witesoxfan

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Nov 16, 2008 -> 11:03 PM) As far as the Swisher trade goes, it just means there were four other teams that offered KW EVEN LESS for Swisher than what we wanted to receive in return. It also tells you a bit about how desperate Kenny was to dump him on another team.. It's not necessarily that they offered less but they offered packages that Kenny didn't like nearly as much. They could have offered very talented players who are in the lower minors, offered worse contracts with more talented players, or tried to get packages built up where the Sox would be including other players, but when push came to shove, this was the deal Kenny felt was best for the organization.

hopefully someone wants him

QUOTE (Gregory Pratt @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 11:14 PM) He's a very good defensive first baseman who won't even hit 35 homeruns a year or hit for anything resembling a great average. There's nothing about Mark Teixeira that calls for even a hundred million dollar contract. He's a top 3 1Bman in the league, everything considered, very possibly top 2. Pujols is obviously better, but I can't think of anyone off the top of my head otherwise. He's an XBH machine who walks and does hit for average. He's easily worth a $100+ million contract.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 08:34 PM) TEX has been linked often to the K-Rod sweepstakes, so I can see them also being willing to look at Jenks, because of the salary being so much lower, even in his arbitration years. I see Texas signing Wood.

QUOTE (YASNY @ Nov 14, 2008 -> 03:11 AM) Some of you are jumping the gun here. It's hardly a foregone conclusion that he will sign with the Sox. Thank you

QUOTE (TheBigHurt @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 09:47 PM) So anyone know who else we got yet, assuming we got someone else? It just doesn't make sense that we didn't... Swisher had a terrible year, so no, that's all the Sox are getting. KW has even confirmed this.

QUOTE (whitesoxbrian @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 04:53 PM) How was Betemit's defense when he did play SS? I seem to recall it was pretty mediocre, and then he got bigger. QUOTE (Paint it Black @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 04:57 PM) It is possible that teams knew Garland really wasn't that good. He took what he could get for Garland, and the deal still made sense. OC works because he was the bridge to get Alexei to short (which should happen IMO). OC was brought in to be the shortstop for the White Sox for the next 4 years, and then it turned sour very quickly. The Sox were lucky that Alexei looks to be a damn good player. QUOTE (Paint it Black @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 04:59 PM) Taveras...really? Can I not have the major league equivalent of Jerry Owens Oxymoron. Taveras is also a better all-around player than Owens is. He's been an OK player in the past, plays good defense in CF, and has a good arm. It's merely a matter of hoping that, if he is brought in, that he can hit .300 and draw a walk, which is what I find to be highly unlikely.

QUOTE (DBAHO @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 04:44 PM) Ok so the Sox do that. Do they then turn 2B over to a Getz/Nix platoon, and either A - Give the closer's job to Thornton B - Go out and sign a FA closer. Fuentes seems like a good candidate for the Mets. Not sure why'd they give up one of the most valuable players in the majors for anything less than a king's ransom.

QUOTE (Paint it Black @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 04:19 PM) Am I the only one who kind of likes this trade? Okay yes, it sucks dumping a guy after giving up prospects to the A's last year (although De Los Santos is really the only guy who could come back and bite them) but lets face it, Swish was a guy without a position on this team who's numbers had fallen off significantly. I seem to recall DLS having Tommy John surgery. I know he went down early in the year after struggling and I don't think he came back. Gio's probably boom or bust. Sweeney probably will end up as a solid regular, but not until his power develops. I'm perfectly fine with the deal.

I think this is kind of a ho-hum deal, and that there's a possibility that none of the players involved will ever make a huge impact on their new teams. Just an opinion. I think the most interesting piece in this is Marquez, who sounds like a reclamation project, ala Floyd. I do like Betemit though and always have.

I think Gold Gloves are the dumbest, followed by Comeback Player, for obvious reasons, but I'll let whoever else believes what they believe.

Hanson not being included is huge, and I'm sure that is entirely to do with Escobar being in the deal. Lillibridge is either MLB ready or Atlanta has something in place, because he was terrible last year. It's interesting at the least, and I like the deal for Atlanta. Sucks to give up a damn good shortstop, but with the shortstop market as wide open as it is, it's well worth it. To me, this means either Renteria or Cabrera is ending up in Atlanta, and I'll just go ahead and guess - seeing how good Renteria was with the Braves, and how no compensation is likely necessary - that Renteria is back there soon. If they signed Cabrera, that would pretty much suck ass.

