witesoxfan

That's a ridiculous play by Alexei and he makes it look like f***ing easy cheese

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ May 10, 2011 -> 11:34 PM) My bad, I edited my post to show my sarcasm more fully. I follow.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 11, 2011 -> 12:40 AM) We're already in the bottom 3rd of attendance, it's just that we can generate higher revenues due to our market, average ticket prices, promotions/advertising, etc. The 80's rebuilding effort was painful but finally ended with Thomas, Ventura, McDowell, Sosa, Alvarez, Radinsky, etc., arriving at the same time. We "rebuilt" in a way after the 97/98 seasons (it was kind of a two year movement of dumping higher salaries) and were back in the playoffs in 2000. I'd say 3 years with our payroll and the Twins falling apart too, although there's always the possibility that the Indians and Royals will delay our success until 2016 or 2017. You just wonder how much the Indians' payroll can come up....they're going to have to have success for 2-3 seasons in a row to start closing in on their 1990's-2002 attendance numbers with all the consecutive sellouts. Otherwise, they'll have to continue to part with their higher priced pieces like Carmona as they get into Years 5 & 6 of their contracts. Rebuilt to a fluke division winner in 2000 that was 23 games over .500 in the first half of the season and saw Cleveland close the division lead to 5 games by the end of the season after having 32 different pitchers appear in games. They lost quite a few players to injury in 2001 and ended up finishing .500, but those teams were built almost exclusively on the offense and really didn't have much of a chance to have any sort of sustained success. They had a chance to have a really good team in 2003, but neither 2002 nor 2004 were that good of teams either. That's not much of a rebuild. To rebuild the way people here have and the way I suggested, it's going to take far longer than 3 years. If the Sox try to rebuild with the same organizational philosophy of trading away young, talented players that they "think" will fail or don't "project" well to the majors according to them but keep those guys that they do feel strongly about, they will be left with the same exact situation they're in now. The only team I can think of in the majors that is not the Yankees or Red Sox that has been able to do what the White Sox would be trying to do is the Phillies. They finished in 2nd or 3rd place for like 5 straight seasons, Gillick came on for Ed Wade, and the first move he made was dealing Thome for Rowand, Gonzalez, and Haigwood. They had some dude named Ryan Howard waiting in the wings. On top of that, they had Utley at 2B, Rollins at SS, Burrell in LF, and Abreu in RF - who they traded in 2006 along with Cory Lidle for 4 prospects, none of whom did much of anything in the majors (though Monasterios looks OK for the Dodgers). They still had Brett Myers and Cole Hamels in the rotation too, and a young Madson coming up. There had a good, young core of players to build around, so it didn't take much, and they were STILL selling off. The White Sox don't have an offensive core like that. It's going to take quite a bit more to build something in Chicago.

QUOTE (kitekrazy @ May 10, 2011 -> 08:58 PM) Outside of winning the CY Young, his resume does not spell "ace" in my book. From 2004 to 2009, a time frame covering 166 starts and 1070 IP, Jake Peavy put up an ERA of 2.99 and an ERA+ of 131. John Danks, a guy a few people consider to be an ace or just short of an ace, has put that an ERA+ that good once in a season - 2008 when he was at 138 - and he is at 124 for his career. It may not be an ace in the vein of Roy Halladay or Tim Lincecum, but it's pretty damn good and is probably good as one of the best 15 pitchers in the league.

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ May 10, 2011 -> 11:18 PM) Not possible, sorry. I hope not. I said the same thing about Detroit in '06 until around Memorial Day, and they ended up winning 94 games.

I just want to say that for the White Sox to get to the point that you guys want, it's going to take, at the very minimum, 5 years. Said changes would require a complete organizational shift in philosophy, because what they're doing in the minors, from top to bottom, clearly is not preparing these players well enough for the major leagues. So you have to bring in new coaches, new front office personnel, and new players. It's going to take 3-5 years to get those players prepared for what the White Sox want them to do at the major league level, and then you have to worry about getting the right players in place at the highest level. Perhaps this is something you can incorporate along the way, but I don't believe that. The Yankees and Red Sox have been able to get away from it because they've spent anywhere between 50-100% more than the rest of the league during these transitional periods. That's not to say that the White Sox aren't spending at all - they quite clearly are - but they simply don't have the resources to "purchase" playoff appearances. The teams with similar payrolls to them are teams like the Cubs, Dodgers, Angels, and Mets - no surprise that they are all in the 3 largest markets in the country - and those teams have only been so-so at getting to the playoffs and only the Angels - 10 years ago - have had success in the playoffs, perhaps suggesting that part of their success had to do with the suckage of the A's, Rangers, and Mariners as opposed to them actually being very good. It doesn't surprise me in the least that they struggled last year when a couple other good teams came along and it won't surprise me this year if they finish 3rd in the division. The Sox are also similar to the Twins, Tigers, and Giants who have had varying (used quite loosely) degrees of success over the past 2-5 years. Oh, and this is by far the team's highest payroll ever, by like $20 mill. Every other young and successful team around the league has taken their lumps, and they've usually done so for around 10 years. I don't think it would take the Sox 10 years because they do have the financial capabilities to make it work, but it certainly shouldn't surprise anyone if it does. If they were to sell off and go into a complete rebuild, it's going to be at the expense of the major league team until like 2016 at the very earliest. There are going to be an exorbitant amount of people who are upset about it and attendance will almost certainly drop to the bottom 3rd of the league again.

