caulfield12

QUOTE (fathom @ May 29, 2014 -> 10:04 PM) On Buster Olney's podcast, Keith Law said Kolek to the Sox is the lock of the top 5 picks http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/ Allen Thomas and the minor league strength and conditioning staff has a HUGE (literally and figuratively) project ahead of them. At least it will be interesting. In some ways, I prefer this direction, even if it blows up, because it's much harder to find an ace than to find a Quintana/Floyd/Humber/Jenks/Santos. In my lifetime, Jose Contreras was the only true ace we got on the cheap, and that only lasted 4-5 months. Loiaza in 2003, but that also didn't last. And then Freddie Garcia, which was only possible due to our farm system and the ability to sign an extension due to the closeness with Guillen's family.

QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ May 29, 2014 -> 10:41 AM) I agree with that, but is there a single pitcher in the pen with the kind of stuff that dominates playoff games? Bella is about it. Let's just GET to a playoff game first. Petricka and Webb both have potentially dominating stuff, particularly Webb. Putnam, like Tanaka, has a ton of movement on his pitches and doesn't have to throw harder than 87-90 MPH to be effective. In fact, part of his effectiveness comes from not looking like 85% of the middle relievers out there today who are all throwing mid 90's.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014...and-nerds.html# Interesting article...written by self-professed geek/Asian/former Jeopardy contestant.

QUOTE (The Ultimate Champion @ May 29, 2014 -> 10:18 AM) What is a bullpen, and how do you fill with guys who are always very good and also who cannot immediately become very bad? What you do is build as much depth as possible and see what happens. When holes open you try to fill them as best you can. Guerra could be a nice pickup. If Carroll can handle the long man role that's huge for us. Putnam has been nails. Petricka, very good again. 4 guys who in total took nothing to acquire aside from Petricka's drat pick. This sort of thing happens all the time. Also there is going to be another dynamite closer out there somewhere. Sergio Santos cost nothing either, and man did he have great stuff for us. All we had to do is convert him & put him on the mound. Every organization has live arms who won't make it for them and we'll find one. And re: Jenks yes he had terrific stuff, a great 4 seamer, 2-seamer, curve, slider, and his change for a while was his best pitch. But he certainly didn't have elite stamina, character issues, wasn't keeping himself in shape, etc. So he also had a lot of flaws and red flags, probably a lot like the next terrific closer we'll inevitably pick up for nothing. Or for a 3rd round draft pick. Williams got suckered into this line of thinking with big money deals for Dotel and Linebrink after 2007. So what happens...those usually dependable guys, like a Scott Downs or Scott Shields, suddenly lose it and then you're stuck with ugly bullpen contracts. Just follow the Tampa Bay Rays bullpen construction model the last decade, or the A's (until they foolishly went for Johnson, falling into that same "must have closer" mode which Beane has always run away from, trading closers at peak value and replacing them with cheaper, more promising youngsters). Or even the Royals (but ignore the rest of their issues, like hitting and starting pitching).

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ May 29, 2014 -> 09:35 AM) Thats true, but I am not sure there is a sure thing out there. But there are some pretty big red flags on all the pitchers the Sox will likely have available at 3. Rodon is said to have reliever level control and struggles to pitch off his fastball, Kolek's frame is a concern as well as his lack of a plus secondary offering, Nola has concerns about his arm slot and ceiling, Hoffman obviously has the injury concern now, Holmes is thought to be physically maxed out. Jackson seems to be the consensus best bat in the draft, so I would roll the dice on him at a full slot rate especially since he has a pretty highly thought of hit tool, which is something that the OF's in the system seriously lack. I would be more inclined to take Hoffman than any of the rest IF he would sign for what he is projected to get from the BJ's at the 11th pick. That would allow the Sox to have an additional $3M dollars to go over slot throughout the draft, which would essentially allow then to go over slot in rounds 2 and three to sign guys that slip and sign guys like Octavio Rodriguez that they drafted late last season. Hoffman is just too much risk for the #3 pick. The highest someone in that situation before went is Giolito. The mid teens. You're talking a year before he's pitching again, another year to bounce back to form (hopefully, if all goes well)...then you're pushing him back all the way into 2017 or 2018. The White Sox are going to want a more immediate contributor than that...unless they believe that Aiken/Kolek are potential aces who can quickly get to the big leagues while Chris Sale/Abreu are still the core of the foundation in Chicago.

QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ May 29, 2014 -> 09:43 AM) You need a lot more than 3 starters. Our pen sucks. I wouldn't count on a single pitcher in a playoff situation. We're still 2-3 years away. Trade Beckham. Trade Ramirez. Coming into 2005, our best reliever was Takatsu (other than Marte), and he lasted what, 2 months? Jenks wasn't even on the radar, and Hermanson was a flier because of his injury problems. Politte, Cotts and Vizcaino? For the last six weeks, until Lindstrom went down, Petricka/Putnam/Belisario/Webb were all pitching very well or great in the cases of the first three guys. Now, they're out of their natural roles and starting to struggle again. You get a reliable guy at the back of that pen and everything falls into place. You don't need to reinvent the wheel and sign Dotel/Linebrink to huge veteran contracts to solidify things. In fact, the only really bad signing (other than Paulino) has been a veteran LHP in Downs who has a mid to low 2's ERA for the last seven years, but looks cooked now.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ May 29, 2014 -> 09:08 AM) I believe much of that had to attitude and off the field issues, not effectiveness. Well, I guess they're interrelated, the DUI and cocaine use, etc. Change of scenery guy, wasn't totally reliable last year....lot of appearances and mileage on that arm. An ERA of almost 4 is pretty high for a relief pitcher in the NL West, where you have those huge ballparks.

Any talk of a long-term deal for Gordon Beckham is at least two months too early...and there's just no compelling reason to do it, other than to give him more confidence about his future with the organization. Do we need yet another Teahen/Keppinger situation? For whatever reason, having the competition behind seems to be pushing him to elevate his game to another level (for now). If there weren't 3 prospects right behind him that could all play 2B, then it would be more of a consideration, but that's not the case.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ May 29, 2014 -> 09:30 AM) A lot of these guys will have options picked up, have retired, or are simply bad, but there are plenty of interesting names on the list that there will be options. Brett Anderson * Josh Beckett Chad Billingsley * Joe Blanton * A.J. Burnett * Chris Capuano Bruce Chen * Wei-Yin Chen * Kevin Correia Johnny Cueto * Jorge De La Rosa Ryan Dempster Scott Feldman Gavin Floyd Yovani Gallardo * Jason Hammel J.A. Happ * Aaron Harang Dan Haren * Roberto Hernandez Luke Hochevar Hisashi Iwakuma Josh Johnson Kyle Kendrick Hiroki Kuroda John Lannan Colby Lewis Jon Lester Paul Maholm Justin Masterson Brandon McCarthy Brandon Morrow * Jeff Niemann Ross Ohlendorf Felipe Paulino * Jake Peavy Wandy Rodriguez Max Scherzer James Shields Carlos Villanueva Ryan Vogelsong Edinson Volquez Jerome Williams From this list, only Iwakuma (and he's not going anywhere), Shields, Scherzer and Lester would push us into playoff contention just by their signing. Masterson, a lot of the glow is wearing off of now. Vogelsong, maybe...but then going from the NL to the AL, USCF compared to PacBell, etc.

QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ May 29, 2014 -> 09:25 AM) I don't think Viciedo is close to his peak yet. I also wouldn't make moves that hinder long term development for the sake of possibly competing for a WC this year. This staff is not good enough to advance in the playoffs. I want to compete for World Series, not wild cards. Unless there's another 2009 version of Jake Peavy out there, or 2004 Jose Contreras...a seemingly bad contract that only requires a little bit of talent in return and not a megadeal like the Freddie Garcia one for Reed/Olivo/Morse. Another quality starter to go along with the Sale and Quintana, all bets are off in a playoff series which also involves Abreu's healthy bat.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 29, 2014 -> 09:15 AM) A scout in Charlotte is more likely to have two things... Knowledge of the White Sox organization, and first hand accounts of scouting these players. Lakso didn't have to have a question asked or answered to hear someone talking about who the Sox are looking at, while in the pressbox thinking that no one is listening. It could also be a complete misdirection. There is no way of knowing for sure, but I like this source better than many. Or, he simply knows a lot of scouts and was spitballing to see if any of them would go "off the record" with what they've heard the White Sox were going to do...OR, they deliberately are putting bad information out there to throw other teams off, although having Nola in the Top 4-5 corresponds to a lot of independent reports out there recently. In the beginning, we always heard they weren't as high on Kolek, but then a lot of contrary accounts have been introduced. What was Bowden's draft (ESPN Insider)?

QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ May 29, 2014 -> 09:14 AM) A+: Alexei Ramriez A: Jose Abreu, Jake Petricka, Chris Sale A-: Conor Gillaspie, Zach Putnam B+: Jose Quintana, Daniel Webb B: Gordon Beckham, Tyler Flowers, Dayan Viciedo B-: Adam Dunn, Adrian Nieto, Hector Noesi, Andre Rienzo C+: John Danks, Adam Eaton, Matt Lindstrom, Marcus Semien C: Scott Carroll, Leury Garcia C-: Moises Sierra D+: Ronald Belisario, Erik Johnson D: Maikel Cleto, Jordan Danks, Scott Downs, Paul Konerko F: Alejandro De Aza, Felipe Paulino How can Sierra be lower than Semien or L. Garcia? What did you honestly expect out of Nieto, when he was in High A last year? Belisario a D+ when he was one of the best/most consistent middle relievers in baseball for six weeks?

QUOTE (bmags @ May 29, 2014 -> 09:07 AM) Greg said a point I agreed with yesterday, it seems like this team has been way more successful than 1 game over .500. I've enjoyed this season more than any other run since the 2010 24-7 run (my favorite sox team that did not make the playoffs). Grade As: Sale, Abreu, Eaton, Gillaspie, Ramirez, Petricka, Dunn Grade Bs: Beckham, Viciedo, Quintana, Webb, Bellinelli, Flowers, Grade Cs: Sierra, Danks, Nieto, Rienzo, Carroll, rest of bullpen Grade Ds: De Aza, Downs, Francisco Have we joined the NBA? He might get two or three grades....a B+ overall, a D for his first two weeks, an A for the last 5-6 weeks as a 7th/8th inning guy and then the last week as a closer (C-), which he's ill-equipped for. Sierra's at least a B- because he was the worst hitter in baseball his first 40-50 AB's and has been at least semi-productive (700ish OPS, GW RBI, good arm and growing more comfortable defensively by the day in Chicago). Francisco is about as relevant as Leesman's ill-fated start. In fact, Cleto's a lot more interesting to discuss than Francisco. Considering what was expected, and that the Cardinals and Royals gave up on him completely, I could give him a B-/C+. Lindstrom's hard to grade, too...since I never thought he should have been the closer, either. I guess a C/C-.

Rock/Bucket, etc. Did anyone hear of the White Sox looking at the 2nd tier of FA starters (Tim Hudson, Kazmir, Phil Hughes, Feldman, Haren, Josh Johnson) in a serious way? Nolasco was discussed a bit, I know...at least around here.

