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QUOTE (CB2.0 @ Jan 23, 2016 -> 03:17 AM) What are the A's gonna pay Gray this year? What are the Sox gonna pay Sale? I said VALUE...not better, necessarily. The ole "bang for the buck". Sale '16 - $9.1M Gray - '16 - (Arb process - $512,000 base) Gray is SO MUCH MORE VALUABLE it's not even funny. I was referring to the bolded portion of the post above, not the discussion at large. I should have bolded it before.

QUOTE (CB2.0 @ Jan 23, 2016 -> 03:17 AM) What are the A's gonna pay Gray this year? What are the Sox gonna pay Sale? I said VALUE...not better, necessarily. The ole "bang for the buck". Sale '16 - $9.1M Gray - '16 - (Arb process - $512,000 base) Gray is SO MUCH MORE VALUABLE it's not even funny. You're completely wrong. Literally every team in baseball would add Sale at ~$10m/year, even if their budget was maxed. If Sale was making $25m or something, then we're talking. Furthermore, when you start to add up the monetary value of the control years, the cash gap shrinks even more. Sale has just over $48m left over four years, $27.5m of which is on two team options. Gray's arb payout (assuming he stays healthy and productive) will probably end up paying him $25-30m (conservatively given continued salary inflation), making the total gap likely ~$5m per year over the lives of the contracts.

Definitely, as we currently have Avisail Garcia.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 22, 2016 -> 11:07 AM) That is really nice work. I know as people have mused about the off season we always hear about the improvements at 2nd and 3rd, but Catcher has been kind of lost in that. I wonder how this translates to fWAR? 2 or 3 more wins from that group when added to the pluses from Frazier and Lawrie would put us somewhere in the neighborhood of 10 fWAR on paper. QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Jan 22, 2016 -> 11:13 AM) Great analysis and break down per usual, eminor. Thanks guys!

I'm out on Cespedes. I'm over it. Got frustrated because I wanted Gordon and Upton, but there's no point in overpaying this dude.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 21, 2016 -> 09:51 AM) Sox games started at 3B according to BBreference. Saladino 53 Gillaspie 50 Beckham 39 Olt 20 Meh, Gillaspie = Olt too. "Olt" isn't a player -- "Olt" is an archetype

QUOTE (Saufley @ Jan 21, 2016 -> 11:31 AM) I hate to rain on anyone's parade but, what will this board be like if the Sox don't sign Cespedes and aren't able to sign one or two of the second tier players? If Avisail Garcia is the RF on Opening Day (and it isn't because of a ST injury), it will be tremendous failure for the Sox. I'm not just saying that from an Avi-hater perspective -- the market was absolutely flush to make an upgrade and the bidders were relatively few.

Man, I hate being in this position. I don't even WANT Cespedes specifically, I just wanted a substantial RF upgrade because the market was so good and fit made so much sense. My heart wants him, but my brain is reminding me that the best course might be Austin Jackson + Ian Desmond. Or stare down Colorado until they give up CarGo for Tyler Danish.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jan 21, 2016 -> 11:23 AM) Echo your guys sentiments here. +1

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Jan 21, 2016 -> 09:46 AM) Sabermetrics aside: 2B: Lawrie SS: Saladino > Ramirez 3B: Frazier However, overall, I do think the IF defense will be improved. Frazier and Saladino are above average, and Lawrie may be decent with a full season at 2B. 3B was a lot of Mike Olt, too, though.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 21, 2016 -> 09:36 AM) Then why spend over 300 pages discussing someone who doesn't even play for the White Sox if it's so inconsequential? Because we want to discuss whether or not our team is going to win. Not whether or not the Sox marketing team has put together some talking points for the ticket reps.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 21, 2016 -> 09:33 AM) What are the marketing department's three top talking points for today's efforts to drum up season ticket interest? Who cares?

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 21, 2016 -> 07:59 AM) Altar... http://nba.nbcsports.com/2016/01/20/forbes...-valuable-team/ Bulls worth $2.3 billion, third most valuable franchise in NBA. If you add up all the NFL teams, with the Rams now doubling in value and third highest after Cowboys and Pats...NFL is worth $64.85 billion. NBA at $37.65 billion. Last year, MLB was $36 billion and that will be updated by Forbes this spring so they will be ahead of the NBA but should jump to mid $40's in March. White Sox were 16th at $975 million. Combined White Sox and Bulls, would be one of the top six in the world along with Yankees, Man U, Real Madrid, Cowboys, Patriots...ahead of Knicks and Lakers. Wtf are you talking about?

