Dick Allen

QUOTE (WCSox @ Jun 5, 2010 -> 10:50 AM) There's a ridiculous amount of misplaced anger on this board. When Peavy, Floyd, Jenks, AJ, and Alexei all play like crap, it's Teahen, Pierre, Ozzie, and Kenny's fault. That said, I agree that Ozzie and most of the coaching staff probably need to go. And it's not because they're incompetent (Ozzie's lineups notwithstanding). It's a combination of the fact that (1) the players aren't listening to them anymore and (2) they're not bringing much to the table anyway (Coop is the obvious exception). Ozzie does not manage/motivate players like Tony LaRussa. Walker doesn't develop hitters like Charlie Manuel. I'm not a fly on the wall in the Sox clubhouse, but it's not much of a stretch to imagine that the culture isn't about winning right now. With the way that these guys sleepwalked through last August and September, it's difficult to imagine that there's a sense of urgency to win. These guys are just showing up to collect a paycheck. And I agree that the easiest way to change that culture is to bring in a new coaching staff. It also means cutting the dead weight: veterans that aren't performing anymore. We saw it last year with JD and we'll see it again this year with AJ and Jenks, for starters. BTW, Ozzie is not "giving Kotsay and Vizquel all those ABs" because those are the players that Ozzie wants. Those are the players that Kenny could afford this year whose skills happen to reflect the type of player that Ozzie likes. Otherwise, he'd be giving those at-bats to Damon or Matsui. How is Cooper the obvious exception? His charges have underperformed more than anyone. I don't think firing coaches or firing Ozzie and making Joey Cora the manager which is 99% likely if Ozzie ever left in the middle of a season is going to make 1 iota of a difference. Maybe making a trade or truly burying a non performer on the bench might change things. Its worth a try. I'm pretty sick of seeing Kotsay in the 5 hole.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jun 5, 2010 -> 10:01 AM) But the fact is he has performed very well much more often than not. He is a two-time All-Star and should make it three-time this year. He has all the tools, all the skills, to be a fantastic player for the next 3-4 years, while he is in the prime of his career. The biggest challenge for him was to shake himself out of his extended funk and put in the work (which was another alleged problem of his) to get his career back on track. I think the odds of him performing up to and exceeding the terms of his contract are very good. He is the least of my worries. What really worries me is Jake's contract. Everything you say about Rios, you can say about Jake Peavy. He has performed very well more often than not. He's a 2 time all star, and a Cy Young award winner. He has all the tools and stills to be a fantastic player and is in the prime of his career. Why can't he shake himself out of his extended funk and get his career back on track? Its only been 8 or 9 bad starts, if that.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jun 5, 2010 -> 09:36 AM) Oh I agree with you there....I do place some blame on Ozzie...but come on...this team isn't failing because of the players he wanted...how can you have watched this pitching staff and honestly believe that? Steve Stone said it perfectly last night...when your starting pitching is putting up an ERA north of 5.20, it is nearly impossible to go on an extended winning streak. I don't care who Ozzie would have wanted, unless he would have said "Trade Mark, Gavin and Jake and get me Fister, Silva, and bring that Ely kid up," there is simply no way he could have anticipated the starting pitching being this damn bad. And I'm still waiting for the first Fire Don Cooper thread. Garcia has been better than anyone could have expected. Danks has been about what could be expected. Floyd's struggles in April and May are nothing new. Buehrle struggling perhaps is something new but he's had a lot of stretches like this during his career. Peavy is really the only one anyone should be shocked with. Its obvious he wasn't going to be able to continue the dominance he had at the end of last year, but he has been pretty bad. KW also didn't do any favors for the pitching staff refusing to upgrade the defense significantly. If Andruw Jones is healthy enough to play, he should be in the OF for either Pierre or Quentin every one of his starts. He's not an everyday player, but he's significantly better defensively than either. I think the Sox actually caught a break, no pun intended with Teahen getting hurt. It will improve the defense. There aren't many teams in the history of the game with great pitching and poor defense. Mediocre pitching becomes good pitching with good defense. Excellent pitching becomes mediocre pitching with bad defense. Not to blame the entire struggle of the pitching staff on the defense, you can't line guys up 10 rows in the bleachers. This team is stuck in between. They want to build around pitching but lack the defensive prowess. They want to build the offense around speed, but lack the on base ability across the board. Personally, I don't think KW was sold on this plan, and I think Ozzie got a little more of JR's ear due to last season. I know for a fact JR was pissed how it turned out.