QUOTE (chw42 @ May 10, 2011 -> 08:16 PM) This is the right step forward for Houston. They need to get rid of that entire FO in order to have a chance of winning any time soon. Are you implying that Ed Wade is not a good GM??

The Indians are starting to remind me of the 2006 Tigers. I keep waiting for them to come back to earth and waiting and waiting and they just never do. They aren't this good, but the longer they keep playing over their head, the less they are going to have to win into the future.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ May 10, 2011 -> 10:54 AM) which one? ALL OF EM

QUOTE (docsox24 @ May 10, 2011 -> 10:06 AM) At this point I have far more confidence in Humber than Peavy With regards to his durability and actually making it through a season, sure. Jake Peavy has proven that he is 100 times the pitcher Phil Humber is. I don't care that Humber has looked good for a stretch of 40 innings because I can find countless examples of guys who have done that. It's a lot harder to find guys who have the resume that Jake Peavy does. When push comes to shove, Jake Peavy has to be in the rotation and if Phil Humber is the odd man out, then so be it. At that point, we would just have to hope that Ozzie wouldn't let him waste away pitching garbage innings because he's proven that he needs to atleast be given an opportunity to throw meaningful innings in whatever role he is in.

QUOTE (Milkman delivers @ May 9, 2011 -> 12:17 PM) Completely off any kind of topic (I guess that's what the Catch All is for), but I find it weird that the last 4 girls I've dated have better tits than asses, and I've long considered myself an ass man. You're obviously a self-masochist. You still follow the White Sox, even though you know they aren't going to do s***, you still swear by Mr. Perfect even though he's been dead for 8 years now, and worst of all, you get girls with big tits as opposed to nice asses even though you love the way they shake it (or the way it feels, I have no idea).

Jesus this week has been already ridiculous. Started a job working as a cook again because I couldn't find any jobs whatsoever. On my first day of work, I get an e-mail from a company looking for an administrative assistant and that the job starts immediately. It's a better job than cooking, but it's temporary, so I'm going to try to keep my job at this kitchen, if only on the weekends, but I'm not counting on it. Then I had a call for the PASS Program for Edward Jones, which is the job that I want the most at this point in time. So if anyone has any recommendations or advice regarding the information that should be put on both the application and during any potential interview for that job, that would be great. I understand that I may not have the requisite sales experience they are looking for, but I'm hoping that because I've talked to them on several different occasions as well as having a degree in economics that they'll accept me into that.

QUOTE (since56 @ May 10, 2011 -> 08:26 AM) I'm finally sleeping at night! Yikes.

QUOTE (kitekrazy @ May 9, 2011 -> 11:25 PM) PK had 2 really bad seasons, so I do have my doubts he is 100% clean. Frank Thomas did too and he's the best bet of any player during the era to be clean.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 10, 2011 -> 07:55 AM) Who cares how proven he has been prior to this year? He's been our best starter, you can't stick your best starter in the pen because he hasn't been good enough before this year. Here are how two players have debuted for their new teams over the previous 2 seasons. Player A - 7 GS, 46 IP, 2.54 ERA, 0.93 WHIP, 7.2 K/9, 1.6 BB/9 Player B - 6 GS (8 G), 39.1 IP, 2.97 ERA, 0.94 WHIP, 5.7 K/9 2.5 BB/9 It's very much worth mentioning.

QUOTE (JoeCoolMan24 @ May 9, 2011 -> 08:22 PM) Oh, so he would only cost the Sox about $300K or so? Suddenly I'm worried.... He'll clear waivers and then the Mariners will release him. At that point, he will be a free agent and can sign with any team. I'd be quite surprised if anyone signed him.

QUOTE (Real @ May 9, 2011 -> 11:01 PM) Pena better be the guy or I'll have more ammunition to fire at this organization in my claims that they don't know what the F*CK they're doing Brandon Allen isn't going to cause me to lose any sleep. I don't mind that type of move - trading for a young, team controlled reliever who has put up solid numbers previously. It just so happens that Tony Pena got by on smoke and mirrors his first year or two with Arizona, because he is gigantic fail. For the team's sake, I hope they cut their losses with Pena. The last guy in the pen is going to pitch garbage innings and there's a very, very slight chance that you can get some sort of young player for him - even if it's a 24 year old one-armed reliever in low-A. You seriously can't get that for Jeff Gray. Oh, and from a completely untrained eye, I think Gray is better than Pena.

