Dick Allen

QUOTE (iamshack @ Feb 8, 2012 -> 09:02 AM) You know, if you're just negative about everything, it's much easier, since you only have to admit you're wrong when things are going well. Must be nice. Additionally, I'd love to hear the s*** you'd say if you always had to comment to the press about things outside of your control. You'd be made to sound the fool or phony if I bothered to put together your greatest hits from soxtalk over the years as well. Put them together. I've always been consistent. Why wouldn't he talk to White Sox fans at Soxfest? If he's available when things are so rosy, why isn't he available when things aren't so rosy? I'm not negative about everything, in fact, I'm far more postive about many Sox things than many people here. I don't like KW, that's true, but I don't knock his every move, in fact I have given him praise sometimes. I don't like reading Cowley slamming him every chance he gets with the same thing, but KW is a phony, and he's had a long run.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 8, 2012 -> 08:42 AM) Aka, it doesn't fit the agenda. Just read the quote at the bottom of your posts and tell me who KW is answering to? He dodges the press, Paul Sullivan even commented on that, and he covers the Cubs. He dodges fans at Soxfest. He only did one seminar on Friday., and ran away from anyone who didn't want to pay $500. If the Sox win, he's there everyday taking compliments like its nobody's business, giving some false modesty. He should concentrate on Market, I've never been there, but I heard its pretty good, regardless of what Oney thinks. (I think Oney was mad he was given a bill) Let Hahn take over now. He'll always have his ring and will get his due for it. Its time to move on. Ozzie acted like a child and needed to go. KW didn't act much better.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 8, 2012 -> 08:27 AM) If by "making excuses", you mean "offering to resign", then yes. He never offered to resign. He offered to take a lesser role, and I imagine the way his contract is set up, it doesn't mean taking a paycut. He knew JR would say no. He's a phony that way. He also said last year if his bump in payroll didn't result in more wins and higher attendance, his employment was on the line. All false, soundbite garbage that he knows isn't true. Just like you finally came around and realized Ozzie really wasn't the baseball God you assumed for years, you will realize someday that even Joe Cowley isn't totally wrong about KW. He's not objective or fair, but he's not totally wrong about this particular subject. There is a lot of phoniness with KW. A lot.

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ Feb 7, 2012 -> 05:59 PM) Unless Soler signs before Cespedes, he will get more than $20 million. I'm thinking you are correct. If Cespedes gets anything near $50 million, I'm thinking Soler gets around $30 million. Considering the Sox owe Rios $38.5 million, those prices are staggering IMO. Even if the Sox miss on both, I hope their figures are much smaller. Giving these guys all that money just gives guys like Boras more ammo.

The Bullpen Gospels by Dirk Hayhurst. Its really good.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Feb 7, 2012 -> 03:39 PM) I can't believe people are dissecting this argument about 50's vs 00's. The main point seemed obvious - the idea that KW needs to make up for a bad DECADE is ridiculous on its face. His decade of baseball resulted in a championship and either 1 or 2 more division wins, depending on how you slice it up, no to mention only one season worse than 4 games under .500. He's had either the best decade for the Sox in 50-60 years, or 90 years. Take whichever you'd like. Point is, KW has had 2-3 bad seasons and some bad trades, not a bad decade. Tbe White Sox haven't historically been tbe gold standard in regards to winning. Thank God for the Cubs or they would be in the photo for the poster child of the opposite. KW won a WS so having a bad decade is wrong. It is time though to put to rest that stringing together 82 to 88 win seasons and not making tbe playoffs the way the divisions are now set up is a success. KW is making excuses now.Read the quote at the bottom of ss2k5s posts then read his quotes at the end of last season patting himself on the back for building teams that spend time during the season in first place. Its time KW leave.

