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QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Nov 30, 2007 -> 02:01 AM) The Sox were willing to go 5 years for Hunter, but not for Rowand? That's absolutely ridiculous; Rowand's the better bet to age well and stay healthy over the duration of a 5 year deal, not Hunter. If that extra year keeps Rowand from signing, I'll be a bit upset. Look at the injury history. Age is the only advantage Rowand has over Hunter. I would give Rowand a 5 year deal.

QUOTE(29andPoplar @ Nov 29, 2007 -> 03:55 PM) Fine by me, although I am not entirely sure what this means so if you could PM me I would appreciate it. Posts 13 and 14 got it rolling and I found it interesting there was no response to post 20. Further let it be noted I have asked more than once for the poster in question to seek other posters to converse with, as I suspect there are hard feelings about me asking the poster in question to refrain from swearing in responses to me. Those requests have gone unheeded as can plainly be seen. There is a long running "discussion" between the "stats" people and the "scouting with my eyes" people. The stats people will back up their "discussions" with "facts" and say you can't be right. You have no proof except your eyes. It's just the way it is here. Take it for what it's worth but you will be bombarded with all sorts of acronyms to make sure your wrong. I fall in the middle but lean towards the scouting side because of my background.

QUOTE(G&T @ Nov 25, 2007 -> 02:48 PM) He's had sciatia since 2006. So technically that's not a back problem. It's a nerve problem. I knew there was something. Link to a site from 2006 sciatica is usually a back problem. The sciatic nerve is a combination of nerves from the lumbar and sacral spine which runs down the posterior part of the leg. Most often it's caused by a problem in the back such as a disc or stenosis. Sometimes it can be caused by a muscle impingement from the piriformis which is a muscle on your posterior hip. As I recall the sciatic problem was preventing him from completing the follow through without pain. This would indicate a back problem. I believe he has epidural injections in the lumbar spine to relieve the problem.

QUOTE(Lemon_44 @ Nov 24, 2007 -> 06:37 PM) I know there is a reason,but i can't remember what it is, so i'll ask? Why do the Sox/Reinsdorf refuse to deal with Boras clients in free agency. I know KW thought Boras used him in the Arod negotiations back when he signed with Texas but that can't be the only reason. I also seem to remember them having difficulty with Boras draft clients but that shouldn't be the be all,end all to not negotiate with his ML level free agents. I was just wondering if there is a specific incident or is it just an accumulation of past dealings where they won't talk to him anymore. I think it's a bad policy on the Sox part even though i can't stand Boras as well. You are taking yourslef out of the hunt for alot of the top players if you refuse to negotiate with him. I know Bobby Seay was one of the "loophole" players that were drafted and Boras got declared free agents. Also, Boras just as KW puts it "highly overvalues his clients" compared to the Sox view. Boras basically has lied to the teams about offers his clients get from other teams and has them bid against themselves ie. Rodriquez in Texas. The GMs cannot discuss whether or not someone did offer the contract because that would be collusion. His bluff was finally called with the latest Rodriguez contract. This is why many teams dislike dealing with him. I believe that KW went so far as to have someone in the organization negotiate the latest Crede deal to avoid arbitration.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Nov 21, 2007 -> 12:53 PM) Like 99% of the American population. If he was interested in a tradition of winning and a proven track record, he'd be in New York chatting with the Yankees. With Free Agency, absent of the money issues, we'd see every great player in the Bronx with pin stripes or LA soaking up the sun and speaking their native language. Maybe it has more to do with being in a city you and your family like and one that is affordable. I'm not sure if Hunter is a "city" or "country " person but if he doen't really care for living in big cities Chicago is a better option than LA or NYC. Face it, 14 mil a year will carry you a long way anywhere.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Nov 20, 2007 -> 03:46 PM) So, wait, Bourgeois is not on the 40 man so he's rule 5 eligibile...and now the 40 man is full so it's impossible for us to sign anyone without dropping a player first? I thought this was odd also. If the Hunter signing is imminent, why would they fill the 40 man. Either it's not imminent or there will need to be a trade for someone on it (Crede/Uribe) first. Doesn't sound like the Hunter deal is as close as some thought.