It's fun when Quentin is good like this

For Konerko to get to 550 homers, assuming he plays another 6 years, he will have to average 31 home runs per season. That is a virtual impossibility.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 9, 2011 -> 01:05 PM) I'd think he would too, but it is hard to separate out all of that noise and find guys who were clean. That will cloud HOF balloting for decades because baseball was so slow to even act like it had a problem. Hell they still haven't fixed HGH. I don't think any of the 4 major sports have done anything about HGH. And really, steroids seem to have been viewed more critically in baseball than they have football, where players are still pretty regularly found to be doping. It seems to me that there are very few major leaguers who are suspended for steroid use anymore, and a lot of that probably has to do with the fact that the minor leagues weed out those players who need performance enhancers to continue to move up. QUOTE (SoxFan1 @ May 9, 2011 -> 01:29 PM) He's only had 5 seasons of 100+ RBI. I think that would hold him back. If he gets to 500 HR, he has a better shot. But I think it's doubtful. I don't think that will be a problem at all. Even older baseball writers are beginning to understand that there is a vast difference between numbers that depend upon the team and those that are due to the player themselves. Felix Hernandez won the Cy Young last year after winning only 13 games all year. Even just 5 years ago, that would have been held against him. (it's pretty absurd to think that he averaged more than 7.1 IP a start, had an ERA of 2.27, and still only won 13 games)

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ May 9, 2011 -> 12:43 PM) 500 homeruns or not, has anyone ever ever ever thought of Pauly as an elite player in this league? The guy is a very good player who before last year pretty much put up just above average numbers for his position, nothing spectacular. Just because he's had a long career of being good doesn't make him a hall of famer. From 2004 to 2006 and last year I have thought of him as a top 5-10 1Bman in the entire game. That's only 4 years. If he has some continuation of the success he had last year this year - and he has thus far - we can look back and say he was elite. It is possible to look at guys and think they are elite and really their numbers don't wow you, while there are others that you don't think are elite and their numbers are really, really good. I don't think of Matt Holliday as the best outfielder in the game, but he has the highest WAR of all outfielders in the entire game from 2008 to 2010.

I thought it was 2 bullets in 1 eye? It's like we're the White House trying to get our story straight

QUOTE (iamshack @ May 9, 2011 -> 11:46 AM) Thome? I've mentally blocked him because of how pissed I was that he wasn't resigned by the White Sox.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 9, 2011 -> 09:47 AM) The eras were also very different offensively, plus Mattingly's best year blows away anything Konerko has ever done. Brady Anderson's best year blows away anything Konerko has ever done too. The point of the Hall of Fame is that you are very successful for a very long period of time. Just because a guy has a 2-3 year run where he's a great player doesn't qualify him as better than someone who has been very successful for a very long time. I get that Mattingly was a bit better than that, but he really wasn't much better. From 1984-87, he was one of the best hitters in the game. At every other point in his career, he was just OK. I also get that Mattingly's career was ended by a back injury, but the Hall of Fame can hold that against him. Comparing their respective careers, I would say that Konerko has been better. He hasn't had the peak seasons Mattingly had, but he's had much better years otherwise and is still healthy enough that he'll be signed until he's 37. Oh, and if Konerko does make it to 500 homers, it'd be a hell of an accomplishment. He has to average 34 homers a year from now until 2014, or 27 a year from now until 2015. He would be 39 during the 2015 season. I'm pretty sure that Matsui is the only player in the last 3 years to hit even 20 homers at age 37. Manny would have two years ago as well had he not been suspended for steroid use, which is pretty much a dead giveaway as to what was going on there. Frank Thomas was the last guy to even 30 at age 38, and the last to hit 25 at the age of 39. He was one of the greatest hitters of all time. (I may also be mistaken on those, so don't quote me exactly) If Konerko gets to 500 home runs, he should absolutely be in the Hall of Fame. He is not going to get to 500 homers barring a minor miracle. QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 9, 2011 -> 10:27 AM) Comparing eras, no it isn't. Eh, it pretty much is. 222 is not that impressive of a number. It may be like 300 in today's game, but it wasn't a complete deadball era.

I think if Konerko is reasonably close to the 500 home run milestone, the White Sox will do what they can to cater to his interests. They signed Mike Jackson and let him continue to pitch out of the bullpen even though he was no longer effective simply to get him to 1000 games. If Paul Konerko is at 497 home runs and he wants to get to 500, the White Sox will allow him to do so.