QUOTE (pittshoganerkoff @ Feb 7, 2012 -> 02:58 PM) It's simultaneously easy and hard to forget 2005. I still remember watching that last out and thinking, "No f***ing way." But I also remember, unfortunately, 2006 and 2011. The thing the Sox did right during the 2005 season was beat up on the AL Central. They were 30 over .500 vs the divison 6 over vs. the NL and were .500 against the AL East and AL West. They have to get back to beating up their Central Division foes.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 7, 2012 -> 01:54 PM) The 2000's didn't exactly end well either, and it included a World Series win while leading all of baseball in wins. Even if you want to argue the 60's that is five decades ago. That still leaves plenty of room to give credit to the teams success, and not to label it as some sort of a wasted decade. I never said it was wasted. The last half was a waste of a huge opportunity, and its a lot different today. The White Sox have had some advantages they didn't have in the 60s, 70s, 80s.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 7, 2012 -> 01:42 PM) Both the 50's and 60's came in under the 00's in terms of winning percentages. I think the 50s were higher than the 2000s

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 7, 2012 -> 01:42 PM) Both the 50's and 60's came in under the 00's in terms of winning percentages. The 60s ended badly. If there were divisions, chances are there would have been a few playoff appearances during that 17 year streak, and maybe a championship or 2. For the 2000 decade, they have had the advantage of playing an unbalanced AL Central schedule.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 7, 2012 -> 01:31 PM) You have to go back nine decades to get a better winning percentage over a ten year period. From 1951-1967 there was 17 straight years of above .500 ball, with several years with 90 wins and others that were on at least a 90 pace if they played 162.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 7, 2012 -> 01:21 PM) The irony is that is coming from someone named "Oldsox". Apparently not old enough to remember decades like the 60's/70's/80's or 90's, where we made two total playoff appearances and had zero world series appearances. In fairness, it used to be a lot harder to make the playoffs.

QUOTE (Andrew @ Feb 7, 2012 -> 07:30 AM) No scoop, and no.... obviously am not and never have been present in the clubhouse. But I have been to the games and an avid follower of the team and am plenty qualified to discuss the product/result on the field. For a guy who has arguably been the best and most consistent hitter over the last 5 seasons (at least), I've not seen his "skills" translate to too many younger guys (or even acquired established guys). And I sure can't point to him as any type of inspirational type guy either, who helps keeps his teammates upbeat, focused, and performing as consistently "as him" despite the circus of mgmt and coaching and nepotistic douchebaggery surrounding them.... While Konerko has performed well, there's no arguing that the team has been pretty damn flat for 5 seasons. I mean - If Konerko is the Tony Robbins of the White Sox, then I'm their Ronnie Woo Woo. Or maybe Jeter has played for the Yankees his entire career - an organization with the $ to keep their rosters packed with veterans along with their coaching, staffing, and management positions; all holding themselves to a level of professionalism that is light years beyond the Sox to the degree that it's a steadfast tradition ACTIVELY DEMANDED by owernship over decades. But yeah, Konerko is slow so like....that's why Gordon Beckham spells "f**" in the dirt during games and can't hit his weight. Why is it your opinion Carl Everett was Tony Robbins in 2005? Wasn't Konerko on the team then? Wasn't he MVP of the ALCS? Couldn't he have been MVP of the WS? Why didn't Carl ever win any more WS rings? And now its on Konerko if players can't play in the big leagues?

QUOTE (YASNY @ Feb 7, 2012 -> 10:36 AM) If the BOD gave JR carte blanche, it's because they trust him to make wise decisions based on his accumen as a businessman. And in that regard, he has done so consistently. If you love at the Sox from 68 through the 70's, until JR and EE bought the Sox and then what's happened since that purchase, to say nothing of the Bulls, then you should be a big fan of JR> From all appearances, JR does listen to his partners and does probably operate using a consensus. I'm just pointing out that if JR wanted to veer off course, he'd get his way.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 7, 2012 -> 07:55 AM) That doesn't even make sense. If there wasn't a majority vote, it doesn't matter what was said. There was no action taken. Maybe Jerry changed minds, but he didn't prevent the board from making a sale. Those are vastly different things. It was from Lee Stern who actually is a board member. If you really don't believe BODs give the chairman carte blanche check out my former employer MF Global.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 6, 2012 -> 03:17 PM) He actually said a majority of the board voted to sell the team? Never said majority, he either said several or many or a few, but he did say, Jerry said no, so it was no. It certainly didn't seem like it was brought to the BOD, which, BTW, Jerry handpicked. And if it was Stern only mentioned Jerry's veto as the only thing that really mattered. If the investors want to sell their shares and get out, I don't think it would be difficult to do.

