Milkman delivers

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ May 17, 2011 -> 03:57 PM) There is no need to bring up Dallas in the first place. That's the whole point. Make a move that actually helps your team. Subbing Dallas for Teahen does nothing since he'll be riding bench anyway. Bring up Dayan with the extra roster spot and have him play for Pierre. Why is this so hard for people to understand? God damn it, thank you! Like I said, though, I've just checked out on convincing anybody of anything. There's always going to be an excuse.

QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ May 17, 2011 -> 03:55 PM) No, I read the whole thread, thank you very little. You are mad that Viciedo has not been brought up yet to replace Pierre. You've made that abundantly clear and I think most people on this board would like to see that move made as well, sooner rather than later. However, where this thread has been somewhat confusing is the manifestation of outrage over Viciedo not replacing Teahen for the ten days that Teahen will be out. That move makes no sense at all, because unless Pierre is moved, Viciedo is not going to play, so it would be a waste of time for him to be up with the Sox sitting on the bench, when he could be playing every day for Charlotte. That seems pretty crystal clear to me. As for your prediction about Pierre's return to the lead-off spot, my gut says no, he won't, unless he has legitimately earned it. I think if he continues to scuffle and Tank continues to crush, the move we are all clamoring for will be made in the next couple of weeks. Just a gut feeling on that one, is all. I've responded to every single point you made in this. Whatever, I really have checked out on caring about what this team does and caring about getting everyone to see my points. Everyone can enjoy making excuses the rest of the season, as there will be plenty of things to make excuses for.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ May 17, 2011 -> 03:53 PM) Still don't see the relationship. Its not like Dallas and Dayan would be sharing a ride up to Chicago or something. The roster moves have no depedency on each other. Because we had an open opportunity to get Viciedo onto the major league club today and it would have avoided the awkwardness between Pierre and Ozzie that so obviously is affecting the decision to call him up. We could have called up a player that could directly help the team immediately, but they called up a useless retread.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ May 17, 2011 -> 03:41 PM) I see the same opportunity, I just think its unrelated. Dallas subbing for Teahen makes perfect sense to me. So does getting rid of Pierre and replacing with Viciedo. And considering the fact that we have absolutely no time to waste to improve this team and get back into the race, the move to improve the club should be made as soon as possible. That move could've been made today with a necessary call-up. We don't have the time to screw around like we are.

QUOTE (bmags @ May 17, 2011 -> 03:21 PM) milkman just got facial'd Did I leave my camera on again? f***...

QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ May 17, 2011 -> 03:16 PM) When we all woke up this morning, there were not one but two separate and distinct moves that needed to be made by this team: 1.) Replace the injured back-up third baseman Teahen for ten days 2.) Replace the poorly playing left fielder Pierre for good The first was fairly simple, replacing Teahen with McPherson, and then in ten days, McPherson disappears and Teahen resumes doing whatever it is he actually does for the Sox. The second, given some of the things we've been reading about today (i.e. Guillen thinking of moving Pierre down to the 9th slot in the order), would seem to be at least out there on the not-so-distant horizon. But the two moves are not nearly as related as people seem to be making them out to be. First of all, I don't think people are even reading the entire thread before they're throwing their two cents in. Secondly, in regards to the bold part, Ozzie will only move Pierre to the 9th spot for a couple of days. He will then declare that Pierre has earned the leadoff spot again (which he will not have done), and things will be back to normal. This isn't new.

QUOTE (cws0591 @ May 17, 2011 -> 03:03 PM) but he is not fired and you should then no that Kenny will respect Ozzies wishes. so then what i say to you is if you hate everything about this team why do you post on a message board that was created to support it. DONT WATCH Thanks for your input. Your intelligent arguments and perfect grammar have persuaded me that you are a genius and that I should listen to you.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ May 17, 2011 -> 02:53 PM) I agree that, at this point, its time to walk away from Pierre, call up Viciedo for OF. But that is not what we are talking about here - we are talking about what to do with Teahen's slot for 10 days, which is pretty much unrelated to Pierre/Viciedo. Do you get upset about McPherson being there but Pena not being released? No, you just get frurstrated with Pena not being released period. I'm upset about both of those things. I'd like to see all of the correct moves made. And you're simplifying it by saying that this is just about somebody taking Teahen's spot for 10 days. I don't see it that way. As I said, I would like to see this as the chance to get Viciedo onto the major league team in order to begin his replacement of Pierre. I guess I see this as a much larger opportunity than you do. For you and others, it seems to be just a little blip on the radar. For me, it was the golden opportunity to bring up our most talented minor league hitter to replace the major league's worst player.