QUOTE(bschmaranz @ Nov 15, 2007 -> 04:20 PM) Summer Sanders blows them all out of the water One of the best assignments I've ever had was to massage Sommer before her event in Indy when she was there for the world championship. That was a very loooong and detailed massage!

QUOTE(fathom @ Nov 8, 2007 -> 07:27 PM) There's enough members of the media that despise Clemens that there's no way they could cover his name up. You don't think that whoever provided this information wouldn't tell someone in the media if all the names they mentioned besides Clemens are reported? I doubt you'll ever see his name linked to steriods, it would be similar to the NBA admitting Michael Jordan's hiatus was a "voluntary" retirement to spend time with his family.

QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Nov 8, 2007 -> 06:37 PM) Speaking of the conspiracy we talked about earlier: Roger Clemens retires. Say he isn't named, rightly or wrongly. Take the fact that Clemens has basically retired. A "plea bargain" perhaps? A coup d'tat? That was just something that came to mind as I thought about MLB covering up and then someone said, "Maybe Pettitte's named!" and then I said, "Clemens, hmm." 'Cause, you know, Pettitte and Clemens are homies. It's all speculation of course. This is the "big player" for whom MLB covered up a positive test, at least that's always been the scuttlebutt.

QUOTE(jphat007 @ Mar 27, 2007 -> 05:36 PM) This place often feels like a baseball prospectus "MLB" message board instead of a white sox fan site. I don't think there is anything wrong with being upset or something, but the vicious way that people on this site hate the players, manager, GM, team is a little out there. There are many times when I forget that I'm on a White Sox fan site. On my college message board, people get pissed at me because I'm pessimistic and negative. Go figure. 91 or so. But there could be a huge variation. COuld be 10 more or 10 less than that. It'll be interesting to watch, as long as I stay away from these boards as much as possible. i agree. Everyone has the right to be pessimistic of the team's performance due to the awful spring. But the hatred and viciousness targeted at indivduals KW, OG, GF ( hey, that's the opposite of Freddy Garcia maybe that's why KW traded for him to be the anti FG) is just out of control. It's not a site for white sox fans it's a site to hate the individuals that comprise the team. The enjoyment of the board is pretty much gone.

QUOTE(LVSoxFan @ Mar 26, 2007 -> 02:18 PM) FWIW, from whitesox.com "If you don't want to get hurt in baseball, I'll be sitting with you in the pressbox," said Guillen, who mentioned getting Hall at-bats and a little work at first base was discussed during the morning staff meeting. "The only way to keep him sharp is to play him every other day and find him some at-bats." "I love it over there," added Hall, who listed Sunday's injury as a subluxation, or partial dislocation, of his right shoulder. "I was anticipating a play like that anyways. I happened to land wrong." If the labrum was torn severe enough to have the shoulder sublux then it isn't a minor tear. I'm sure they will try rehab first to see if the shoulder muscles (rotator cuff) are sufficient enough for stabilization. Odds are that they won't be and he will miss about 3 months before he can start to throw. The advantage here is that he is not the starter. If he can rest and rehab betwwen starts depending on playing time, he may be able to tough it out.

My game worn jerseys are: Gray-Roberto Hernandez Black- warren Newson White-Wilson Alvarez Green-Chris Snopek

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Mar 23, 2007 -> 11:06 PM) It makes Philly look awful. I would assume there is a heavy amount of scouting that goes into most any trade, and this was a rather major one. Everyone and their mother knew Garcia lost a good amount of velocity off his stuff. To not have an MRI or even a physical done on the player in question is just irresponsible. i'm very surpirsed they didn't do a physical. However, not doing an MRI is routine if the pitcher has not had a history of arm trouble. An MRI will only find major things. Under surface tears and small things are rarely found with this. There is no reason to be suspicious of FG having arm trouble because he hasn't missed any starts despite the heavy work load the last two years. He may have been tired and worn out but no significant injuries.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Mar 23, 2007 -> 10:59 AM) At least based on the reports last year, Freddy developed that splitter about half way through the season. As you point out, his velocity drop started well before that, from mid 90's with Seattle to Low 90's in 05 with us to high 80's in the first part of 06. It might have something to do with it now, or he might have been working on the pitch before press reports claimed he was, but I think the timing argues against the splitter itself being the sole cause of his velocity drop. iwas thinking that maybe it was the source of the current shoulder trouble.