QUOTE (South Side Fireworks Man @ Feb 6, 2012 -> 04:40 PM) No, you're not crazy. Sox haven't had a real "leader" since Carl, but AJ and Buehrle were probably the closest they've had to a "leader" since. Paulie is a good role model however, but I don't think he ever really wanted the role or title of "Captain" anyway. Carl Everett? The guy who gets suspended for being an asshole? The guy who gets arrested for threatening to kill his wife? He's a leader? Great leaders aren't traded 6 times. Just because Konerko isn't an in your face, rah, rah kind of guy doesn't make him a poor leader. Some people don't need to say a lot to be effective. Some people talk and scream all day without really saying a thing.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Feb 6, 2012 -> 03:00 PM) No he can't. He is the managing partner. He runs the day to day operations but the board needs to agree with the large issues. The example of selling the team wasn't the fact that JR said no so it wasn't going to happen. It was that some not all of the members wanted to sell and JR was one of the ones who wanted to keep it and his group of voters were the majority. You can make the case that the majority of the voters may agree with him and he runs it like Daley ran ran the city council but this only happens as long as he has the majority of the voters on his side. He cannot override a vote of the board. Do you have a copy of their bylaws? I'm just relaying what a partner went on the record with.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Feb 6, 2012 -> 02:29 PM) It is also an utterly pointless battle. DA has shown for years that, on anything regarding Jerry Reisndorff, he is not going to deal in reality. JR is king of his Sox world, omnipotent and cheap. Cheap shot, incorrect, and for the record, I like JR, and have only called him cheap one time when he had his boys cry poor and raised ticket prices while lowering payroll in 2009 awhile holding season ticketholder non refundable playoff money. He eventually "found" some money that year for Peavy and Rios. Seems they weren't tapped like we were lead to believe. Other than that, I've actually defended him more often than not.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 6, 2012 -> 01:48 PM) So are we still talking about in the 80's here, or in recent times? I was under the impression it was between the strike and the early 2000s. Before the WS win.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 6, 2012 -> 01:41 PM) I have never seen or heard that before. Have any kind of proof? Lee Stern was on Chicago Tribune Live about a year ago, and they were talking Sox and Bulls. Apparently JR offered Stern as big of percentage of the Bulls as he wanted, but he passed or took a very small percentage, I can't remember which, but Stern is now kicking himself for that decision. He also talked about many Sox partners thinking selling was a good option but JR said no, so no it was.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 6, 2012 -> 01:36 PM) Yes it does. The board still has rights, but in the position of a majority shareholder, he would be able to make policy for his organization without input from the board and would be able to override their decisions. This is not the case. He can override any board request, and has on several occassions, some being correct and some not working out so well. Truth be told, although JR does listen to his partners, they, at least according to Stern, have no "rights" . His is the final decision, and its worked out well for all of them.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 6, 2012 -> 01:31 PM) Remember though, if the Chairman is not a majority shareholder, That doesn't matter. He put the group together with the power to make the decisions. If he didn't have that power, he wouldn't have put the group together, or would have put together a different group to give him the power. There isn't one shareholder who would even considering trying to force JR out. In fact the majority of shareholders have wanted to sell the team over the years, but JR said no.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 6, 2012 -> 01:25 PM) This franchise is worth what, maybe $400-$500 million, and takes in enough revenue to be profitable with about a $100 million payroll. A sudden loss of $150 million 1 year would require ballooning the team's debt from about 10% of team value to about 40% of team value in 1 year. Financially that wouldn't be totally catastrophic, teams do survive with higher debt loads than that, but that dramatic of an erosion of financial position would be more than enough reason for the remaining members to act to remove him. 2-3 years of those kind of losses would put the team in bankruptcy. As I stated, I was exaggerating to make a point. In the end, its JR's call what the payroll will be.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Feb 6, 2012 -> 01:23 PM) at that point he would have generated about a $125ish million cash call. I'd say he'd be voted out, and agree with Balta. That should tell you something right there. I doubt it would be that high, but JR's partners have been hit with cash calls in the mid to late 80s and there were nothing done. I even wonder if something could be done unless they could prove he has some diminished mental capabilities. JR put the entire deal together, and while at first he owned at most 10% of the team, its been floated that his percentage has increased significantly over the years. I do think the Fannings own the biggest piece. At least they did.