcher and outfielder, and the roster is set. From a payroll perspective, the Sox would lose about 20M from Thomas, Contreras, Takatsu, and Everett, while adding roughly 25M from Tracy, Perez, Soriano, and Furcal. Add in about 10M from internal raises and arbitration, and I think you have a semi-realistic payroll for next year based on the increase in attendance and potential playoff revenue. I realize that this is not going to happen, but it isn't out of the relm of possibility, and I wouldn't be surprised if a deal similar to the ones listed above occur. I don't know what the payroll would be, but I'll say this. I think the respected teams (ie the Dodgers, and the other teams you had making deals) would make those trades. And your right, that would be quite the lineup and pitching staff. Very nice looking lineup/team.

I've always thought Burroughs was a solid player. I'm a Burroughs fan and I think a change of scenery would do him some good. At the same time I don't think he'll ever be great. He could turn into a pretty good role player off the bench though or even a solid 3rd baseman.

QUOTE(southsideirish @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 09:44 AM) Now show me how many good outing he has had compared to bad. Were there a coupld bad outings so awful that it blew up his ERA to that point or has he been consistently bad? That would mean more to me. He had that one game against Philly where he got hammered (thats just off the top of my head).

QUOTE(ptatc @ Jul 24, 2005 -> 09:37 AM) He is from from the south burbs. He went to Thornwood high school in south holland. He was a patient of mine. He had the best run I have ever seen in HS baseball. In the semis and finals he did not made only one out. He was either walked or got a hit evey time. He's a really good guy also. I've always been a Cliff Floyd fan. I think he'd welcome a move to Chicago at this point (I don't think he really likes New York), plus he'd be playing for a winner. I don't know what type of package the Sox would be willing to throw out nor do I know if it even makes sense cause he'd need a spot to play almost every day. Would it make sense to platoon DH's. Floyd starts against righties, EVerett against lefties at DH. Than you ocassionally let Floyd play against tough righties for Dye? The big problem with me is I think the Sox have a lot of quality position players. For example, I think 2nd and SS are the two biggest weaknesses for the Sox. Iguchi has been downright disgusting the past 2 months and Uribe has been nasty the whole year. At the same time Uribe plays awesome defense and Guchi is solid (Willie is better defensively though, but has shown time in and time out that he can't move guys over). To upgrade at SS it should be mandator that the player must be close to as good as Uribe (not many are better) defensively. If they aren't, I wouldn't accept the deal. This team is built on pitching and when you have that, you need to put a focal point on the defensive lineup that plays behind the pitchers. Then you can't upgrade with Pods, I wouldn't ever change Rowand (he may not have the power, but he's hitting for a good average and plays stellar defense) and than there is Dye (whose a very solid 5 hole hitter and plays solid defense). Paulie isn't getting moved. Sure he hasn't played amazing, but he's still solid. He's not a true clean up hitter though and I think that semi hurts him, but the Sox aren't going to deal him nor are you going to find many guys that could come in and do a better job at 1b (imo).

I've probably ripped Duque more than anyone else on this board and he definately deserves credit. Keith called it too, telling me all week how Saturday was going to be a well pitched game by Duque. Too bad the offense didn't get rolling. Duque has more zip on his pitches and he's looking more like the Duque of old.