Jordan4life_2007

QUOTE(SnB @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 03:22 PM) Orton has proved more than rex has. All rex has ever been for us is potential. Rex has been hit hard by the injury bug. All i'm saying that is if Rex comes out and looks really good in practice and impresses the coaching staff, you might have to put him in. But I agree with the thinking that as long as we're winning, Orton should be the guy.

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 03:14 PM) Point is, I don't see the Bears wanting that. They are trying to protect the young QB and aren't asking him to drop back 35 times. They aren't asking him to throw 25-30 yard slants all game long. They are asking him to make good decisions on 2nd (ocassionally) and more importantly on 3rd and 5 or short. He's thrown some damn good slants and when he does drop back and throw the ball he's made good decisions and found the open guy. I saw him float Gage on the 1st drive of the game, that was about the only ball I saw floated the entire day. The more the game went on the more accurate he was and to close out the half he was very accurate and made all the good sideline throws. Point is, when he's stepping back and throwing he's making the plays and most importantly he's not making mistakes. The Bears aren't putting him in a position to throw 30 times and go for 250 or 300 yards. Thats not what this offense is trying to do and you can't say Orton sucks because they do that. Its a freaking brilliant tactic by Turner and the offense to protect him and run the ball, which rests the defense and keeps the offense very balanced. If you guys start seeing Orton drop back and drop back and drop back and just constantly make poor reads or throw the ball all over the place I'd see the case in point. But can you show me a bunch of plays each week that he missed? I don't think so. Especially these past two weeks. Why assume Grossman would do anymore, I don't see the Bears missing big plays. They don't go for many of them, but Orton is hitting his guys. Jason, I understand everything you're saying. The offense is extremely conservative, and it has to be. We can afford to be conservative due to the fact we have the best defense the NFL has seen since the 2000 Ravens. All I'm saying is that at some point, Orton is gonna have to go out there and win a game. Lets assume Bryant makes that fg, then the pressure goes straight to the offense. You can't be as conservative in a tie game or if you're behind. Your qb has to make some plays. I personally don't think Orton can do that. I would love to be proven wrong, but I haven't seen much to suggest he can actually go out there and "win" a game.

QUOTE(Tmar28 @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 03:08 PM) 108 yarder was total luck. not even funny how much luck that was. could also throw in the fumbled punt by SF. you could even say any of peterson's runs he has had in any game have been luck. against the saints, saints fumble on the bears 15. thats mostly luck, a little skill though. against panthers, their best linebacker morgan got injured, could easily say that was some big help for the bears. that missed field goal by bryant is right at the top of the list of lucky breaks the bears have gotten. You want a link to a Packer board?

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 03:07 PM) I don't understand all this Orton hate. When he drops back do you see him making mistakes? The Bears run a conservative offense, because of this he's not going to put up prolific pass numbers. That said I don't see Orton making poor reads and for the most part when he drops back he makes good throws. The Bears don't call an offense and its a good thing imo (since we have a rookie QB) thats ever going to put up 300 yard passing games (and if we do, its a bad sign right now because it means were playing catch-up). If I saw Orton dropping back and missing wide open guys all game I'd say something different. He made two bad decisions all game (one was an early pass to Gage that Barber damn near picked and the other was on the pump fake to Gage which should never have been thrown that was picked). He's making good decisions with the football and is throwing pretty darn accurate balls for the most part. All this is fine as well as long as the D continues to do it's thing. The minute Orton is asked to actually win a game for us, we're in trouble.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 03:04 PM) Sat down and watched the whole game. The D is flat out sick, Chico, Lovie, Angello, all should get props for putting this D together. On the other hand, I now have no problem with Grossman splitting snaps with Orton in practice..... I agree. At some point, Orton is gonna have to actually win a game for us, and that thought scares the crap out of me. If Grossman impresses in practice, I wouldn't have any problem with him getting the nod.

People need to get over the Brand/Chandler trade. We were terrible when we had Brand. He wanted out of Chicago the first chance he got anyway. How many times have the Clippers made the playoffs with Brand? Don't get me wrong, I like Brand. But we didn't trade Shaq, Duncan or KG. People act like Tyson has been a bum. As shown earlier, he's still in the top 10 or so in boards. Tyson will NEVER be a great offensive player. He's got horrible hands, foot work, ect. His stregnths are boards, blocked shots and defense. As long as he's doing those things, he's fine.

Thank you Matt Bryant. Huge, huge win today. It looked like we were gonna blow it at the end. There's no more adjectives to use that can describe this defense. The offense still makes me wanna barf. But as long as the d continues to hold teams to 13 points or less, we should be fine. This team has a legitimate shot at homefield throughout the NFC playoffs. Who would've thunk it?

I'm just about certain PK will be back.

QUOTE(Jeckle2000 @ Nov 25, 2005 -> 02:29 PM) When it comes to center fielders the Sox could aquire or use that would be adaquate enough defensively for the Sox's needs... Juan Pierre is dead last and the worst option availiable... HE SUCKS ASS IN CF!!!! No, No, No, No! Ozzie isn't that stupid... Let the scrubbies have their crappy joke of a CF... Jeckle, you've made it quite clear how you feel about Pierre. No need to remind us every 2 minutes.

Um, thanks?

QUOTE(whitesoxmanager @ Nov 24, 2005 -> 02:45 PM) Jason thanks for being politically correct with your response but are you endorsing the trade or are you like me? if we dont win the WS next year i will be asking myself the why did we do it question over and over. especially if thome gets hurt before the allstar break & arow is killing it in either Philly BOS or NY. And if Thome hits as he has his whole career, save last year, you will be praising Kenny for making the trade.