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jun 5, 2010 -> 09:33 AM) I noticed there is no mention of Alex Rios in your post. DA, we're all frustrated....and there is LOTS of blame to go around...perhaps Kenny should have told Ozzie to shut his mouth and signed Johnny Damon or Nick Johnson or something. But apart from some other blockbuster move, I can't see ANYTHING KW could have done to have prevented this suckitude. Bottom line is, if you're veteran starting pitching sucks, you're going to suck. There is nothing else to it. Say best case we would have kept Gordon at 3rd, signed Kelly Johnson to play second, signed Johnny Damon to play left...I mean, would we really be in much different of a position than we are now? I just don't see it...maybe we are 3-4 games better? I blame the players and I blame Ozzie a bit for meddling in the roster decisions... I dunno, maybe I will always just be a Kenny apologist...I love his aggressive nature and I generally see eye-to-eye with him. But I like this roster. This roster is good enough to win. The core players we were counting on just aren't performing worth a damn. Rios has been great, but he's signed for a long time. If he can keep it up, I was very wrong, he's a bargain. On the other hand, if he doesn't who knows. He could be the offensive equivalent to Javy Vazquez for all we know. But even his biggest admirers didn't see him doing this well, same with Konerko.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jun 5, 2010 -> 09:12 AM) I think a lot of the moves you're criticizing is a result of the players not performing. When the players suck, he's forced to try all sorts of things to ferret out some level of success. The different lineups, trying to let his pitchers work out of their funks, trying ill-fated hit and runs, etc....these are a result of him trying to make something happen. When the players perform well, you don't have to do a whole lot as a baseball manager. He was given the team he wanted.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jun 5, 2010 -> 08:12 AM) I agree with WC....why are you so damn quick to blame the coaches and FO, when it's the players who are the ones not performing? All I heard you rag on Kenny about was Alex Rios, and how claiming him on waivers was an accident and a mistake and prohibited us from getting other FAs. Meanwhile, the guy has been one of the best players in ALL of baseball for the first 60 games and you're going to blame this on Kenny. Of course. You also said Peavy was Kenny's best deal ever. Not many, if anyone, predicted Jake could be this bad. But KW should be embarrassed. Right. That's just hypocrisy. The problem with this team is the veterans are not performing. The problem is not Juan Pierre, or Alex Rios, or Jake Peavy, or Andruw Jones, or Omar Vizquel, or Mark Kotsay, or even Mark Teahan. The problem is Mark, Gavin, Jake, Carlos, AJ, and Gordon. And if you foresaw those guys all sucking, well kudos to you. You are a better GM than KW and have a better eye than Ozzie. Then you can say they should be embarrassed. But I don't remember seeing anyone on this board say our problem would be starting pitching and a lack of offense from our core hitters. I stick up for Greg Walker more than any other poster on any board in existence. All you have to do is look at the Cubs under Rudy Jaramillo everyone's guru and notice the Cubs have scored fewer runs than the White Sox to realize the players are what makes the difference. I'm blaming KW, JR and OG because they are responsible for this awful roster. Its awful. I don't blame them for Peavy, I still think its KW's greatest trade, and I think eventually he'll come around. I also think Beckham will be just fine. It may take a while, but he'll be back. Pierre, Teahen, Kotsay, Jones, you don't win with those guys in your line up at this stage of their careers. Buehrle is going to have some struggles every year. It should be no shock. Danks has been down recently but overall he's about what you could have figured. Garcia has been about as good as you could expect. Its well documented how I don't like Gavin Floyd, but he struggled up to this point last year about as much as he did this year and no one seemed to blink an eye. That said, I will agree even the most pessimistic wouldn't have thought the starting pitching would be this bad, I believe last in the AL in ERA, but there were more than a few posters who realized the offense was short even if Quentin was hitting and Beckham was hitting. But, KW didn't do his pitching staff any favors with Teahen at 3B, and even though he makes some spectacular plays, and baseball IQ-challenged SS in Alexei Ramirez. Quentin RF despite a nice catch the other night isn't exactly head and shoulders above Dye defensively. Hawk and Stone were praising Pierre's defense last night, I can't remember if it was before or after Hawk saying how Ron Kittle made himself a good defensive LF, and then Juan lets a foul ball drop. Pierre though has had his moments when he's made some nice plays. He's better than Pods in LF, but I don't know why he'd play LF and Jones DH. The other thing is, when you have won consecutive games only 4 times on June 5th, you need to make changes somewhere. Pierre gets dumped as a leadoff man for a game or 2. Jenks loses the closer role for 24 hours. No one really is being held accountable. Its just waiting and waiting, and the "I believe in the talent" speech KW could have taped and used for several years. Something has to be done. I'm not calling for OG or KW to be fired, (although if the walked away, I don't think it would exactly hurt the White Sox) I'm calling on them to take action and do something about this boring team. At least try something different. If it doesn't work, so be it. The current formula isn't going to work.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jun 4, 2010 -> 10:47 PM) 2 straight AWFUL offseasons. The Swisher trade to the Yankees was awful, and the Javy trade to the Braves has the potential to be a huge miss. 1/3 of the way through the season and one 3 game winning streak, and only a couple 2 game winning streaks, and there are still people thinking remaining status quo can still result in a successful season? KW, OG and JR should be embarrassed.