QUOTE (knightni @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 03:13 AM) Both are out of shape guys whose best games are behind them and they don't believe it. Pass. I'd rather risk the #5 job on Richard or Poreda than either one of these guys. On guys merely learning how to pitch in the big leagues? rather than a guy like Garcia who shut the Sox down on their last leg for 5 innings before being taken out? or Colon who showed #3-4 stuff, though limited, and was never injured seriously? I'd take either of those above any pitching prospect, Richard and Poreda included, in the White Sox system. I don't think the Sox can gamble on the #5 spot in the rotation this year, but rather hope no one gets injured, and if they do, fill it at that point. I still see Richard in middle relief at this point with Logan gone, options considered.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Nov 12, 2008 -> 11:19 PM) Someone's rather down on young pitchers tonight. Mr. Scout says David Price only has one pitch and now Mike Pelfrey. Pelfrey will basically wind up being Jon Garland... the k rate is nearly identical (even a tad better). If you're saying you don't want a young, cheap Jon Garland (the developed one, not the 5 era one), then I don't know what to say. I've never seen Pelfrey pitch, but if he has a very good sinker, he could very easily be much better than Garland. I never saw a very good sinker out of Garland...merely a good sinker, a solid fastball, and an array of offspeed pitches that were never ever good but were good enough on certain days to make him unhittable. If Pelfrey has a very good sinker, a good fastball (which is assumed), then it's not that difficult to imagine him becoming a better version of Jon Garland. I'd still take Pelfrey, so whatever.

I fully expect either Colon or Garcia to end up as a member of the Sox by the time pitchers and catchers report, so, no, I see nothing wrong with posting this, and no, I would have no problem with Colon as the #5 in the rotation at the beginning of the season.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Nov 13, 2008 -> 12:06 AM) I like Danks a lot better than Floyd, despite Floyd's excellent season. Because Danks is a better pitcher than Floyd, plain and simple.

First, Price featured a plus-plus slider in the playoffs. If you didn't see it, you weren't watching. Regarding that, Randy Johnson has had a Hall of Fame career living on a plus-plus fastball and a plus-plus slider. If you don't think Price can be the next Randy Johnson, I say you're crazy (if he doesn't become the next RJ, don't hate me, because the next statement or two clarifies that). There are plenty of other guys he undoubtedly compares favorably to, most of them atleast one scale and probably two less than Randy Johnson, but his top 2 pitches are better than Kazmir's top 2 (which, coincidentally, are fastball and slider). I think David Price has a long, profitable career in this league, with emphasis on profitable. Second, I wanted nothing more than speculation in the potential Dye and Poreda for Garza+ package I said I would work with...Garza is more valuable than Dye simply because he's had more than one good season (including his rookie year) as a starting pitcher, plus he's cheaper, plus he's locked up longer. Including Poreda is not suggesting that I do not like Poreda, but rather I'd have a "bonafide" starter rather than a starting pitching prospect who is just as likely to end up in the pen as he is in the rotation, even if Poreda ends up as a dominant reliever. In suggesting I include Poreda, I'm using him as a starting pitching prospect, which is the necessity for another player, hence the "+". I would never, ever trade Dye and Poreda for Garza straight up, because that would be humiliating and dumb. Third, if you want to call Sonnanstine a poorman's version of Mark Buehrle, go right ahead, but I'll disagree with that statement entirely, simply because I think Sonnanstine profiles more to Josh Fogg than he does Mark Buehrle, in that he knows how to use his stuff, but he's still mediore or bad all at the same time. Fourth, I agree with everything sircaffey has said in this thread. He's just said it in a more condensed manner than I have. I also like Wade Davis as well, especially in regards to the pitching prospect that might be included. If said deal occurred, I'd probably be just fine with it. Finally, greg, Jim Thome was arguably more valuable than Jermaine Dye was this season. He never played mediocre defense - hard to do when you don't play defense - and, with more concrete and baseball evidence, he was the only Sox player this season who batted left handed that was an above average major league hitter. He hit homers, he struck out, or he walked...chance just so happens that Thome got on base for free 95 times this season without hits - which excludes his 34 free runs - and he was arguably the Sox 2nd most valuable player, outside of Quentin. I would damn near guarantee he repeats that feat next year, with much hate from White Sox fans who believe that Thome is not clutch (which he isn't against left handed relievers, because he can't hit left handed pitching, noted by his "mediocre" BB/9 against lefties and his bad K+GIDP/PA against lefties, which was right around 1/3), regardless of his feats in the 15 or 16 inning Anaheim game and his 163rd game heroics. Thome's here to stay, because he won't approve a trade, and because he's a goddamn f***ing stud, and anybody who still questions that needs to look at what he actually did this season for the White Sox. All I will say is watch the Rays this offseason. Not that the Sox will necessarily have anything to do with it, but I don't see Edwin Jackson on the Sox for anything substantial, but I do see him either as a main cog in the Rays pen or traded. There's no way he's in the rotation next year. I also see the Rays interested in a right fielder, and, as I did predict, JD is available in trades. So just watch out.

