Texsox

QUOTE (YASNY @ Aug 7, 2008 -> 01:44 PM) I hated AJ as a Twin. I love him as a White Sox. He's one of those guys that you hate unless he's one your team. The best example of another athlete that I can come up with is Dino Cicarelli who used to play for the Minnesota North Stars. I hated the guy, but I would have loved him if he was on the Blackhawks. Great example. I was at a game where the Stars refused to take the ice until all the anti-Dino stuff was taken down. But I still could not stomach the Bulls signing Rodman.

Not so surprisingly I love catching for that reason, getting into the other team's heads. AJ is about as good as anyone at that, and you have to be thinking and even tempered to do it or else it backfires and they just owned space in your head.

/going to hell

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 7, 2008 -> 12:07 PM) But...Favre is also in NY because he was unable to adapt and make a decision based on anyone else's schedule but his own. The last decision was by the Packers. On Wednesday, they could have had a HoF QB on their roster who knows their system. They chose no. They had many reasons to chose from, hopefully they made it based on the needs of their football team, but I doubt it. IMHO it was a decision they made based on ego, pride, and macho.

QUOTE (YASNY @ Aug 7, 2008 -> 01:08 PM) Here's the way I look at Baines issue. Andre Dawson was a better all around player than Harold and he's not in yet. Dawson didn't have the DH position to fall back on. He won an MVP award while playing for a last place team. He also had the turf issue in Montreal as a factor in his knees deteriorating. If Dawson makes it, and I think he should, then I'll take another look at Harold. But Andre was just a better all around ballplayer than Harold, imho. Nothing there but truth.

QUOTE (YASNY @ Aug 7, 2008 -> 11:58 AM) How has Harold done in the voting? I think that would be the thing that tells the story? He'll be off the ballot in a year or two. Barely pulling in the 5% necessary. I think being a DH hurts more than his career numbers. Again, my only disagreement is the comments that he is not even close. I think he is pretty damn close.

The Packers suddenly had a HoF caliber QB who intimately knows the organization available to them. Does not matter how or why. The guy is there and available. At that point the Packers also had an opportunity to make a new decision. They stuck with their earlier decision. They chose the path and may regret it. It certainly was a big PR gamble. From the coverage I saw, I think the Packer front office made decisions based on playing "who's dick is bigger" not on what was best on the field. Bottom line Favre is in NY because of the Packers. They controlled where he played this season.

QUOTE (YASNY @ Aug 7, 2008 -> 11:53 AM) Here's a short little Gary Peters story for you. He was with Red Sox and was getting roughed up one day. This rookie catcher comes out to mound to talk to him and Peters, being the veteran pitcher that he was at the time said "WTF do you want?" At that point Carlton Fisk just turned around and walked back to his position. great story.

QUOTE (Gregory Pratt @ Aug 7, 2008 -> 11:46 AM) Whenever I have baseball Hall of Fame or history questions I take them to Baseball-Fever.com, and I recently took Harold there. It got merged into a different Harold Baines thread/poll, where the answer is overwhelmingly no. Take it for what it's worth, but most people don't think he was ever an elite player and the only reason we're having this discussion is that he platooned for a long time accumulating raw totals. Also that this is a Sox board. I suppose that Angels forums would have similar discussions in favor of someone like, say, Garrett Anderson. Every team has guys like this who aren't good enough for the Hall of Fame but are great franchise players. Most hits and RBIs of anyone not in HoF. All the players ahead of him on those lists are in, and many players behind him are in. And hits and RBIs are not obscure stats. So a Sox board is the only place fans could make that argument. He's a long shot, and if he had the same stats in 3 or 4 less years, he'd be a pretty solid pick.

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Aug 7, 2008 -> 11:45 AM) I agree but you still see the occasional poll on sports websites and hear talk radio discussion about the issue. Baseball writers will reagard him as the best pwer hitter "non juicer" in the 1990s. His lack of interviewing charisma and pouty nature not withstanding.

"So Barry, any other side effects from steroid withdrawl?"

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Aug 7, 2008 -> 12:36 PM) Then why can't Jim Rice get in? Compare his 162 game averages to those of Harold Baines. Both are close. And I respect your comment about accumulators. There has to be a balance. Having a couple great seasons should not be enough, and perhaps having 22 above average seasons is also not quite enough. But I respectfully disagree he has "no where near" HoF numbers. And if there was ever a player where I would want to consider factors like character and class, here it is. I think baseball should consider that when looking at some of these borderline players. Who has made baseball better by their role?

