Marty34

QUOTE (Springfield SoxFan @ Feb 26, 2012 -> 09:31 AM) Great post and excellent point about giving KW credit for knowing when to cut Bobby loose. Jenks should have been cut loose the year before. I'll say Theo doesn't get much blame for signing him. Just a terrible move.

QUOTE (SoxFan1 @ Feb 26, 2012 -> 02:56 AM) <!--quoteo(post=2552825:date=Feb 25, 2012 -> 06:03 PM:name=Balta1701)-->QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 25, 2012 -> 06:03 PM) <!--quotec-->Your browser does not support iframes. There's something very unique about how Dunn goes about things. I kinda get the sense there are two ways to look at this: 1) He's extremely confident in what he's done throughout the course of his career, what he knows is tried and true, and something was very wrong behind the scenes in 2011 that attributed to a lot of his failures. OR 2) He's just extremely lazy, doesn't really care, and is just going to go out there and do his own thing, no matter what. I think Dunn either has another crap season in 2012 or he comes out and has a monster, prime-Adam Dunn season. I just can't see anything in the middle happening. We know he has insane power. We know the guy can draw walks like none other. And we know he's also going to strike out a ton. Hopefully he can just get his mind right and go out there and do what we brought him in to do. Maybe less pressure (due to lower team expectations) will help. Remember the good old days? Your browser does not support iframes. I think this is a very good assessment. I know someone who worked closely with the team during spring training last year and they were shocked by Dunn's daily workout routine. Last guy in, first guy out and that was the best thing they said about his routine.

Even this early in spring training, it's a very nice change not to have stories about the goofy stuff the manager says. I think a more business-like approach will put the focus and pressure on the players which will make them play to their talent level.

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Feb 23, 2012 -> 10:00 AM) It's sad how little White Sox talk interests me, even as spring training is about to begin. I read almost every thread on the site, but now only around half of them in PHT. I don't read any of the "This day in Sox history" threads, stopped reading the Jim Bowden and Cuban ones, and haven't read a word from A Lot For Sox To Overcome, The Team Is Pretty Much Set, nor 5 Burning Questions. I'm not sure if it's the team that is causing this or the complete lack of anything worth talking about due to lack of moves. No offense, but why post this kind of thing (continually)? Nobody cares about who reads what thread or if they read any thread at all.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Feb 22, 2012 -> 01:54 PM) Good luck to Robin in trying to convince Peavy to come out of a game. Good luck to Robin in dealing with AJP as well if he decides to play Flowers a lot. Good luck to Robin dealing with Rios and Dunn if he decides to "rest them" a lot. Whether you guys believe it or not, Ozzie was an easy manager to play for and a good manager. Good luck to Robin in dealing with the egos of these millionaires. There's a chance Robin could have some problems in the clubhouse with our veterans. If Robin is a natural as a manager, great. I doubt Ventura has one problem in the clubhouse. The players know Chairman Reinsdorf isn't going to let him go under any circumstance.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 22, 2012 -> 07:55 AM) 2k5 and I agree here. The Tigers won 95 games last year. They then added Fielder. There's definitely some downside room for them. Verlander won't repeat last season, so subtract 2 wins there, maybe subtract another win for Valverde not being magic, probably subtract a win or two from either Avila or Peralta not having incredible seasons...but that's still starting with 88 wins if a lot goes wrong. BP has the Tigers at 86 wins.

6 Ramirez 4 Beckham 3 Konerko B Dunn 9 Viciedo 8 Deaza 7 Rios 2 AJ 5 Morel Sale Danks Peavy Floyd Humber

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 20, 2012 -> 09:57 AM) Who gets counted as number 3? Peavy or Sale? Peavy.

I feel this year's top 3 in the rotation has greater potential than last year's.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 19, 2012 -> 03:55 PM) Bringing up Molina this year is the wrong answer. Bringing up Molina before the middle of next year is probably the wrong answer. But again, that requires admitting that we're not going all-in this year and that we have to look towards the future...including with the job status of the people in the front office. The right time to bring a player up is for the GM to decide.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 19, 2012 -> 03:50 PM) John Danks had 426 minor league innings when he came up, and even then, John Danks struggled some when he came up and really wore down in August to the point that he was shut down for a couple weeks. And that team wound up being terrible and at the bottom of the division, so it gave him an opportunity to actually do that struggling. 500 minor league innings, especially for a guy who didn't pitch until he was 19 and already in the minors, is not by any means unreasonable. 600 minor league innings might not be bad. So there is no right/wrong answer.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 19, 2012 -> 03:35 PM) Then his resignation should have been accepted last offseason, because taking time now to develop and rebuild is a must. Pushing Molina upwards hard right now to satisfy the "Compete now or fire KW"! brigade is lunacy. By April of 2014 which is when you want to see Molina in the rotation he will be 25 and have 500+ minor league innings. Mark Buehrle by comparison had 208 total innings in the minors (none above AA) and was 21 when he made his debut.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 19, 2012 -> 03:04 PM) Which is scary. He has 22 IP above A ball and now the pressure is on to pitch in the majors leagues. Let the guy develop. He has 292 career IP. Williams doesn't have the luxury to wait due to mistakes in previous years.

