caulfield12

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Jul 20, 2012 -> 08:33 AM) Ravelo still on Restricted List, been out about 2 weeks now. I hope his kid is OK. I would love to know what happened in that W-S game. Looks like Collop hit a Carolina batter with a pitch, and a fight ensued. Salvador Sanchez finally gives up some runs. Bring up Sanchez, he'll fit in perfectly now.

Admirable is ONE possible word, lol.

1B Fielder over Konerko, although Paulie would have had the advantage up until a month ago. 2B Beckham is 18th out of 21 in OPS, at best average (overall) 2B, but Detroit has gotten little out of Santiago/Raburn, etc. This will change when/if the Tigers make a trade. SS Ramirez with an edge over Peralta due to his defense and hot bat the last 4-6 weeks 3B Cabrera over Youk, although Kevin's been great since joining the Sox with 5 game-winning RBI's LF Even, as Young has been on a huge tear recently CF Jackson, with DeAza fading recently, especially against LHP...not enough walks, too many K's on breaking pitches RF Rios in a runaway C AJ this year, Avila last year DH Dunn over Young/Boesch/Berry/Worth combination Tigers 3 White Sox 5 Even 1 Although in all fairness, Berry has been very important recently and he doesn't really fit into any one position as he's been playing CF, LF and DHing. Verlander and Sale, even, Verlander has almost identical numbers to last year when he was MVP, just a tick higher in ERA Scherzer and Peavy, slight advantage to White Sox, Max has the better stuff, Peavy has been much more consistent and should be a 10+ game winner if not for our inconsistent offense and bullpen...recently, Scherzer has been dominating and leads the AL in K/9 Quintana over Fister, although this also could change again... Porcello over ???, if it's Floyd/Danks, it's basically about even....if Humber, then advantage Tigers Smyly/Turner over Axelrod/Hernandez/Stults et al Smyly was an early favorite for AL Rookie of the Year before succumbing to injuries White Sox 2 Tigers 2 Even 1 Bullpen...don't even want to think or talk about right now

Snider would make a lot more sense for us to replace Viciedo, after we traded for a starting pitcher. Not that I'm advocating it... Makes no sense for the Tigers, at all. They're currently down one pitcher until Smyly comes back, and he's struggled with staying healthy this year. Turner got bombed his last time out.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 20, 2012 -> 08:34 AM) And when he did, Cody f***ing Ross killed him. It isn't like Addison gave up a sacrifice fly to tie or lose the game. He gave up a bomb of a homer. And Ross was something like 3 for 28 against RHP before that at-bat last night against Reed. Valentine had 3-4 lefties he could have gone to. So, overall, Valentine made the bad decision to face Youkilis instead of Dunn, Ventura struggled with the bullpen twice...so Valentine overall won that match-up, largely because of last night.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 20, 2012 -> 07:58 AM) Or he just wanted to make sure Youk didn't hurt himself worse in a game that was only worth one in the standings, when you have three games this weekend which are worth two game swings in the standings. Except the problem is that the Red Sox more than likely will be our chief competition for the Wild Card spot, should DET pass us by. There's a huge difference between 2 1/2 games, 4 1/2 and 6 1/2...at the very worst, we should have split with them.

