Chicago White Sox

QUOTE (ron883 @ Oct 24, 2013 -> 04:06 PM) greg be trolling Does anyone else think "ron883" = "greg775"?

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Oct 24, 2013 -> 12:15 PM) I think the Sox can afford to wait another year before they trade any of their pitchers. Johnson and Rienzo could break out but we can't afford to deal Q if they don't. Also need 2014 to see if Danks comes back. If we trade Q it has to be a clear win. Otherwise see what teams like the Angels want because they have pieces that are available for pitching. Kendricks ,Conger and Bourjos can all help us. First off, not to be a dick, but it's Kendrick, no 's'. Second, why would you want him to be a big piece back for Quintana? He's already 30 years old, is only under contract for two more years at fairly large rates, and most importantly plays an easy position to fill and one where we actually have a decent amount of depth in the organization. He's a good player no doubt and the age doesn't really bother me as much as it would others, but I don't how he makes any sense as a long-term fit, especially at the expense of one of our best assets.

I think some people are undervaluing Lawrie here. Yes, he wasn't great last year, but he only turns 24 in January and has incredible tools. And even in 2012, which was a failure compared to his initial call-up, he was still able to put up a 2.5 WAR. I'm not saying you move Quintana for him straight-up, but if you can get a starting pitching prospect like Sanchez as well then you have to strongly consider the deal. Young 3B with elite potential are not easy to come by and this may be the type of gamble we need to take to fix this offense.

It would take a ton to get me to trade Quintana if I'm Rick Hahn. We're talking about a 25 year left-handed starter who will be under team control for 5 more years coming off a 3.7 WAR season. I'd want a major league position player of similar value plus a top pitching propsect. I doubt anyone bites on that, but the point is I'd want to be overwhelmed to move him.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 12:58 PM) Personally I think you are grossly understating our pitching depth, and I think the right move, if available, could take advantage of that. It's a gamble but it's the kind of gamble I'd consider if I were in Hahns chair. Please explain where all this pitching depth is.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 07:59 AM) Actually, if I had to guess, I'd bet Dunn slates in 5th in this lineup as currently constructed, with Garcia and Abreu ahead of him and probably Viciedo behind him. Maybe, although I personally see a 3-4-5 of Abreu-Dunn-Garcia. Either way, Dunn is likely going to be our only left-handed middle of the order bat next year.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 06:34 AM) Yet you made a line up recently with Grady Sizemore batting clean up. Headley could be the left handed power bat with a high OBP you are looking for. He plays in a pitchers park and was hurt most of last year. Headley is really a perfect fit for us. 2012 was clearly a fluke, but he's still been a productive player every other year since 2010. Get him away from Petco and into the Cell and 20 HRs seems very attainable. He's also a switch-hitter and gets on-base at a nice clip, which addresses two of our largest offensive concerns. On top of that, he's a pretty good defensive player. People need to look at how weak the 3B position is right now and reevaluate Chase Headley. Now, I'm not suggesting we go out and trade the farm for him right now. I fully expect the asking price for him to be too high for our blood. However, if you could acquire him for a reasonable price AND lock him up long-term I'd be all for it. He'd be a huge upgrade over what we through out at 3B last year.

QUOTE (Lillian @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 06:02 AM) That is the question we should all be addressing. You can be pretty certain that is what Hahn is contemplating. I don't have the answer, but I'm pretty convinced that it's the right question. What do you think? Well like it or not, Dunn will likely be our cleanup hitter this year. I don't disagree that long-term we'll need a left-handed bat to balance the middle of the lineup, but I doubt we'll add that player this year. McCann would probably be the one exception and even he is a huge long-shot.

QUOTE (Lillian @ Oct 23, 2013 -> 05:53 AM) I'm sorry, but I don't understand your point. To clarify mine; Adam Dunn may still be on the team, but our offense is not going to be competitive with him putting up last year's numbers, in the clean up spot. As many of you have argued, he needs to bat further down in the order. The number one priority now should be to find a decent left handed, clean up hitter, to replace him. Any suggestions?