QUOTE (cws0591 @ May 17, 2011 -> 02:52 PM) So you would all prefer Kenny to bring up Viciedo to get a couple at bats a week(stunting his growth) just to let Ozzie know he is making the wrong moves? That is idiotic if you ask me. If any of you expected that to happen then idk what to tell you. If Kenny wanted 2 do that he could have just fired Ozzie. So then that leads me to why the f*** did you see this happening any other way? BTW i think that this was the correct move considering both the atbat opportunities and the fact that Ozzie has not given up on Pierre. Im sick of people knowing what is going to happen and still are angry about it... Ah yes, as long as we know they'll make bad moves, we should never find ourselves becoming upset at them. You were on the right path when you talked about firing Ozzie.

I never got the love for How I Met Your Mother. In the episodes I've seen, I didn't find it funny at all. With the added problem of them constantly teasing who the mom is but never revealing it and dragging it on forever, I don't know how people deal with it.

There is a simple answer to all of this. Players should only be paid at the end of each season and exactly according to how they produced. Ahh, in a perfect world...

QUOTE (Jake @ May 17, 2011 -> 02:44 PM) The one unknown here is whether Dayan is playing outfield well below major league standard. We can't play him if he can't play defense. We already have a starter doing that in LF

QUOTE (onedude @ May 17, 2011 -> 02:40 PM) I see how it's an incorrect move. Pierre should be replacing Marks spot on the bench, and Viciedo should be replacing Pierres spot in the OF.....Then Dallas can replace Pierre's spot on the bench. Yes, thank you...although I think that still leaves too many guys on the major league team. Dallas shouldn't be involved at all.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ May 17, 2011 -> 02:38 PM) This thread is LOLeriffic. Seriously... the Sox are calling a guy up who might, maybe, start once or twice over a 10 game span, and then Teahen is back. And you want a guy who plays multiple positions comfortably. Do people here really think it would be a good idea to call up Viciedo - who has a hot hand with the bat right now - take him out of his rhythm to sit on the bench for 10 days so that he can get 5 at bats, playing positions he doesn't play well? This thread is right up there near the top of SoxTalk overreactions. If Viciedo comes up, it should be to replace Pierre. This call up calls for a veteran scrub sub, which Viciedo is not. This was the only intelligent move to make. No, because this move should bring Viciedo to the starting lineup to replace Pierre. But because Ozzie refuses to do the correct thing, everyone else is an idiot because they want Viciedo up. I don't understand what you guys don't get. I see your points. Viciedo shouldn't be called up because he'd just ride the bench. That much is clear and it's been said a thousand times in 5 pages of this thread. We're (I'm) upset because the fact that Viciedo would ride the bench is the incorrect move.

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ May 17, 2011 -> 01:39 PM) Doesn't Kenny decide who's on the ML roster? It's on Ozzie for starting these scrubs. I think Ozzie has a pretty good say in in, though. I feel like it goes something like this: Ozzie says he will not play ____, so don't even put him on the roster. Ozzie says that ____ needs to be on the team or else he will do ____ (probably throw a s***-fit to the press and threaten to quit which then gets the option years of his contract assured). KW seemingly has no choice but to give him ____ player in response. In the end, it's on both of them. Ozzie for demanding certain players and KW for giving them to him and not just firing his ass.

QUOTE (Cali @ May 17, 2011 -> 02:30 PM) Okay, we can all agree Pierre sucks and should be benched/cut/released/left in the middle of nowhere We can also agree that it's NOT going to happen. We all agree Viciedo should be playing LF for the Sox right now. So why are we surprised he was not called up? Regardless of the situation? (which I maintain has nothing to do with Viciedo, but I not gonna try and convince you guys otherwise) It's not surprise as much as it is frustration. Constant incorrect moves being made by both the front office and the managerial staff.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ May 17, 2011 -> 02:25 PM) It's ok to be mad about that. But it's kind of pointless to project that anger towards the promotion when it really is two separate issues. That's my main problem. DV is on a roll right now. Hitting the ball for power, average and currently actually taking occasional walks. If you agree Ozzie would just sit him, you're saying you would still want him here anyways? I wouldn't. He needs to be playing every day somewhere and know he's playing every day. If he assumes the Teahen platoon role, for example, I feel he may press to try and make an impact which could also force him out of what has appeared to be a new sense of plate discipline as well. It's symptomatic of the entire problem that Ozzie is causing.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ May 17, 2011 -> 02:19 PM) No, it wasn't. The perfect opportunity would be if Pierre were hitting the DL. A bench player who sees 6-8 at bats a week is not ideal. He's absolutely the best bat in the minors but are you really naive enough to think that's actually how that would play out? Yes, Ozzie might give him 2-3 starts (out of 9 or 10) but then he'd be gone. He played well last year and still barely played. He would not be used appropriately. I have no doubt about that. And it would do him no good to play infrequently up here. Ozzie is going to continue to give Pierre the benefit of the doubt. If Dayan replaces anyone, it will be him or if one of PK/CQ/Dunn hits the DL. He will not be called up to play a backup or platoon role. And frankly, he shouldn't be. No, I know that's not how it would play out. f***, I just said that. I'm saying that this is now reflecting badly on both KW and Ozzie. Ozzie won't play Viciedo because of his love affair, or whatever it is, with Pierre. Now the correct move would be to bring up Viciedo to take AB's away from Pierre, plain and simple. KW then reinforces Ozzie's refusal to make the correct call by passing up on Viciedo to promote McPherson instead. Yes, I understand that Viciedo would just sit on the bench, but I'm not going to be happy that they passed on Viciedo because of that incorrect decision. You're saying that we shouldn't be mad that a "reasonable" call was made in response to a wrong call. It still all goes back to the original wrong call of having Pierre continue to get AB's when Viciedo is right there ready and waiting to alleviate this team's problems.