Not sure what stage I'm in since I saw Thornton coming into the game last night, but anger is still probably the first one on my mind. Somewhere between anger and denial. Who would have thought that an unknown kid from Colombia and Axelrod would come in and dominate the Red Sox that series and we'd still somehow manage to lose 3/4? It's pretty clear even if they did trade Viciedo...that there are so many holes in that bullpen it still might not even matter. So I started thinking 2012 is like 2001 was for the Twins and we're possibly one year away with all the rookies on this team... I just never want to see Matt Thornton pitch again for the White Sox after this year. That's all. He folds under pressure every time. Someone will make the excuse about Escobar's mistake and say that Gonzalez was 0 for 7 career-wise before that at-bat, but you just KNEW he wasn't going to be able to retire him, even when it was 0-2. http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/team/_/stat/p...nded/order/true The AL AVERAGE for blown saves is only 10. We're at 15, 3 ahead of any other AL team. That's basically one per every 6 games, more than one per week. You just can't have that if you want to make the playoffs, let alone ADVANCE in the playoffs. There's just no reason we shouldn't be 12-14 games over .500. The Tigers wouldn't be breathing down our necks if we just had a decent bullpen.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/20/us/colorado-....html?hpt=hp_t1 They've revised the death toll (for now) down from 14-15 to 12. 38 injured. Columbine was on April 20th (1999), this one was July 20th. Of course, that one involved two shooters, who ended up dead, and they had 17 total victims if I remember correctly. If you remember your 90's history, there were those three events, the Branch Davidian/David Koresh/Waco fire (April 19, 1993), the Oklahoma City bombing by McVeigh (April 19th, 1995)...and then Columbine four years later. I'm guessing there's probably more connection with the Batman premiere and Bane than anything to do with Columbine, though. Apparently the shooter was 24 years old and his car had Tennessee plates. Had an apartment there in Aurora.

QUOTE (PorkChopExpress @ Jul 19, 2012 -> 02:31 PM) He's like Sampson, only instead of his strength being in his hair, it was in his fat. That's like Ralph, the basketball player. Samson

QUOTE (pittshoganerkoff @ Jul 20, 2012 -> 06:04 AM) I haven't seen a loss like last night in a while. Robin has done a great job with this team, but he made some really bad decisions last night. First, why didn't Youkilis pinch hit for Escobar? Lefty-righty s*** be damned, Youk was the much better option there. And why oh why did Thornton start that inning? If he wanted a lefty to face Crawford, let Quintana pitch to him. I could hear the diasappointment in Hawk's voice from the beginning of the inning. He knew it was a bad decision, too. Oh well. I hope that loss doesn't start a downward spiral going into Detroit. 2 of 3 is almost a must this weekend. As long as we don't get swept. That's the only disaster in the making. The Tigers have every bit of positive momentum in the world behind them and they're going to have 3 standing room only crowds. At any rate, you can't back into the playoffs, or even a Wild Card spot. If we had played .500 against Boston this season (and the bullpen gave away two games in this series, we were only outplayed in the Hernandez start), we'd be 52-40 and they would be 6 1/2 games behind us, not JUST 2 1/2 with Ortiz the only one they're waiting for in the regular line-up to return. Youkilis must have been really hurt worse than we were led to believe (see Danks and hopefully we'll get positive word on Floyd today) if he wasn't available to pinch hit for Escobar in the 9th. If Ross just slightly tipped that ball a different direction, it doesn't bounce into the stands, Viciedo scores, the lead in the bottom of the 9th is 2-0 and you can breathe a little easier to start the inning.

Guess one of them was a baby. Don't know why you bring a baby to a midnight premiere... The first thing I thought of was Columbine when I heard it was in Denver. Two mass shootings now. http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/20/us/colorado-....html?hpt=hp_t1 14 dead, 50 wounded as of 641 a.m.

QUOTE (Wanne @ Jul 20, 2012 -> 01:00 AM) I just wonder what ever happened to the time-honored tradition of never taking a guy out pitching a shutout? Get's old... According to Elias, Quintana (2.30 ERA) is the first pitcher since 1900 to have three scoreless outings of eight innings with a no-decision. Probably the reason this has never happened before for 112 years. A lot more rare than a perfect game, what has transpired with Quintana in only 10 big league starts.