QUOTE(StatManDu @ Mar 23, 2007 -> 02:31 AM) The old park ... LaGrow ... Kenny Williams ... Julio Cruz ... what a day ... check out the whole thing plus a trivia question at www.whitesoxalmanac.com ... ENJOY! SOUTHSIDE HITMEN GET THEIR CLOSER 1977: General manager Roland Hemond pulled off a beauty of a deal when he acquired Lerrin LaGrow from the St. Louis Cardinals for Clay Carroll in a swap of right-handed relievers. LaGrow went on to have one of the best seasons ever by a Sox closer. The Phoenix native posted 25 saves, the third highest total in franchise history since the stat became official, while becoming an integral part of one of the most significant seasons in club history. Carroll, meanwhile, made his way back to the Sox for the end of the 1977 campaign after appearing in 51 games for the Cards. POURING OUT THE JUICE 1987: The White Sox released Julio Cruz, cutting ties with one of the sparkplugs of their 1983 American League Western Division title team. It was a great beginning but a sour end for the affable Cruz. The second baseman hit .251 and swiped 24 bases after being acquired from Seattle June 15, 1983. His acquisition is often pointed to as one of the main reasons why the 1983 Sox went on that second half tear and won the division going away. Following the season, the Sox signed Cruz to a six-year contract. That turnedout to be a colossal mistake. “The Juice” was never the same after the magical 1983 season. His release on this date concluded one of the most bittersweet careers in team annals. I've often wondered how this board would have reacted to the Cruz acqusition that year. "Hemond called Bernazard our heart and soul and now he trades fora player to replace him in the middle of the season." "There is no loyalty, he was my favorite player and the most fan freindly." Tony was a good players and oneof the best guys around the team at the time.

QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Mar 21, 2007 -> 11:46 PM) Believe me, if there's something wrong that's going to keep him down, and they feel he came over as damaged goods, they will inquire. I don't think the White Sox would be obligated. I saw him last year and figured something had to be wrong. I would imagine they examined him. If they did, they missed it, tough luck. If they didn't they were fools, tough luck again. his velocity has been down since 2004. Remember the discussion about him giving up velocity for control once he came to the Sox. Who knows if there was a problem or when it started. My friends tell me he's never complained of any problems. Another thought is about the splitter. The was a decent article in Baseball weekly discussing how pitchers who pick up the splitter or forkball later in their careers have a high incidence of shoulder injuries. The question is did the pitch cause the injury or was the career going down so they tried a new pitch which didn't help. If it is just bicep tendonitis, it should be easily remedied. However as another poster said, sometimes this can be an indication of a glenoiud labrum tear. The labrum is a ring which deepens the shoulder socket to increase the stability of the joint. Pitchers inherently have loose shoulders so it moves around more. This can cause a fraying of the labrum and cause a SLAP lesion. This means Superior Labrum Anterior to Posterior tear. The bicep tendon attaches to the superior portion of the labrum. So if the labrum frays or tears it may show up as a bicep tendon pain. A great story of this is injury John Elway. He got a SLAP lseion during the playoff game before the first Super Bowl he won. It was gettingin the way of the joint and he couldn't throw. Since you don't throw as much or need to be mechanically correct in football, the doctors decided to disconnect the bicep tendon. They took off the tendon from the labrum and attached it to the bone out of the way. After he played the Super bowl the doctors re-attched the tendon and he did the 6 months rehab after the game. He would have missed the Super Bowl to do rehab earlier. I've always thought Elway was annoying but this showed me that he was one tough SOB.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Mar 21, 2007 -> 06:42 AM) Ah the young pups... Anyways, it seems crazy to think that Kris is only 24. He might be an interesting candidate for a big time sleeper season, though usually it take another year for the arm to get back to full strength and capability. Even at 25, he still has a very nice shot at making something of himself. No kidding. How many remember when Doug Drabek was a Sox prospect?

