Dick Allen

A rain delay when it isn't even raining against the Yankees........................again.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 06:35 PM) Either way, the Reds taking Alonso over Beckham = epic fail. Thanks guys! I'm sure there are more GM's who passed on Beckham who would trade their pick straight up for him right now. In fact, maybe all of them.

QUOTE (lostfan @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 03:01 PM) You know, I'm not jumping off the ledge, but I really hate the 2006 Cardinals for this exact reason. That was very clearly an anomaly, yet still, fans everywhere get deluded into thinking their .500 team could be a World Series contender in disguise and conveniently ignore all the stars that would have to align for this to happen. At this point of the season in 2003, the Florida Marlins record was 2 games better than the current White Sox record. The goal is to make the playoffs. Anything can happen. The 2005 White Sox had a dominant 11-1 record in the playoffs, however, what if a routine grounder didn't roll through Tony Graffanino's legs, and what if a pretty washed up El Duque didn't somehow avoid giving up runs with the bases loaded and nobody out? The Sox may have been done in round 1. Last year, what if the Sox had their pitching rotation set for the playoffs? Maybe they knock off Tampa who did make it to the World Series. 8 teams make the playoffs, and most of them lose, but giving yourself a chance is a lot better chance than hoping some obscure A ball player will lead you to the promised land in 4 or 5 years. A lot more stars would have to align for the junk you may be able to get back taking the White Sox old and slow players contracts actually being good enough to help you make the playoffs one day, than for some team to sneak in, get hot and win a few series. You can go 11-8 in the playoffs and still be world champions.

QUOTE (South Side Fireworks Man @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 06:16 PM) Cowley said that, not Ozzie. Cowley said something like, "One of them is playing hard just to be here and the other one is playing hard to be somewhere else and the organization can see that." Personally, I think Cowley is full of s***, at least most of the time. Cowley also said BA wouldn't be traded because no one would take him. BA must have stolen one of Cowley's honeys on a roadtrip.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 03:47 PM) This might end the Fields/Pie speculation cause Bell is a corner infielder. Orioles could still plug Fields into 1st though, depending on what they think of him or might just feel that from a pure value standpoint the deal makes sense (since Pie isn't going to get starters AB's behind Adam Jones). I read where Bell was real bad defensively, so bad he may have to change positions. Fields isn't exactly Brooks Robinson so it will be interesting to see if McFail has interest in Fields. Pie shouldn't cost too much although he is starting to play a bit better.

QUOTE (CanOfCorn @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 04:30 PM) On the first note...I can't, so I'll back away from that comment. On the second note...I believe Ozzie pretty much said that Wise was giving his all for the White Sox while BA was giving his all for whatever team he was going to be traded to. Maybe not in those words, but pretty much that. He didn't question BA's effort. BA probably knew he wasn't long for the organization while Wise figures when the White Sox say good bye, he's looking at perhaps never seeing the major leagues again. He's hitting .150 his last 133 AB. He has 2 SB this year and been caught 3 times. I really don't see what Dewayne Wise brings to a team other than outs.

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 05:45 PM) Cowley just said that the Sox told Lillibridge he could go back to AAA. At least one of my prayers has been answered.

QUOTE (Pumpkin Escobar @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 12:42 PM) Hate to break it to you. I wouldnt have seen many teams giving up an Alderson for Sanchez. The only thing I could possibly see as a reason why it isn't worht it for those teams to make a deal for a Dye, Jenks, or Dotel is they don't want to offer arb to get the draft pick compensation. That is the only thing I can see holding these deals up. As much as you like to think certain guys arent worth certain players - having expiring contracts or compensation - especially type-A means a lot to clubs. If they deal 1 good looking player for a Vet who can carry them into the playoffs then have a chance 2 draft 2 more young studs? Please. It's worth it. According to Keith Law, Alderson's stuff has deteriorated to the point where he thought it was a fair deal. So you are saying if you were a GM of another team, you would have no problem giving up your top prospects for Thome, Dye, Dotel, Contreras or Jenks? Do you understand how draft pick compensation works? The team would have to offer the players arbitration to be eligible for the draft picks. If you were the GM that means Thome would be offered at least $11 million, and he would have to turn it down. The White Sox free agents to be are looking at sharp reductions in salary except for maybe Dye, but I don't know if I would want to pay Dye $12 million next year. So the draft pick compensation thing isn't going to work.