What's more troubling is his reaction to pitching without any days of rest. As a closer, you just have to be ready to go back to back...and even back to back to back. With 77 appearances last year, and the Dodgers basically letting him walk, you have to know that durability/stamina is a concern. Runners in scoring position, 2 outs, opposing batters are 8/17 with a 1.056 OPS. Pitching on 0 days of rest, opposing batters are putting up a 946 OPS is almost 50 AB's.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 29, 2014 -> 08:48 AM) The draft isn't supposed to be all that strong, and is high school heavy. I got in trouble for pointing out taking a HS kid in the second round, chances are he won't be able to help you , if at all, until 2019 or 2020. The Sox compensation for signing a QO free agent, wasn't going to be much lower ever. To get one next offseason, they probably will have to give up a first round pick. They gave up a first rounder for Dunn. Or they could sign Kendrys Morales, after the draft. The problem is they would have to sign him to a deal through at least 2015, if not 2016 (with the idea of Dunn being traded and Morales replacing him). But then how much are you willing to pay Morales? He already turned down that $14.1 million/one year offer from the Mariners, so you're looking at paying him essentially the same as Dunn, albeit on a 1 1/2 or 2 1/2 year deal instead of 4.

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ May 29, 2014 -> 08:37 AM) Johnson could be, but if that was the Sox line of thinking you would think that they would have started the process of working him in the OF. If you move Semien to short, that adds Carlos Sanchez into the mix as being an extra asset. Johnson didn't even know about this POSSIBLE plan, until a reporter told him that Hahn had hinted at it...but only when the organization felt he was completely comfortable offensively (which kind of makes no sense, because once someone's comfortable in ONE position, why would you want to run the risk of moving them somewhere else unless it would be a clear upgrade?) Is Johnson/Eaton/Garcia (or Eaton/Johnson/Garcia) a more productive outfield than Viciedo/Eaton/Garcia? Where's the power going to come from, besides Abreu and possibly Viciedo at DH? Can Viciedo even be effective as a DH/1B? Or Davidson, for that matter.

QUOTE (Jenksismyb**** @ May 29, 2014 -> 08:20 AM) Again, awful analogy. Someone articulate what law could have been passed to prevent this shooting. The only answer is a complete gun ban, which is never going to happen. So continue arguing in hypotheticals if you wish, but down here in the real world it seems to me this particular shooting could have been avoided if the police/family did their jobs. And even then I dunno if that's 100% true. I'm fine with nearly all the restrictions that CA has passed. I'm not sure what else could have been done here. In the end, in our society, we tend to give the benefit of the doubt (innocent until proven guilty)...because we just don't want to believe that there are so many monsters out there. In retrospect, we can blame his psychologist, his parents, some of his best friends (particularly James Ellis, who say many glimpses of his Day of Retribution and simply chose to end the relationship/friendship)....and then he had three contacts with the police. Once, when tried to knock partygoers off a ledge in 2013 and ended up being pushed down himself and breaking his ankle, pushing his initial plans back from Halloween, 2013. Next, when he reported his roommate (citizen's arrest) for stealing $22 worth of candles. Finally, when some of his disturbing youtube rants were online in late 2013 (anonymous tip, he believed it might have been his father or mother or stepmother) and seven police officers came to his door, but they didn't check his apartment or search because there was no probable cause of an imminent threat...plus those handguns were legally registered. He was more concerned about his diary/plans falling into the hands of the police, and that would have required a fairly extensive search. I do wonder how many of those officers (if any) that were called out that day saw one or all of those videos, and, looking back on all of them now, if they missed anything that could have pushed them into action that day. Obviously, a lot of lawsuits against the police will be forthcoming, due to that particular situation and the fact that he escaped by calmly talking his way out of it.

It's worthwhile to remember we were willing to commit around $150 million or so to Tanaka, at least $125-135 million. Young and potential ace >>> Solid #3 starter. At least out of that position in the draft. That said, if you can project him as "undervalued" and having many similarities with Wacha, that's one thing. The problem is that if you pick him THAT high, you better be able to save a ton of money to use later in the draft or you're not exploiting any advantage at all. It's when you get a Wacha at 19 that you're really "stealing" someone out from underneath everyone.