QUOTE(qwerty @ Nov 24, 2005 -> 02:14 PM) I would prefer for our two hole hitter to have some power. I am talking a guy with good gap power and has the ability to hit 10-12 homers... in other words, a guy that is not afraid of knocking in a run. I just do not see gathright being that anytime soon. But imo as it stands gomes is their best outfielder until proven otherwise. With Hopefully Konerko, Thome, Dye, Gooch, AJ, Crede and Uribe, I don't think power is gonna be much of a problem.

QUOTE(whitesoxmanager @ Nov 24, 2005 -> 02:24 PM) this is very true and thanks for the guarantee. but how do you as a fan answer this question: That the team that just won the 2005 WS isnt good enough to win it in 2006? This is the burning question across the board in each and every player on our team right now and is definitely being discussed with those who talk to AROW today. HI8IS if someone told me that you were now a member of the cardinals fan club I would be just as outraged. I just remember all to well what happened to the Chicago Bears the year after the superbowl when Wilbur Marshall didnt get paid and left to go to the Redskins. A little different scenario but the same gut wrenching feeling! When was the last time we had a repeat champion? You gotta go back to those great late 90's Yankees teams. I don't care what the situation is, if you have a chance to better yourself you go out and do it. Thome is a HUGE upgrade at dh. Everybody loves and will miss Rowand. But he is replaceable, and it's time to see what guys like Anderson, Sweeney, ect can do.

QUOTE(Wanne @ Nov 24, 2005 -> 02:12 PM) I know if he's ready to go...he could be valuable to have around as a spot starter and long relief...but at $4.5-5M...that's kind of a pricey insurance policy IMO. I'm not sure what other options there may be besides the Annual Felix Diaz Tour (which I'm not down with)...is Adkins ready. But bottom line...if money become a real issue...you've got Duque's $$$ as well as Marte's $1.25-1.5 to try and move. Is Arnie Munoz ready to step up in Marte's place (actually Cotts and Neal is your main lefty out of the pen). There really isn't much to think about if we're not able to trade him. He'll compete with B-mac in spring training for the last spot in the rotation, with whoever has the better showing winning the spot, while the loser moves to the pen in the long relief role. That's the only way I can envison it playing out.

QUOTE(WinninUgly @ Nov 24, 2005 -> 10:58 AM) I live in NY, so no Comcast. And you're not a Yankees fan?

QUOTE(Wanne @ Nov 24, 2005 -> 02:00 PM) Oh don't get me wrong...I'm not comparing Thome and Duque in terms of injuries. I've just always cringed just a bit or wondered when I hear people saying "he's in the best shape of his life..." when referring to a professional athlete in their upper 30's. Oh ok. I see what you're saying. Just have some faith in Kenny and his people. I just refuse to believe he makes a deal of this magnitude without being 99% sure Thome was healthy.

QUOTE(Wanne @ Nov 24, 2005 -> 01:56 PM) Crede's back would be a major question if I was Kenny...but I'd love to see him locked up for 3 more years. As for AJ...he is absolutely A MUST!!! He's filled a hole and solidified a position that has been such a question mark for years...not to mention the influence he has on his teammates. In my mind...almost everybody on this team is replaceable to some extent...EXCEPT AJ! Agreed. I want no part of the days of Mark Johnson, Josh Paul and Miguel Olivo. AJ flat out spoiled us last year.

QUOTE(Wanne @ Nov 24, 2005 -> 01:50 PM) I remember hearing that about El Duque too. I'm not doubting this about Thome...but I'd rather see it than just hear about it. I can't wait to see if it's true in ST. That being said...I know I've heard everybody say Frank is gone. It sure would be nice to keep him around in some way shape or form if his bat is needed at some point. Will it happen...doubtful. Hell...we don't even know if Frank's foot is healed properly. Duque has been injury prone for as long as I can remember. Thome shouldn't be penalized for ONE injury prone season. Hell, we wanted Griffey last season for crying out loud.

Excellent posts@Juggs

Now that I've had a chance to really think about and digest this deal, I love it. I'm gonna miss Arow badly, but a healthy Thome, and I have no reason to believe he won't be healthy, unless something freakish happens, is a guaranteed bet to hit 40+ HR and knock in anywhere from 100-120 RBI. The OBP he's sported over the years is sick. And like many already knew, he's a wonderful guy to have in that clubhouse. Welcome to Chicago, Mr. Thome!

QUOTE(WinninUgly @ Nov 24, 2005 -> 10:09 AM) He is not going to be the Jim Thome of the 1990's Good, I'd rather have the Thome of 2001-04 that averaged 48 HR and 120 RBI'S.

QUOTE(Felix @ Nov 23, 2005 -> 07:02 PM) He's old. Anyone that's old and misses a season due to an injury is an injury concern. I wouldn't say that. You got guys in their 20's who are more injury prone than guys in their 30's. Bottomline is Thome has had one injury plagued year. I don't believe for a second that Kenny would make this move without being damn near 100% confident that Thome would be fine.

QUOTE(whitesoxfan101 @ Nov 23, 2005 -> 06:51 PM) Also, IF we can keep Paulie and have Thome DH everyday (which IMO means he DEFINITELY stays healthy) I think this is a REALLY REALLY good trade. That's the only way it's a good trade.

I like this deal as long as we can resign Konerko. Losing Konerko and Rowand while adding Thome doesn't make this team better.

QUOTE(GasHeGone @ Nov 23, 2005 -> 05:53 PM) Does anyone think Thome was on the juice and maybe that has something to do with his injury and horrible '05 stats? Not a chance.