QUOTE (Pumpkin Escobar @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 12:21 PM) Unfortunately - that is something I can't debate. As much as I feel things would be different dealing off veterans and having some great young guys already up to look forward to. I can't argue it wouldnt take some form of a PR hit. Which is a shame because people would rather be stubborn and watch a team semi-playoff caliber coast to a 3rd place finish 8 games back then put together another World Series Caliber team for next season. It's the truth. Unfortunately too many people don't realize how much of a business this is and sometimes should be treated like one. What type of prospects if you were the GM of another team would you be willing to trade for Thome or Dye or Dotel or Contreras or Jenks? Remember it is a business like you mentioned and that you have to honor their contracts and in Jenks case, he's arb eligible? When you answer that, put those types of prospects in the White Sox organization and tell me how those players will help the White Sox win the WS next season? Also keep in mind when you are mentioning money savings, the White Sox have not given another teams' free agent more than $20 million since December of 1996. Chances are they aren't signing one. Then look at next year's free agent list. Its pretty ugly. Figgins may have some interest, but he's getting older, has had injury problems in the past and has come up big during his contract year. It seems like a disaster waiting to happen.

QUOTE (CanOfCorn @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 12:14 PM) Lemme ask all the BA over Wise haters this: Let's say you owned a business. There's one guy that does one thing very well, and a bunch of other things ok. This guy doesn't seem like he wants to be there. He's always b****ing and talking about how he could do better elsewhere. Then there's another guy. He doesn't do anything that well, and isn't as good as the other guy, but he tries. He's a team-first guy who will do anything you ask him to do. He takes the criticism and comes to work everyday. Which do you want? Personally, I want the guy that wants to be there and will do anything asked, no matter his limitations. Either way, it's done...BA is gone, Wise will be soon. From all reports, BA was a very liked guy in the clubhouse. That other stuff about wanting to be somewhere else was speculation by some White Sox people. Perhaps it was true, but most likely spin. I read somewhere BA and Quentin were really tight. Talk about two opposites.

It appears the Dodgers want Sherrill and the Orioles want Josh Bell as part of the return. It could mean they really have no interest in Fields. Guys that don't field particularly well, who strike out once every 3 times up, who hit .220 with a low OBP and really don't run all that well usually wind up with a price tag of take whatever you can get.

QUOTE (BearSox @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 12:00 PM) He doesn't have much value by himself, but fathom is probably right in the sense he could be a decent piece in a package for a bigger trade. He's a throw in. Organizations have a lot of guys like that. Pie might be a better throw in. I really doubt there are many teams coveting Russell Branyan light.

QUOTE (BearSox @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 11:44 AM) If we do get Pie, I'm pronouncing his name as the food. Also, how awesome would it be if he pans out for us and makes the cubs look foolish? I think it would be awesome. The guy has talent. He, like Viciedo, was a 20 year old in AA only his OPS was 250 pts. higher than Viciedo. As a 22 year old he hit .362 in AAA with power. He's only 24 and a plus defender. He may never pan out, but he's worth the gamble. If Pie had been a White Sox prospect, he would have been the hottest thing on this board for a couple of years a few years ago. His struggles in the majors would have been proof positive Greg Walker should be fired.

QUOTE (Pumpkin Escobar @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 10:20 AM) Well the one thing Kenny has in his pocket with a couple of those guys is that they can give us their "A" prospects because they'll be receiving type-a compensation for them. So I know he won;t get a huge package for some of those guys but if he is smart - he can deal Dye for one top prospect (similar to Sanchez to SF) and possibly even Dotel who is also a Type-A pitcher for some reason. Thats why a team will sell one of their better guys to us for a stretch run. They'll have moveable contracts next season if it fails and they'll get 2 picks for the guys. If Kenny can't get that kind of a haul - then there is no point in trading our Type-A or B players. KW isn't going to offer arb to these players because if they accept, he will be screwed. There is no White Flag II available. Alvarez was 9-8 with a 3.03 ERA. Hernandez was 5-1 with 27 saves, and they weren't making huge money. The current White Sox don't have this kinds of players to sell. And while Barcelo, Caruso, Foulke and Howry was a nice haul, was it franchise-changing? Hardly. Barcelo and Caruso busted. Howry got hurt and was released. Foulke had some success but was eventually traded for a washed-up Billy Koch. Foulke and Howry did help the White Sox win a division, yet with all the PR damage it would seem to me they could have acquired a closer and set up guy in some other fashion.