Evoking memories of Quintana’s eight scoreless innings that went down the tubes against the Dodgers in Los Angeles on June 17, manager Robin Ventura went to his bullpen with another 1-0 lead only to watch his pen fail. That time, general manager Ken Williams questioned the move. Ventura stuck to his guns and to his bullpen this time, calling on lefty Matt Thornton with lefties Carl Crawford and Adrian Gonzalez batting first and third in the ninth. They sandwiched singles around what could’ve been a double-play ball to rookie third baseman Eduardo Escobar but was only a force at second because of a low throw to Gordon Beckham. After Gonzalez’s single, Reed entered to face Ross. “It was supposed to be a fastball away, and it sailed over the plate, and he got a good piece on it,” Reed said. “It’s unfortunate. [Quintana] threw his butt off, and there’s nothing else he could have done. He did everything. It sucks that we didn’t come out with a win.” Ventura considered staying with Quintana, a lefty, to face Crawford to start the inning, but Quintana had to extend himself in the seventh and eighth innings. “You can go back out there with him, but you are eventually going to go to those [bullpen] guys anyway if he gets in trouble,’’ Ventura said. “So you go to the guys who are fresh.’’ The Dodgers game did cross Ventura’s mind. “Yeah, it is similar,’’ he said. “But he did his job, and he got out of some tough spots. So that’s my call: to take him out and bring somebody else in.’’ According to Elias, Quintana (2.30 ERA) is the first pitcher since 1900 to have three scoreless outings of eight innings with a no-decision. He had no objection to the move. “That’s the manager’s choice,’’ he said. “It’s one of those that this is going to happen. It won’t be the first or the last time.’’ Daryl Van Schouwen www.suntimes.com/sports

http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/team/_/stat/p...nded/order/true White Sox now have 15 blown saves. 3 ahead of any team in the AL. We're making the Boston bullpen look good, actually...at least in recent weeks. We have enough offense, even though it's inconsistent. But teams just can't survive so many blown saves that turn into losses about 75% of the time. It just eats the heart right out of your starters and eventually infects the whole team. We saw it to start 2011...it's happening again.

Trading Viciedo is idiotic and it doesn't matter how many rental players names are come up with, they will all be stupid. The only ones that make ANY sense are Garza, Hamels and Greinke, and it will be another decade or more before JR agrees to shell out $20-30 million per season on a contract for a pitcher lasting 5 years or longer. So that nullifies all but Garza. But it's the same thing we went through with Hudson for Jackson, 1 1/2 seasons (actually, it was just one because they had to deal him to eat Teahen's ill-advised contract)...trading Viciedo for Garza, then watching him put up 30-40 homers per year along with Rizzo, no thanks. Danks was a mistake. They're not going to compound it by doubling down.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 19, 2012 -> 09:20 PM) AL Central isn't out of the question, and tonight's outcome is no reason to lose hope yet. I do agree that giving up anything from the Major League roster for a rental would be a bad decision. If Scherzer, Berry, Young and Boesch keep playing as well as they have been recently, the Tigers just have the overwhelming talent advantage because we can't survive with a powerless .234 hitting Paul Konerko and a .200-ish Dunn against Fielder and Cabrera. You know the Tigers are going to make at least one of two moves. Another starter and a 2B, probably Omar Infante.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jul 19, 2012 -> 09:24 PM) Excellent point. Eskie must go in that scenario. Hudson can only play 2B. That's his problem. And he's not an especially effective pinch-runner either, no better than Danks or Escobar there at this point in his career.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jul 19, 2012 -> 09:18 PM) Escobar doesn't need to be cut, for f***'s sake he had a bad 9th inning let it rest. I'm very interested in the decision to use Thornton because it makes me think that Reed may have a sore arm going or something. Couldn't have thrown Q out there, he had been skating on thin ice for two innings. Anyone hear the post game interviews yet? I'm out of market and I don't get that stuff. More run scoring would have been nice. The thing with this team this year hasn't been that we haven't had bad losses, bad series -- it's that they've been isolated incidents. We may not dominate this weekend, but I can't expect this team to play bad ball. Let's go boys! Quintana barely had 100 pitches and had made Crawford look bad all game long. The only debate was starting Reed in the 9th or letting Quintana get Crawford out, then going to Reed. Anyone following the White Sox since August of 2009 knows that Matt Thornton is a disaster in those situation. Something always goes wrong, defense behind him, giving up 2 hits in 2 at-bats to lefties, he just doesn't have the cojones that Quintana, a rookie, has exhibited all season long. If Reed's not healthy, then why would you even bring him in for Ross/Middlebrooks? This loss is 50% Ventura, 25% the offense, 25% Escobar/Thornton/Reed. Reed made an absolutely horrible/terrible pitch there. But, he's a rookie. The chickens are starting to come home to roost in this series with all the rookies. Septimo the other night, Reed and Escobar spoiling things tonight.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jul 19, 2012 -> 09:13 PM) Kudos to Quintana for absolutely dominating some of the best offenses in baseball. He's a keeper. Quintana has been nothing short of amazing. But there's no way in hell I'm trading Viciedo for a quick fix just to get a Wild Card when the entire bullpen is in total disarray. There's just too much to fix there. They don't have a single reliable LH reliever and Jones has been terrible recently. Crain, when healthy, hasn't been as good as 2011. The other problem is that the league has seemingly figured DeAza out (destroy him with offspeed stuff), Dunn's slumping and closing in on .200 and Konerko doesn't have the ability to "turn and burn" as Hawk says. Just way too many holes right now to gamble the future on one more starting pitcher.