The Cubs have scored fewer runs than the White Sox this season. I thought Rudy Jaramillo makes everyone hit .300 with a 1.000 OPS.

This team won 3 games in a row once this season when they swept Seattle. Its a bad team. KW had an awful offseason.

I have heard Ozzie is on thinner ice than people might think, but I still think its pretty thick.

Hawk crying about the umpire. Yeah Hawk the team just can't get over the hump and get themselves a 2 or 3 game winning streak. Great team KW.

Can someone explain to me how Omar Vizquel passes Luis Aparicio in hits by a SS when he gets a hit while playing 2B or 3B?

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jun 4, 2010 -> 09:46 PM) I can't fathom how they would hold onto AJ now. KW could without being fully insane have said "well, we've got a lot of home games coming up, let's see how they go before pulling the trigger, we have that week or so". We've lost 3 of the first 4. With Flowers struggling as badly as he is, it wouldn't shock me if AJ is signed to an one or 2 year extension.

I love Hawk, but a couple things he said tonight have me more than baffled. He said Ron Kittle made himself in to a good LF. I don't know how many on here saw Ron Kittle play defense, but good was never in the area code when describing it. He also seemed shocked at the low attendance figure from tonight. BTW, the Cubs scored 1 run tonight. Rudy Jaramillo has really turned that offense around.

You are playing an awful Cleveland team at home facing a guy who is 0-5 with an ERA of 6.00 and have Danks on the mound. Not only are you losing, you are getting blown out. This team sucks. No action from the front office speaks volumes. No one can convince me they have done anything but give up. Its worse than a white flag.

There is absolutely no reason the Sox shouldn't win this game tonight.

Ideally if they traded AJ, Flowers would step in, but I don't think that's the case right now. I think we'd get a whole lot of Ramon Castro. If anyone thinks Beckham is a mess right now, Flowers is worse. He hit .122 in May and has fanned 6 of his 9 AB in June. I think there would be a grace period of a week or so, but he would get skewered on this board if the Sox called him up. He needs to get fixed first.

QUOTE (JoeCoolMan24 @ Jun 3, 2010 -> 05:34 PM) Today Mitchell said he could be back by September. September call up? Not a chance, but I'd actually go and pay money to see Mitchell play. Considering the minor league season raps up the first week of September the AZ Fall League is probably the goal.

QUOTE (Chet Kincaid @ Jun 2, 2010 -> 10:03 PM) Okay you know what? I'm ready to see some young talent.... some kids. It's gotta be better than this. Bring em all up. The kids suck too.

I've been waiting 3 hours for Kotsay to get an AB. You rarely see him roll into a 4-6-3

The Scout seats have been abandoned.

KW said you need 60 games to evaluate your team. After tonight, if the Sox go on an 8 game winning streak, KW will know he has an average team.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jun 2, 2010 -> 08:10 PM) Yes, it was. But his 2009 was better than 2008 without as much "luck." He had a great stretch last year, but was awful the first couple months and limped home with an injury. I wonder if his hip is still a problem. I'm prejudice because I've never been a fan of his, but if KW could get something worthwhile for him, I would do cartwheels if he pulled the trigger.

QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jun 2, 2010 -> 08:02 PM) He has been to a degree. But not this night. He had flat nothing. Easily his worst performance I can remember since 2007. Between Floyd, Buehrle and Peavy, Daniel Hudson has by default become untouchable. But using the lucky/unlucky numbers, wasn't Floyd's 2008 stellar season basically really "lucky"?

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Jun 2, 2010 -> 07:57 PM) Meanwhile, on the South Side, Gavin is a far cry from the guy who once flirted with no-no's. I've been told his bloated ERA is due to being very unlucky.