QUOTE (JohnCangelosi @ May 17, 2011 -> 02:18 PM) I think actually he was talking about me, lol Well, they were all lumped together as rants

QUOTE (Cali @ May 17, 2011 -> 02:16 PM) It's gonna be really messed up when Ozzie benches Pierre and starts McPherson for some reason. Just to stick it to us. The reactions are hilarious though. Not benching/releasing Pierre is it's own separate problem from Teahen's injury, and to think otherwise you're just forcing yourself to be mad. They need a bench player Viciedo is a starter and also, NOT a 3rd Baseman anymore. Also, McPherson is white, so you know he wont be getting many AB's haha. Seriously though, he wont break double digits in AB's before Teahen is back up. They've already got two options at 3B in Vizquel and Morel. It's not a separate issue. The most deserving candidate to be called up was passed over. This still has something to do with Pierre, regardless of whether people will admit it or not.

QUOTE (JohnCangelosi @ May 17, 2011 -> 02:12 PM) Everyone is just thinking so logically here. Since Teahen plays 3B sometimes then we need to replace him with a 3B, NO MATTER WHAT RIGHT? NONSENSE. We had other options. We made the wrong decision, again. Exactly. I can't believe you don't understand this.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 17, 2011 -> 02:07 PM) This has nothing to do with Juan Pierre unless Pierre can play 3b. In fact it probably makes the Pierre thing more ensconced since Teahen was one of our backup OF's and now he's unavailable. I don't get you people anymore. Ozzie and KW could piss in some of your faces and you'd excuse them.

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ May 17, 2011 -> 01:56 PM) No he wasn't. Dayan is no longer a 3B. I don't get why people aren't getting this. This was a temporary move to replace a bench player. Dayan is not in our plans to ride the bench. And he shouldn't be. So since Ozzie refuses to make the correct move by benching Pierre and playing Viciedo in his place, it isn't OK to be angry about the correct player not getting the promotion? Yes, I understand that Ozzie would just sit him. But now this is on KW, too. If Ozzie makes the incorrect moves, but KW reinforces those incorrect moves by refusing to make the right call-up, then they both need to go.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 17, 2011 -> 01:55 PM) I'm not a big fan of the move, but I didn't even catch that three of the rants were from the same person. Come on, rant? My post was not even close to a rant. Jesus Christ, guys. The slightest big of negativity and the person is a raving lunatic now?

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ May 17, 2011 -> 01:49 PM) I expected some ridiculous responses when I opened this thread but was surprised to see where some of them were coming from. Teahen is going to be back in 10 days. Teahen backs up at 3B and 1B. Morel and Vizquel are going to be getting probably at least 8 of the next 10 starts at 3B. THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH VICIEDO. The Viciedo argument would be to replace Pierre, which I'm not going to even attempt to argue would be wrong, but this is a completely separate move. Getting mad over this is ridiculous. Calling up Dayan to sit the bench and get 10 at bats would have been pointless. Ugh, I don't even know what the point is anymore. People will make excuses for this organization until they die. This was the perfect opportunity to get Viciedo onto the major league club, absolutely perfect. You could bring him up, as he's the best hitter available in the minors and then you could give him a few starts in LF to "rest" Juan. Ideally, he hits well and permanently takes Pierre's job away and it doesn't look like a slap to Pierre's face (because that is obviously a dilemma for Ozzie). Nope, Dallas McPherson Whatever though, this will just make the team worse and will hopefully hasten Ozzie's departure.