Kenny Hates Prospects

QUOTE (ChiSox_Sonix @ Nov 6, 2009 -> 09:35 AM) Proposing we go after players like Gamel is equivalent to people on the Padres/Orioles/Mariners/etc... boards proposing they try to go after Beckham No it's not. The Brewers are said to be considering using Gamel to get pitching. Also, Gamel is nothing like Beckham. Gamel may have the potential to hit more home runs, but he's no sure thing like Gordon.

QUOTE (Tony82087 @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 06:20 PM) No it doesn't. Someone leaked the information. I'm going to assume both Williams and Moore are very unhappy with this. Obviously, there is something holding this deal back. That means both sides have not agreed to the terms. If they can't, then Getz and Fields stay put, for now. I certainly don't think they are past the point of no return. It's a rumor that got leaked. Simple as that. I get what you're saying, but this reported deal came out early this morning in the newspaper and as of the evening both Getz and Teahen didn't know what was going on. Clearly the Sox and Royals both know the report is out there. If a deal was being worked on but not pretty much agreed on and finished, then both clubs would have notified their players and said nothing was going on, don't you think? There was a report a couple years ago that came out saying we traded Garland to the Astros, and another report last year saying we had dealt Dye to the Reds for Bailey. The Sox IIRC reacted pretty quickly on those, but not this one. Plus Cowley has supposedly gotten enough confirmation for the Sun Times to put the story up. I agree that it was all leaked early and that both teams are probably very pissed about it. But I think the talks are real, the names are right (although there could be others), the framework is pretty much all there, and they haven't said anything because they're expecting to finalize it soon.

QUOTE (PlunketChris @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 06:03 PM) So.. is this deal actually happening or was everyone jumping the gun on a strong rumor? This has to be going down because as others have said in this thread, the Sox wouldn't leave these guys hanging if this wasn't pretty much done. There's something else keeping this from being finished though, and that we don't know.

QUOTE (MHizzle85 @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 11:10 AM) But it's rumored that we get Big Nog/Velasquez. That would excite me plenty. Panic move by the UFC IMO. This would be the first matchup for Cain that will give him major trouble, and if he loses, the card they're planning in Mexico is going to take a serious hit. I don't see the logic in this from a business standpoint. Pat Barry just had an impressive win over Hardonk on SpikeTV, so they should have went Cain-Barry or something and then set Nog up with somebody else.

QUOTE (hitlesswonder @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 05:42 PM) Nix won't even be on the Sox next season. If you read Cowley's article, Guillen and Sox management don't like Nix and his K-tastic bat one bit. They have already told Nix that he won't be on the roster unless he magically makes himself into an actual contact hitter. And that's not going to happen. They'll keep Lillibridge up next season before they keep Nix. I'm pretty sure I'm at least partly responsible for reviving the Getz-Nix crap by saying in the AFL thread that CJ Retherford could take Nix's job, but you can't say such things around here unless you want to argue. And I agree with you, the Sox are going to make it very hard on Nix this Spring Training and right now it's not looking good for him.

QUOTE (b-Rye @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 05:35 PM) Another BAD trade. Besides getting CQ/Peavy when's the last time we made a decent trade. Getz is better than Teahen and will be cheaper, younger, for more years. Getz is faster, better OBP, Defense. We can't compete with Yankees/Angels/BoSox/Twins unless we get some REAL TALENT here not trading young talent for average players. I think you can make an argument between Getz and Teahen depending on who you are and what you're looking for from this team, but I'm pretty sure there's not a $4M difference in ability between the two. We're not comparing two 2B either because Mark Teahen doesn't belong at 2B any more than Wilson Betemit belonged at SS. I'm still holding out a tiny shred of hope that the deal looks lopsided in favor of the Royals only because we're about to dump Linebrink off on them.

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 05:05 PM) Throw out the college stats, i'm not interested in metal bat fueled numbers. Getz's career minor league OBP is .362. Over two years in AA Getz put up .326 and .382 , In AAA .366. Averaging out Getz's OBP is the upper levels of the system we put his OBP around .350. Now, Getz put up a .324 OPB in the majors ,after dealing with a broken wrist which could just sap him of a lot of his strength and quickness. Now, given Getzs' complete lack of pop it's likely he will be pitched too rather then around. Allowing for major league improvement and an approach rather then a match of his minor league numbers, i'd suggest that .340 is very possible, if not probable. Hahaha... like pitchers are gonna f*** around with Jayson Nix. Oooh, Nix has pop, better watch out! They'll continue to eat him alive the same way they go after Josh Fields. Why? Because he sucks. I honestly had no major problem with Nix until you started all this. I thought he was a decent bench player and that's it. But now, I'm really beginning to strongly dislike that kind young man.

QUOTE (Kalapse @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 01:24 PM) They could also just wait until December 12th and sign Teahen as a free agent when he's non-tendered by the Royals. Of course then you have to enter into a large scale bidding war with the other 28 teams in baseball all chomping at the bit to get their hands on Mark Teahen. Yeah I know. He's a nice player and he can help a contending ballclub over a 162 game season quite a bit as a bench guy, but IMO he's a $2M player tops, and he's going to get $4M+ in arb, which is why I won't be happy with this unless it's a salary dump of another player. It might be wishful thinking on my part, but maybe the Royals want to save face and trade Teahen for something rather than cut the centerpiece of the Beltran deal and get nothing. To me, Teahen for Fields straight up is a fair trade. I'm hoping the inclusion of Getz, and maybe a prospect, is the price we have to pay to send out Linebrink. But again, probably wishful thinking.

QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 01:15 PM) Someone enlighten me. How does this improve the Sox? To me it's just a trade to get rid of Josh Field. How is this Royal worth 2 or 1 1/2 players? They could have just cut Josh without adding salary. This is not a trade to get rid of someone, unless Linebrink or Paulie are involved, because they have contracts worth ridding.

