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America isn't a threat to killing thousands of Iranians?

QUOTE (BobDylan @ May 15, 2009 -> 06:40 AM) Small sample size this year, but I'd stroke it if we had a CFer with those numbers.

Lost, what have you known of nixon to ever think that was sarcastic? That's pretty consistent.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 15, 2009 -> 03:24 AM) Depends on how they define "Restrictions". Keep in mind...they may simply not be able to convict some of these guys based on anything else since 95% of the evidence against them is stuff they confessed to under duress. All they have may be hearsay. There is going to be a large motivation to push as much through the gaps as possible, given the shoddy legal work done by the predecessors. ends justify the means. I have a hard time believing all the evidence against them is hearsay or done under duress. And I have a hard time believing American prisons can't hold these folk. Nonetheless, to shut down guantanamo we were going to have to do some s*** we weren't prepared for, and in the end I'm not going to complain. I really don't think anything other than tribunals would work, frankly.

QUOTE (southsideirish71 @ May 15, 2009 -> 02:09 AM) How exactly again is the constitution applied to non-US citizens that were captured in a foreign land. I thought military tribunals are part of the geneva convention. I am sure that we can get an impartial jury of their peers with students from Berkeley. wait but isn't the constitution absolute and no judge should go on the supreme court trying to apply anything but what was decided in 1789

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 14, 2009 -> 07:28 PM) Frankly, if Pelosi was briefed and didn't take steps that she could have taken to stop the program, then she's just as guilty of conspiracy as many of the others, so I have no problem tossing her in prison for that, so feel free to think it's equal. Conspiracy is conspiracy. It's reason the truth commission is needed. But no, it's not equal.

everything is = The administration enacting torture as a commonplace technique and the investigation to how this came about is absolutely = to documents with a letter saying they're not sure if they are reliable saying that a congressperson was briefed on the issue. How do you not see that?

An elaboration of what Ebert was talking about. The reboot of the batman and to a much lesser extent, Bond franchise, saw them re evaluate the character. Batman was no longer an absolute moral figure, he was dark and tested by power and revenge. Bond seemed to enjoy destruction and anarchy, seen more as a loose cannon than before. That's kind of what he's speaking to.

are we talking about pictures? IMO, this is something I knew would happen. Something that is morally correct - open government correcting its wrongs - and the duties of leadership - compromising soliders. I don't blame Obama for withholding them, and I think we, as a people, have a right to them. But perhaps not now, perhaps later, or perhaps years ago.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 14, 2009 -> 04:57 PM) There have been more than a few reports since the memos came out that one of the things Cheney and Co were after in their "interrogations" was info that would give justification for the Iraq war, but that's not what he's going to be referring to. This is. This guy, Ibn al-Shaykh al-Libi, was captured by the U.S., and "rendered" off to Egypt for "Additional Interrogation". He rapidly did exactly what torture makes you do...confessed to everything the torturers wanted to hear. It then made up this block of text in Powell's speech. It really is an amazing story here. We capture a guy, send him off to Egypt for torture, he tells the Egyptians exactly what we want him to say, the CIA declares his information unreliable because it's obtained under torture, it winds up in Powell's speech anyway (and is actually the last claim Powell makes before his summary portion, like this is the real slam dunk part), he recants easily in 2004 when someone bothers to ask him, he vanishes for a couple years, some members of the press find him a couple weeks back, and like a week later he's dead. this is why you are on the top 20 poster list. Yes, this is it. I bombed, bombed that final. GOD GDHWIOSFWO:EUIRSDHLKFJHWOERUI TSDJL it was torture lol

no that's not what I'm talking about but I have a final in 30 minutes.

QUOTE (lostfan @ May 14, 2009 -> 01:53 PM) I don't remember ever seeing anything like that. It was just some s*** they completely made up. There was a specific detainee they thought had info on an Iraq-Al Qaida connection, and there has been rumors there is a document ordering waterboarding to get the info... whether that surfaces we will see, whether it exists we don't know. But seriously does everything have to drop to the one 24 scenario: Spmos-butsijfosf WHAT IF WE ONLY HAVE 10 MIN. Left. These pr***s are trained for torture, you will not be able to get the info out in 10 minutes. We waterboarded these people 100+ times, that clearly wasn't a time precious scenario. edit: so what I'm saying is, say there was success in one waterboarding, it's a hard sell to me that we couldn't have gotten that info any other way. Clearly as exampled by lost's article, sometimes successful interrogations were called off for EITs, so, I don't know, this is just disgusting.

I think the thing that I'm most interested in, and has been a sort of under the current type of murmuring, is whether torture was specifically used to gain information on an Al Qaida-Iraq tie.

I'm pretty sure it'll be Kagan.

the wash times has no bias or ill intent. mooneys ftw

I must be the only one that remembers this commercial from 2004 when the Republicans were acting stoic and the democrats were dividing the country with their name-calling:

kyyle23 and SS2k5 expressed the thoughts I was about to say. Danke.

Man You are the kevin Eubanks to my Jay Leno. And I don't just say that because you are black

SS2k5, I'd certainly find that true, but Iran is likely acting out of own self interest too. Lowering the violence certainly made leaving Iraq more practical for the U.S. And once we leave, no country has more power in Iraq right now than Iran.

no everything is = kap: proper analogy: democrats labeling the Republicans the "Party of No" athomeboy: one would hope the Republicans would proof read your ad.

Republicans new term for the Democrat party of the U.S.: The Democrat Socialist Party!!!! Well, could've been worse, could've named them the National Socialist Party

IN YOUR FACE

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/12/world/as...tml?_r=1&hp thoughts?

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 11, 2009 -> 05:30 PM) I really wonder why no one has taken Daley down yet. So many people have bit the bullet for him, and yet no one has ratted him out yet. It's odd. A machine this embedded and thorough, I'd imagine that very little of what could be leaked would have any contact with Daley. And so you'd have to go through hundreds of sources to find a few who will talk, and then talk with their name attached. Beyond that, I imagine that the city would run up the tab on newspapers trying to get documents through open government laws - claiming the only person that can get it is this or that manager, and at so many hours of their time x salary. Then if it's ridiculous (see federal gov't charging WaPo millions for some documents) they still have to go through court, then legal fees, etc. It's unbelievable.

QUOTE (Texsox @ May 11, 2009 -> 12:26 AM) Graduation and cell phones going off everywhere, students on the floor messaging and calling, one person was talking all the way to just before the stage. pssh. I'm going to live tweet my graduation. Take that GRAMPS