QUOTE (maggsmaggs @ Aug 7, 2008 -> 12:30 PM) Knight: Just a suggestion with the top Sox players. Maybe a sub-forum on the PaleHose main bored so that all of them are in one place and easier to see. Just a suggestion because it would be cool to see them all in one place rather than sporadically placed. He's planning on a consolidated list. But this keeps the comments together and in a more linear organization by player. And fwiw, it's favorite, not top. Two different lists. I'm thinking Frank may or may not win this one, but he clearly wins top player.

QUOTE (YASNY @ Aug 7, 2008 -> 12:26 PM) If he played for New York or Boston, he'd make it. See Billy Pierce vs. Whitey Ford. Winning championships is always a plus.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Aug 7, 2008 -> 12:12 PM) No especially when he played for 22 seasons. I don't hold accumulators in as high regard as some. Then never mention career numbers. His 162 game averages were .289/.356/.465, 22 HR, 93 RBI, 120 OPS+. and he rarely devaited from that. Shame his knees did not hold out, or we would have been talking first ballot or not.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Aug 7, 2008 -> 12:05 PM) Harold Baines doesn't have anywhere near hall of fame numbers. He has the most RBIs and hits of anyone not in the HoF. 40th All-Times in Hits 51st in Home Runs 27 in RBIs. If there are more than 40 or 50 guys in the HoF, I don't think it's accurate to say "Harold Baines doesn't have anywhere near hall of fame numbers". That makes him sound like Pods.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Aug 7, 2008 -> 10:53 AM) I also saw Luzinski and Kittle hit roof shots. My god what blasts. And of course Dick Allen deep liners to cf. The Bull could hit the ball. I forgot about him. He was one of my favorites too. I wonder what he's doing now and how big he is. He was a likeable lug sort of like Kruk only more powerful. He owns a BBQ concession at Philly's stadium. Still a huge fan favorite in Philly.

I had forgotten about him until you asked me to write his bio. He was just before my time. I'm surprised he was higher then Luzinski.

I see too many of our posters were not around for the 1983 season. For the guys on this board, imagine your kids leaving off Dye or Konerko from their favorite Sox players. That's what I'm thinking as I see he's only on 4 lists.

^^^^^^ It seems the old fashioned cassette adapters actually worked better.

QUOTE (kapkomet @ Aug 5, 2008 -> 10:21 AM) Ahh yes, everything's a conspiracy. My take is why does it take 5+ years for crap like this to come out? If it happened, it would have been out well before now. Like who Deep Throat is/was? Some people are good at keeping secrets, which is why they are in the upper reaches of government and military. Not saying I agree with this, but the timing isn't something that concerns me.

QUOTE (YASNY @ Aug 6, 2008 -> 08:31 AM) Harold more than likely won't make the Hall. The 'Greatest White Sox' should be a HOF'er. In my opinion, Aparicio's not getting enough love. I think Frank needs to make the Hall as a DH, then the Veterans Committee, in the future will vote in Baines.

I heard Nolan Ryan say that no one will come close to his longevity for the exact opposite reason as you mention, kids do not throw enough. They never develop the arm for the long haul. We baby them too much. I had a coach who would not let us swim the day of games. Felt it tired out our arms and legs too much. We obeyed him too.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 6, 2008 -> 08:40 PM) I wore a Sox jersey to a department function out here once, a lady approached me and asked about it, turns out she was good friends with Kelley. Right around the time he had that brief stint with the dodgers. Closest thing I have to a real connection to anyone. QUOTE (TCQ @ Aug 7, 2008 -> 07:55 AM) Woah thats kinda depressing...Ill be your friend if you want Classic and POTM worthy

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Aug 6, 2008 -> 08:40 PM) I wore a Sox jersey to a department function out here once, a lady approached me and asked about it, turns out she was good friends with Kelley. Right around the time he had that brief stint with the dodgers. Closest thing I have to a real connection to anyone. QUOTE (TCQ @ Aug 7, 2008 -> 07:55 AM) Woah thats kinda depressing...Ill be your friend if you want