[praying]Maybe we're all waiting on Linebrink to waive his no-trade clause?[/praying] But seriously, Dayton Moore traded for Tony Pena and Yuniughsky Betancourt. And he brought in Mike Jacobs. And signed Kyle Farnsworth. So surely he can work up a boner for Scott Linebrink, right? Right???

QUOTE (striker62704 @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 12:38 PM) What scenario would you rather have? 3B Beltre SS Ramirez 2B Beckham or 3B Beckham SS Ramirez 2B Polanco Just curious. This one because Beltre is probably the better bet to come on a 1-year deal. But the problem then becomes, how do we pay him when we just added $4M to Teahen? We've now got about $28.5-30M committed to Konerko, Jenks, Linebrink, and Teahen. No es bueno.

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 12:36 PM) Hypothetically, if Nix replaces Getz and Teahen replaces Q in LF, with Q moving to RF. Do we all still have an issue here? Yes because that means we suck.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 11:50 AM) Great signing. Such a versatile bench player. Key word, BENCH PLAYER. Agree, but the Teahen move already makes this feel a bit redundant. But I still love the signing anyway because Kotsay performs very well in his role and is definitely a winner and a solid presence in the clubhouse.

QUOTE (SoxFan562004 @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 12:18 PM) It's KW's M.O. and I like it. Any pro sport is such a mental game, 1st rounders have the raw talent at least and sometimes removing the pressure of being a teams hyped prospect helps. I think that's more true for talented pitchers than once highly-touted position players, and I don't see Teahen as a breakout candidate. This is much more Mackowiak-for-Marte than the Thornton, Gavin, or Quentin deals. Besides, I doubt there had been tons of pressure on him in KC. If the pressure has been on anyone there, it has been on Gordon.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 12:11 PM) Ya, I think I just commented how 4M could pretty much get you one of Hudson/Polanco (maybe add 1-3M). 2B don't make a done unless your Chase Utley. Polanco would have been nice too. Sigh... I want to know what the thinking is here, where Beckham is going or staying, why we need to pay so much for a UT guy (if that's what he'll be), or why Teahen is a starting RF on a contending ballclub. Because with CJ around and very close, and Getz and CJ both at the minimum, and with a ton of FA out there in a bad market, I just can't see any sense in this move, especially this quickly. Teahen must be another one of Kenny's "guys."

QUOTE (scenario @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 12:08 PM) I say we nix the Jayson/Chris debate before it getz ridiculous. Very well done.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 12:04 PM) Well there is a reason we agree most of the time!!! Then do you agree with this? My immediate thought upon looking at Teahen's salary was, "how much would it suck if Beltre or Hudson end up signing for about $6M?"

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 11:59 AM) The part that kills me is that I honestly think Mark would have been non-tendered. He has some tools and potential but in five years he hasn't lived up to it so why pay a premium for it like the Sox have. This really is a bad trade and I rarely hammer on Kenny. Damn it Chisoxfn, I was saying these exact same things pages back! You should have been here then so I wouldn't have had to type so much.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 11:52 AM) I personally hope we sell NIx. I don't like the way he plays the game. I agree. If we're going to put such an emphasis on utility players, let's bring in somebody who can actually back up SS.

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 11:41 AM) Nothing has changed. You were telling me that Nix wouldn’t have the job before Getz was gone, and now you’re telling me it again. At least, you’re being consistent. The only thing we lost in this trade was a liability, a liability that would have stayed with us, because of some misconceived notion of what makes a player “good.” The fact is Getz doesn’t have the raw potential of any of the guys that are going to take his job here. We lost nothing. I like Chris Getz; I’m not going to miss him Nix isn't going to start. Getz at $400K is not a liability, and you're still cutting his abilities short because you love Nix for some reason. Nix sucks as a starter. He's a decent backup, but he can't play SS very well, so he's not even the best option there either. I'm pissed about this trade because we just added over $4M to the payroll for a player that is easily replaceable.

QUOTE (fathom @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 11:38 AM) Disagree, as at least Nix is a great base runner and superior fielder. Both have the potential to hit for above average power with a low batting average. I would be shocked if Fields is even in the majors 3 years from now. Fields has tons more pop than Nix and for that reason I say he has much more potential. But that said, I don't expect anything from either.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 11:30 AM) Think about the other guy in this deal, Josh Fields. Josh Fields still has more potential than Jayson Nix.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 11:29 AM) Why is power such a big make up for not being able to hit the ball? He has alot of flaws at the plate and if he's on an island and not surrounded by a bunch of other power/k guys then maybe there is an argument. However, with the current makeup of the Sox, Getz is a much better fit, not only for SB's, but for contact rate and extending rally's to make other pitchers get more work. The good news is that Nix wont start anyway and he'll be mostly a sunday player. +1

QUOTE (Thunderbolt @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 11:25 AM) There's no hole. The hole is filled by a better player. Nix has more pop, better D, and a better minor league track record. Nix is not becoming a starter. Get that one out of your head.

QUOTE (CanOfCorn @ Nov 5, 2009 -> 11:25 AM) Oh KHP...you are taking this trade too seriously. Teahen needed to get out of KC. Fields needed to get out of Chi. Getz is a loss, but you have two or three possible replacements IN HOUSE! And the salary added isn't all that much in the grand scheme. Here's the thing: Teahen is going to make $4M+ in arbitration this year. We gave up value to get that. We could have spent a little more and picked up a real starter at a position of need on the FA market without giving up anything. We just pissed away over $4M of payroll flexibility on a player the Kansas City was going to have to think about non-tendering. This deal is moronic. In Kenny I do not trust, not this time. Bad deal.