what happened? I blacked out

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Nov 12, 2008 -> 09:42 PM) It's going to take a LOT to get Garza. While they value Kazmir and Price more, Kazmir might be a little more expendable, due to his increasing contract numbers. OTOH, he's a lefty with nasty stuff. But Garza is cheaper and has ALMOST the same stuff...he can be equally nasty, and he's still just learning how to pitch at the big league level instead of just "throwing" like when he came up with the Twinkies. It would have to be Dye and Poreda for Garza or Dye/Jenks for Garza and something really nice (not Crawford, of course...but a player KW has targeted...he knows who it is better than we do). I think Dye and Poreda for Garza is a bit much, but it's a package that can be worked with, depending on what Tampa sees in Poreda too of course.

QUOTE (BearSox @ Nov 12, 2008 -> 07:46 PM) Fukudome is so overrated. He's gonna be out of the league and back in Japan after his contract is up, if not earlier, IMO. I'll take that bet. I wouldn't be surprised in the least if Fukudome's OPS is over .800 next season...I wouldn't bet on it, just saying.

QUOTE (BearSox @ Nov 12, 2008 -> 09:05 PM) I personally would love a Dye for Edwin Jackson and Willy Aybar deal. We could then either deal Fields for pitching help or have Fields and Aybar kind of platoon at 3B. It would also make any trade of Vazquez safer as we wouldn't have two holes in a rotation if we do trade him. I don't like Jackson at all, not any more than Daniel Cabrera anyways, who will almost certainly be much cheaper to acquire and is a very similar pitcher. I think he could be a dynamite setup man, but I just don't care for him much as a back end of the rotation starter. I also think Aybar is a solid player, but he seems more like a real good utility player to me than a starter. I brought something like that up a while ago, but if the Sox deal Dye to the Rays, I'd make sure I'm getting Garza or Shields (probably Garza), because you won't get Kazmir or Price while Jackson and Sonnanstine seem like mediocre options for the Sox. I'd even give up another player to get Garza or Shields, simply because both are more valuable than Dye, though I don't know who Tampa would be interested in. One key to watch, as it always is with Williams, is what kind of pitching he brings in. I honestly wouldn't be surprised to see him bring in a project, a veteran on an incentive laden deal, and a starting pitching prospect.

QUOTE (knightni @ Nov 12, 2008 -> 12:40 PM) The guy probably wants his opportunity to flail at 3 pitches 4 times, then go back out there without resting. In the AL, Peavy could double his CGs. Or he wants to continue facing guys twice in a game who will flail at 3 pitches.

QUOTE (MAX @ Nov 12, 2008 -> 01:05 AM) I don't see any meaning for some of the selectivity. It appears to me to be suggesting that generally the only players who come up at that young of an age are those who are so talented that their bat is good enough at a very raw stage in their career that they can come up to the majors and still be a productive hitter, and that as their career goes on, they'll eventually become among the best hitters in the league. Not that Justin Upton is necessarily going to become among the best hitters of all time, because some of those clearly are not, but when you hit .250 and generally considered to be a struggling player, yet post an .816 OPS on the year, you are pretty damn talented. It's also suggesting that it doesn't happen very often. If Viciedo is really that good, then he's going to get an absolutely monstrous deal.

QUOTE (MAX @ Nov 12, 2008 -> 12:27 AM) Miguel Cabrera isn't on that list? Oh, it wasn't in one season. Well. Honestly that is a pretty stupid stat. Why?

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Nov 11, 2008 -> 11:04 PM) From the Nov. 20th, 2005 Philadelphia Inquirer: Thome was traded 5 days later. I'm sure there's more but these things are hard to find. KW's out to get the best deal for the team, and if that's the move no one knows or the move that's widely published about, he's going to do it.