QUOTE (IowaSoxFan @ May 29, 2014 -> 08:18 AM) I wonder if the Sox prefer Johnson or Semien, they both are both in play for the same roster spot down the road. To me, it seems they prefer Semien, otherwise he would be in AAA being showcased for a trade as I think they are doing with Micah at this point. They have three MLB or near MLB ready 2B and really only room for one, so I think there will be a couple of deals involving Beckham and Johnson before opening day 2015. Yes, EJ has a much better shot at rejoining the rotation, but I was never as high on him as some around here, but I think he can develop into a capable back end of the rotation starter. I feel like the key is to not panic and push too many chips in to compete at a fringe level this season. Keep building up the system with astute pickups like Rondon, Montas, Danish, Michalzewski, and such, and build the depth of the organization to a point where it is able to produce ML talent on an annual basis and allow the team to trade off veteran assets to fill gaps like bringing in Avisail last season. The problem is that our only (current) asset which gets you the aforementioned/highlighted players is Alexei Ramirez. If the White Sox really know who they're projecting and where out of the Micah Johnson/Semien/Carlos Sanchez group...you can package one of those guys with someone else, but you're obviously going to be selling low on Marcus. Gordon Beckham's only 27 and COULD be in the prime of his career...although many times hopes have been raised, only to be cruelly dashed against the rocks of despair/frustration with him.

BOSTON — The Yankees may be targeting Masahiro Tanaka as their big free-agent splash this winter, and they may be doing so at the perfect time. Yankees assistant general manager Billy Eppler spent time in Japan last month (September, 2013), getting a look at Tanaka. According to reports out of Japan, the Rangers, Red Sox and Diamondbacks were among the other teams that have scouted the righthander in person in recent months. So at the latest, August/September last year. http://www.thegreedypinstripes.com/2013/05...iro-tanaka.html Here's an article from last May.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 29, 2014 -> 08:05 AM) The combined salaries of Downs + De Aza are comparable to what the White Sox ate with Jeff Keppinger. They're nothing. What I mean is how patient will Hahn/FO and Ventura be with them...neither of them are part of the long-term future of the team, as you can make an argument both ways about Beckham (who additionally has Semien/Sanchez/Micah Johnson all thundering up behind him).

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 29, 2014 -> 08:11 AM) By that logic, he won the game, so he did his job. This is starting to sound like all the arguments about Bobby Jenks his last couple of seasons with the Sox, lol.

Look at the Tigers/A's game last night... Nathan basically threw his rookie 3B (Castellanos) under the bus, and so did his manager Ausmus. It's Nathan's job to pitch over mistakes or "could have/should have" been outs. In the end, a closer is defined by his performance in those situations, like it or not. The fact of the matter is that even though Belisario's pitched in some difficult circumstances/situations, and that's uncontrollable on his part...his performance after a mistake happens is controllable. The White Sox won the game, everyone went home happy and Sierra had a nice "comeback/redemption" moment, but both the defense and the pitching needs to be better for this team to make it to the next level. Granted, it's a bit unfair to get all over Belisario, he was never expected to close a single game for the White Sox when he was signed as a bounceback candidate, but that's the current situation that he's facing, like it or not. There's probably not a small amount of trepidation about putting Webb or Petricka in that position already, combined with the HOPES that Belisario can get on a really hot streak and make himself a "sell high" candidate at the deadline.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ May 29, 2014 -> 07:57 AM) We really have no payroll issues at all. We have only one bad contract (Danks), and he's managed to remain effective enough to at least hold down a rotation spot. That we could simply cut Keppinger is evidence that the front office agrees. Anyway, the effect of that should be that the front office should NOT feel pressured to eat salary. It should all about maximizing talent this year. We'll see. We have a ton of games on the road in the month of June, with Abreu back starting on Monday. Downs and DeAza, in particular, are the ones under the most scrutiny for the moment.