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Oct 22, 2013 -> 10:41 PM) You don't get extra points for having a prototypical lineup. An upgrade is an upgrade. However much better a new player is than the incumbent, that's how much better your team gets. I don't agree with this at all. A well constructed offense can produce more than the sum of the individual parts. For example, a guy like Adam Dunn is going to be a lot more valuable to the Sox if there are people on-base when he hits his home-runs. Does adding a high OBP leadoff guy improve Dunn's WAR? No, but it can make him more productive. I'm not accusing you of this, but WAR is never going to be the be-all-end-all. At the end of the day, baseball is still a team sport and WAR will never be able to account for everything. Not all upgrades in terms of WAR are necessarily equal.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 22, 2013 -> 02:00 PM) I wouldn't give up scraps for him. He's a highly paid, small upgrade on what we currently have at 3b and he's a free agent at the end of the year. That's the exact opposite of what the White Sox should target in trades if they give away anything of value. How is he a small upgrade? Even in a down year compared to 2012 he still posted a 3.6 WAR, which would make him a top 8 3B from what I can tell. You must have a lot higher hopes for a Gillaspinger platoon than I do. While I think they might be serviceable, Headley would be a huge improvement, even if 2012 proves to be a outlier.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Oct 22, 2013 -> 12:48 PM) Back to CF .Ellsbury I'd take in a heartbeat. Brett Gardner . I've seen defenders and haters on DeAza and maybe he'll bounce back but if it's possible to get value for him I'd say go for it. Jordan Danks could replace him as the 4th outfielder. I've seen Parra mentioned and Juan Ligares is a very good defender also . Carlos Gomez and Colby Ramus had breakout years .Peter Bourjos is 2 injury plagued years removed from his very good 2011 season and could be a buy low candidate.The outfield needs serious attention . You just can't have 2 bad fielders roaming around out there , 3 if you want to count Garcia. I honestly think the OF will see the biggest changes on the Sox this offseason. Be prepared to see major changes there. If your going to get bad hitting from your outfielders you better get good fielding. Sucking at both is a huge good bye waiting to happen. I disagree here. Garcia is a lock for one OF spot and I'm not sure why we wouldn't give Viciedo another opportunity out there given the lack of young talent we currently have in our organization. That leaves De Aza, and while I think Hahn may try to move him if he can get a strong return, he's definitely not just going to give him away. So IMO, they may look for an upgrade in CF but it will all depend on the market for De Aza.

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Oct 22, 2013 -> 02:55 PM) Yup, give me Ellsbury and McCann for the same price as Cano. Plug two holes and likely get better production for the same price. You aren't getting Ellsbury & McCann for the same price as Cano. Those guys are each going get anywhere between $16M to $22M a year.

QUOTE (daggins @ Oct 21, 2013 -> 06:25 PM) Since he is asking for 300 mil, and given the money being thrown around the last couple years, i'm guessing he gets 200 at least. I guess do you really think he'll get more than $25M per for 8 years? Only three contracts have exceeded the $200M threshold and those are A-Rod's last 2 contracts and Pujol's. If Cano was 3 or 4 years younger maybe he could get a 9 or 10 year deal but he's already 31 years old. Given the Dodgers are likely out and the Yankees have somewhat been scarred straight by the luxury tax, I think Cano will have to "settle" for less than 8 years.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 21, 2013 -> 05:15 PM) That the White Sox are going to give a $200ish million dollar contract to Cano? You can't be serious. That isn't anything like the White Sox. It will be interesting to see what he ends up getting. After the A-Rod & Pujols deals, I think teams are going to pass on these idiotic 10 year deals. And with the Dodgers out, there's one less team that would actually be willing do something stupid. IMO, he won't reach the $200M mark but who really knows.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Oct 20, 2013 -> 05:55 PM) Hopefully we already did. At the least we just paid for one. Abreu is only making $11M per season, do you really consider Adam LaRoche a star? That's simply the going rate for a power-hitting 1B not the next Albert Pujols.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 20, 2013 -> 10:22 AM) They aren't going to spend big money on a starting pitcher project. They might bring in some reclaimations, but that will be about it. I still fully expect a minor league deal/option year type contract to get worked out with Gavin Floyd. See, I disagree with you here. I think if Hahn is seriously considering trading one of young SPs for a young bat, he'll definitely look at a guy like Johnson on a short-term deal. We have tons of cash right now and very little to spend it on that won't cost us a draft pick. Signing a project SP where the only downside is losing some money is exactly the type of low-risk, high-reward moves we should be considering. Plus I think our pitching depth is incredibly overrated. Don't get me wrong, I love our current 1-5 and think Rienzo is a great insurance policy as our #6 starter, but take out Quintana or Santiago and the complexion of the rotation suddenly changes and that depth is basically gone IMO. However, I think you can mitigate that by adding a guy like Johnson to the mix. Look at what happened to us this past year, you simply can't have enough pitching depth. Now, if Hahn wants to hold on to both Quintana & Santiago then it's a totally different story. But we shouldn't be afraid to spend at a position of strength if an opportunity presents itself there. Hahn will have to be creative to get this team competitive again and this may be the type of move to help get us there.