QUOTE(Beltin @ Mar 18, 2007 -> 08:02 AM) Was the Bill Simas inning against Cleveland in 1996 (I think that was the season although it could have been 1997)? Sox again clinging to a 4-2 lead and were in the midst of winning like 22 out of 24 games or something to that effect? I seem to remember Simas coming up huge and striking out one or two of their most feared hitters. I could swear Mr. Thome was one of them as well. FWIW, I recall that as the greatest regular season Sox run I had witnessed since the second half of 1983. i remember that inning. It was when the Indians were playing well. It was in Cleveland I believe. The bases were loaded with no one out and he got out of it with no runs. That was amazing. Has to be up there with the best inning ever. Cleveland had a great offense at the time.

QUOTE(shoota @ Mar 16, 2007 -> 12:30 AM) It's acceptable for person X to error because persons Y and Z errored also? It's not an error because what the coach says goes. You from the outside looking in may disagree with him but a coach is in charge of the team, period. Players and fans do not run the team. If you don't do what the caoch expects you deserve to be in the doghouse.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Mar 15, 2007 -> 03:55 PM) David Riske would have been a class A free agent last year I'm told. All of those guys should be squarely in teh A category. Link. Thanks

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Mar 15, 2007 -> 02:05 PM) I'm just going to throw this out to everyone -- what do you believe wouldl happen if our record this season is -- as BP predicted -- 72 - 90? It'd just be interesting to me because I don't believe there's any question our payroll would drop. I'm not talking a substantial decrease, either. Just maybe 10-15 million. Not enough to cry poor, but enough to completely alter our offseason. Is Iguchi resigned? Is Ichiro pursued? I know the posts I've made concerning a run at Ichiro have assumed the payroll remains over 100 million. What about Crede? Hell, he may be traded even with a World Series victory. Iguchi may be re-signed depending on what other teams offer. No way we sign Ichiro. I don't see KW tying up 1/5 of the payroll to one player. As to your points in the previous post. I read some info about how the compensation picks changed with the new CBA. How will that effect players such as MB and JD vs. Iguchi?

QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Mar 15, 2007 -> 01:17 AM) and Thomas actually had to go through like a crazy treatment where I think they just made like a million microfractures in his foot and it healed up. I'm hoping ptact can help me on this one, as I recall him talking about in not that long ago. Thomas actually wasn't healthy and won't be. If you look at his numbers he either hits an HR or a single because he can't run. His doubles and runs scored are a fraction of what they should be due to inability to run. He has just modified his game to be one dimensional. Earlier he wasn't willing to do this and it was understandable. Luckily for him that one dimension is outstanding and will keep him in the game. As for his treatment there was alot of different interventions done to the navicular bone in his foot and it seems to have calmed down the pain enough that he can hit. Although pain killing injections can do wonders.

QUOTE(Soxbadger @ Mar 14, 2007 -> 02:17 PM) How long on this board was "Trade Jon Garland" every other topic because he was not even a worthwhile starter. Last I checked Floyd hasnt pitched in 1 meaningful game for the White Sox, so who cares about ST stats? Maybe he will be great, maybe he wont be. But to throw in the towel at this point is crazy. But....But... he sucked in Philly in 100 innings, so can't be good.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Mar 14, 2007 -> 01:28 PM) Because some of our fans give up on players so damn early and it's just a reminder of that fact that some players do indeed take time to develop. Thank You

QUOTE(Heads22 @ Mar 14, 2007 -> 01:24 PM) http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/press...sp&c_id=cws I was impressed with what I saw of Phillips. He will be in the majors. Maybe only as a 2nd lefty out of the pen but I think he will be better than that.