QUOTE (DirtySox @ Feb 19, 2012 -> 03:11 PM) This. It's ridiculous that people are okay with it other than perhaps a September call-up. Hopefully Kenny is just blowing smoke. Let these prospects develop in the minors. No need to continue to rush prospects, especially in a rebuilding year. Maybe part of the reason Molina was acquired is because Williams feels he will be ready to be in the rotation by 2013. You have to trust the GM's judgment.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Feb 19, 2012 -> 02:34 PM) Santos was a pretty good reliever. I'm thinking KW would take Molina becoming a pretty good releiver. Maybe he doesn't lose the trade if Molina becomes a pretty good reliever, but Molina is being counted on to be much more than that by Williams in this rebuilding. Williams also said we will probably see Molina at some point in 2012

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Feb 19, 2012 -> 12:15 PM) Not certain about that. H does rely on the slider as a real good out pitch, but he doesn't have a bad fastball either. How many real great pitches do one or two ining relief pitchers have anyway? Most of those I have folowed have good pitches to set up the one great out pitch, or someone like Rivera (in a class of his own obviously) has basically one great pitch and control. I just feel that relievers that rely on a dominant slider as an out pitch are a good bet to have a short shelf life of effectiveness due to the stress that pitch puts on the arm.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 19, 2012 -> 12:12 PM) The problem is that afterwards, Boston came out and said that they'd have bid up the price on Santos if they'd known he was available. KW took a guy that he wanted and didn't push as hard as he could have, maybe out of fear that he'd lose him. Basically, Molina needs to dominate to prove him right, because better deals would have been out there had he worked harder. It comes down to Williams not valuing the Red Sox system as much as the Red Sox do. I have no problem with how the Santos trade was executed.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 19, 2012 -> 11:43 AM) You're 100% right about the effect the Wilder fiasco has had on the system. We've basically had no Latin America operations (excluding Cuba) since then and it shows. But who hasn't acknowledged that? Read the thread, plenty of discounting of Wilder's impact.

Santos was a middle-of-the-pack closer last year. It's possible he improves, but at 28 and relying as much as he does on his slider, I don't think he'll have much more than a couple of years as an upper-tier closer. I think Williams got the best deal possible for him.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 19, 2012 -> 11:05 AM) Because we don't defend KW, but we also admit he wasn't the only part of the problem. You guys defend Williams against just about all criticism.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Feb 19, 2012 -> 10:56 AM) That's not true, just as much blame has been placed on Williams as Guillen, it's just that KW went about dealing with it more diplomatically and was perceived to be less self-centered with his falling on the sword trick, but he doesn't have a huge number of supporters left here. It's funny that Greg gets so much criticism for defending Guillen when SS2K5 and Balta do the same for Williams with nary a word of objection.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Feb 19, 2012 -> 10:35 AM) Seems it was also about the "scope" of his powers with the Sox. I found the same article a while back when there was a discussion about who had actually hired Wilder, KW...or whether he was inherited from the previous GM. No blame is ever put on Kenny Williams here on Soxtalk.com

The White Sox had a convict in charge of player development from 2003 - 2007 and people on this board are blaming Sox player development on Guillen for stunting Morel's growth by limiting him to 435 AB's last year.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 19, 2012 -> 09:55 AM) How ever you want to phrase it, it was ridiculous. Wilder is responsible for one very small subset of players coming into the White Sox system. Even optimal franchise signs what three to five guys out of LA a year? How many rookies does the field manager deal with? All of them. Heck if you want to drop down to the minor league level in camps and spring training, the field manager deals with player development of the entire draft and all prospects to some extent. Wilder dealt with the Latin America guys. The comparison is ridiculous. http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/cws/team/e...lder_david.html

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 19, 2012 -> 09:46 AM) The guy responsible for scouting and signing Latin America has more of an effect on the organization than the field manager of the major league ball club. That's a ridiculous statement I never wrote.