QUOTE (justBLAZE @ Jul 19, 2012 -> 09:11 PM) Surprised no one mentions that Edwardo Escobar, does not make a routine double play, if he can't do that, what exactly is he doing on this team? He had two good at-bats in that game, but that's what happens when you're not playing your natural position (SS) for the first season of your career. Rookies aren't made for pennant races. And we have too many of them. The only one who has manned up all season long is Quintana. And we just can't get any bounces to go our way. Beckham's ball should have stayed in the park and been a double or triple, and they would have started that inning with at least a 2-0 lead.

QUOTE (Melissa1334 @ Jul 19, 2012 -> 09:07 PM) with the pen, its not like we have great arms that are struggling,theyre just not that goos Matt Thornton has been bad in any important situation for two years now, since the Thome walk-off grand slam. He's just not reliable when you really need him. I guarantee if he faces Fielder in Detroit he'll give up a huge hit, probably a homer.

How many thought that Thornton was actually going to do something good there? I wonder if it was Cooper's call. If so, it was idiotic. 2-6 against the team we'll probably end up fighting for the last wild card spot. Escobar didn't help. BUT SOMETHING BAD ALWAYS HAPPENS WHEN THORNTON IS IN FOR THE 9TH. It's inevitable. I will be happy when they buy out his contract and send him packing. He just doesn't have a secondary pitch to get a batter out when he needs it. Gonzalez was down 0-2, of course, he throws him a hittable FB out over the plate. There was nothing surprising at all about the way that inning unfolded. Ventura picks the 3rd best option there. Either Quintana or Reed, either one, would have been better. Seriously, Ozzie Guillen was better at managing bullpens than Ventura has been the last couple of weeks. Yes, he doesn't have many reliable options, but that wasn't a bullpen question for the 6th/7th/8th. That was do you stay with Quintana for Crawford (who he'd retired easily all game long) or bring in Reed to start the inning? No other debate there to have.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jul 19, 2012 -> 04:36 PM) You've gotta be trollin' me. I think it's a back-handed slap at our two great acquisitions (for the priceless right for the Marlins to negotiate with Ozzie) by KW. Who knows? He only pitched one time. He looked to have a live arm, questionable control and suspect breaking stuff. Kind of like half our bullpen from game to game.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 19, 2012 -> 04:06 PM) So what about Barnum Coming back: First baseman Keon Barnum, the Sox's second pick in the June amateur draft, is expected to resume playing for Advanced Rookie-Bristol this week. Barnum, who batted .421 with three home runs and seven RBIs in five games, is recovering from a sore left shoulder.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ Jul 19, 2012 -> 04:16 PM) The way Jones has pitched for the last month or so you have to wonder why he wasn't sent down instead of Martinez. I think it's because he's one of the guys they're looking to deal. Marinez