QUOTE (Balance @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 11:05 AM) I'm not going to say that the season is over; surely anything can happen. If the Sox decide to become sellers by tomorrow evening, I won't fault the decision. The one thing that would be the wrong move, in my opinion, would be to trade away our future core in the hopes of adding a short-term impact player for this season. I don't want the Sox to pay what it would take to get a Halladay, for example. I think the most likely scenario (and the best choice) is to stick with what we have now and let the chips fall where they may. If the Sox can win this weak division, great. But let's not give up the opportunity to control this division (and, hopefully, make deep playoff runs) for the next several years. If sellers means you get guys like Marquez or Jon Adkins when they decided to "sell" Ray Durham, then being a seller makes zero sense. Its a misconception that any White Sox soon to be free agent can net you a can't miss prospect. If they could, they would have been traded a long time ago. People wanted the Sox to trade Dye for Homer Bailey and his 6.87 ERA.

QUOTE (CanOfCorn @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 10:01 AM) I believe he's 32. And I agree...I'd rather wait on Poreda and his upside than get Sherrill and watch his downside. But, that's just me. Sherill is younger than Matt Thornton.

QUOTE (Pumpkin Escobar @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 10:11 AM) And 7 of those gm's every year are wrong. Not including the ones who didn't make it after selling their fanbase on that very same logic. Considering their history, there's a decent chance the White Sox won't win a WS before Beckham is eligible to become a FA. Using the "we are doomed" logic, perhaps KW should trade him for prospects. I get very pessimistic, and think a lot of players on the White Sox are overrated, not all that good etc...........but not wanting them to try to win when they are 3 out would make me wonder why I even root for them in the first place. Surely, there has to be something more productive to do with your time than following a team when even when they win, it doesn't make you happy.

QUOTE (The Ginger Kid @ Jul 30, 2009 -> 12:19 AM) agreed. he's not going to rape anyone else's minor leagues with the bait he's got. That's exactly what everyone who wants KW to sell off players doesn't understand. Unless KW wants to pick up a lot of money, no one is going to give him anything of significance for 2 months of Contreras, Dotel, Thome. He might be able to get something for Dye, but his option goes up $1-2 million if traded, and he's basically a DH. The Sox are far better off keeping these guys and trying to make up 3 games than trading them away and getting 4 or 5 Jeff Marquezes.

The White Sox learned their lesson the last time they unloaded when they were 3 games in back of a much better team than the 2009 Detroit Tigers. Besides, other than Dye, there really isn't much for the White Sox to trade that will net you anything better than Jon Adkins. So really you're looking at trading Dye for some prospects, and I believe his option for next season goes up $1 million if he's traded, so considering his age, his range, and finances, the prospects may only be B prospects, or trying to beat Detroit with JD. Thome, Dotel, Linebrink, Contreras, they aren't going to net you can't miss prospects. Pods isn't going to get you much.

How can the Sox blame any of the 3 losses on the ballpark?

QUOTE (CQMVP @ Jul 29, 2009 -> 09:43 PM) Getz was safe at first if he runs on that dropped third strike..... Another example of poor baseball instincts... No.

QUOTE (tommy @ Jul 29, 2009 -> 09:42 PM) Why didn't he run for first? Because he is out.

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Jul 29, 2009 -> 09:41 PM) That pitch was in the strike zone. At the knees. Want simple? See the ball, hit the ball. Why then doesn' anyone hit at least .400? You apparently played and hit close to 1.000. I'm guessing only an injury prevented you from making millions.

Never fear, Kotsay is on deck and he's a PHing wiz. His AB would be just like a PH appearance.

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Jul 29, 2009 -> 09:38 PM) No pitch is unhittable unless it's bounced or goes overs the catcher's head. JD just got fooled. If hitting only was as simple as you make it.