Honestly, as great as he's been for us, it's time for Konerko to go. Right now, Dunn is the more productive player and his left-handed bat adds some much needed balance to the lineup. While I do think a Konerko/Dunn platoon could work, you're giving up a lot of roster flexibility carrying three 1B/DH types and you risk Robin trying to find a way to get Konerko playing time at the expense of the other two. Overall, it just doesn't make sense IMO.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Oct 19, 2013 -> 06:14 AM) http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2013-10...stro-joe-maddon Rosenbloom ripping on Epstein/Wonderboy Regime. Before the gig's up, I wonder how much money Epstein will have made? Notes that some Cubs' fans want to trade Castro for Maddon straight up, haha. I think the Theo hate is getting a little heavy right now, simply because most Cubs fans had unrealistic expectations to be begin with. I kept hearing from my Cubs friends that 2015 was going to be the year they became competitive again. Fans were cool with losing because they thought they'd gradually see the development of more and more young stars and then the signing of a plethora of free agents leading up to the 2015 season. I always thought this view was way too optimistic, because they only had a couple young players on or close to the major league roster and nowhere near an elite system yet. IMO, this was always going to be a 4 or 5 year process, at minimum, since they still needed to acquire a ton of talent and develop these guys through the system. The only way that was going to change was if guys like Castro, Rizzo, & Samardjza developed into stars and Theo got extremely creative in acquiring talent. Two years later, both of those items have failed to come to fruition. The three young guys have regressed/stalled and Theo hasn't really done much other than commit to his small-market approach to rebuilding. Whether this approach ultimately works remains to be seen, but it's quite humerous seeing Cubs fans start to panic. I think they're starting to realize Theo isn't a god and can't make talent appear out of thin air. It's going to take 4 or 5 years of losing to get that talent, and maybe longer if Rizzo & Castro don't take that next step in 2014. So much of their hope right now lies in the hands of a handful of young prospects including Baez, Bryant, Almora, & Solar. If the first one of those guys to reach the big leagues flops, it's going to be mayham on the north side.

QUOTE (bbilek1 @ Oct 17, 2013 -> 11:24 PM) I feel like someone has to go between Beckham, Ramirez, Viciedo and De Aza. I honestly doubt we upgrade at 3B. If anything is different it'll be Semien getting time there. To me it's trade Beckham and put Semien at 2B. IMO, the key move right now is addressing catcher and then finding a way to improve the overall team OBP. McCann would solve both needs. Trading Beckham and opening up a spot for Semien (which I'd like to see happen) would also help with the latter. I still think Hahn will explore all options at 3B, but is only going to make a move if a long-term solution is available. Hanley, Headley, & Sandoval are all free agents next year, so I'm not completely against giving a Gillapsie/Keppinger platoon a shot at 3B for 2014, but I wouldn't pass up on acquiring a top 3B prospect if a guy Santiago could net you such a player.

QUOTE (Frank_Thomas35 @ Oct 17, 2013 -> 11:27 PM) "Our Chuck" with a gem (granted in Cuba but definitely encouraging...) : The White Sox want players with plate discipline. Jose Abreu had 74 walks and 49 strikeouts this season--with 30 HRs and batted .399. Just so people are aware, I believe a ton of his walks were intentional. Still impressive numbers, but I wouldn't jump to conclusions about his plate discipline yet.

Add Abreu & McCann and this team suddenly becomes competitive again IMO.

Absolutely love this move, couldn't be more excited. We've filled our biggest hole with the best free agent available at the position. Here's what we currently have for next year offensively: 1B) Abreu 2B) Beckham (or Semien) SS) Ramirez 3B) Gillaspie/Keppinger LF) Viciedo CF) De Aza RF) Garcia DH) Dunn C) Phegley Catcher & 3B are the only true holes IMO. I think Hahn will try to address C in free agency, as the idea of entering the season with Phegley as the starter is quite frightening. At least with 3B we should be able to get reasonable production from a Gillaspie/Keppinger platoon. Still a long-term problem for us, so you got to think Hahn will explore trade possibilities. It's amazing how much better shape we're in after this one move though.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Oct 17, 2013 -> 11:01 PM) Actually helps us in the market IMO. Keep an eye on high-contact scrappy players, I know it sucks but I think mgmt thinks they have the power at this point. I think we enough Jeff Keppinger's on the roster. I'll take more power please.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Oct 17, 2013 -> 07:51 PM) Hot fire POTY