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jan 20, 2016 -> 08:17 PM) What would you pay Cespedes if it was up to you? At this point? Cespedes was the one I wanted least of the big three, but: I'd go up to 5/125. He's a four win upgrade over Avi and I believe in this team as a mid-80's winner with that upgrade.

ihaveafeelingsomethingisgoingtohappentodayTalk.com

QUOTE (captain54 @ Jan 20, 2016 -> 03:46 PM) You are a regular customer at a restaurant.. the ownership changes the menu, the decor.. the quality overall is not to your liking.. You and others decide to go elsewhere..suddenly the restaurant is empty most nights.. The owner or members of the staff go public and rip their former customers.. disparaging them, in some ways insulting them.. placing the onus of their failure to draw customers on the actual customer.. rather than flaws in their operation… Apparently, you would probably agree with this scenario as well... Firstly, that's NOT what happened. It would be more like "one random waitress post some disparaging stuff about customers on Facebook." Secondly, if the food was good. I would totally still go. Thirdly, I literally never have to interact with Don Cooper in my consumption of the Sox product.

QUOTE (Buehrle>Wood @ Jan 20, 2016 -> 03:47 PM) Funny enough, that's the Mets pitch to him. He absolutely loves the Spanish culture of NYC and is reportedly willing to take a big discount to stay there. That's a thing that has been reported, sure. But unless it comes directly form the mouth of his agent, it's more than likely just speculation. Also, every major city has a huge Spanish-speaking population. If that's a priority, than the Angels should be the clear frontrunners.

QUOTE (oneofthemikes @ Jan 20, 2016 -> 03:41 PM) I mean, I would say that at the very least they don't dislike each other... Right. But imagine your most average friend. Maybe a guy who see once every couple months. Don't know him super well, but always got along. Let's call him Fred. Now, you're job hunting, and get offers from two companies -- one of which is the place that Fred works. The company that Fred works for is offering you 30% less money. Do you choose Fred's company? What if Fred was your best friend in the whole world?

QUOTE (peppers312 @ Jan 20, 2016 -> 03:35 PM) if you played in Japan and didn't speak the language, don't you think you'd gravitate towards a fellow countryman if they were on the team? Sure, but not enough to leave tens of millions dollars on the table. Also, literally every MLB team contains Spanish-speaking players.

QUOTE (Jose Paniagua @ Jan 20, 2016 -> 03:35 PM) Renteria and O-Cab were the only two dudes in MLB from Colombia and they wanted to murder each other. lol Seriously, lol. It's weird. When I moved to Chicago and told people that I came from Ohio, like 1 in 10 would immediately say, "OH! Do you know ?!" "No. Why?" "Oh that's my cousin's wife and she's from Ohio." Ok so there are roughly ten million people spread out over like 40,000 miles in the state of Ohio. What are the chance I would randomly know one? The Cuban player thing isn't QUITE as bad because they actually played on the same team -- but what are the chances that they are BFFs to the point that one would leave money on the table to reunite? It's way more likely that they're completely indifferent toward each other.

QUOTE (peppers312 @ Jan 20, 2016 -> 03:33 PM) i guess i'm surprised Cespedes hasn't signed yet just because of the opportunity to team up with a fellow Cuban in Abreu. obviously money is the #1 for all the free agents, and rightfully so because they deserve to get the most money they can. but the next thing that would motivate me would be winning, and maybe that's where the Sox fall short in terms of potential teams to sign with. so that's why i'm hoping that he considers playing with a fellow Cuban important and Hahn can get a deal done before the weekend. Why does everyone assume that all people from Cuba are friends?

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jan 20, 2016 -> 03:16 PM) Yea, tons of Kumbaya and hand holding here at Soxtalk lol

QUOTE (Jake @ Jan 20, 2016 -> 11:47 AM) I'd see what Jimmy Rollins is thinking for next season. Have to think he's in a position where he'd be attracted to a team like the Sox that has no obvious choice at SS but also doesn't have the bargaining power to demand a promise of a starting spot. I doubt he'd less than $8-10m though, which I think the White Sox expressly DON'T want to pay at SS.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 20, 2016 -> 02:38 PM) It's from WSI. They literally get upset if the guy taking the money in the parking lot isn't smiling at them. I am totally serious. I'm going to have to go check that board out some time. Sounds ridiculous.

QUOTE (captain54 @ Jan 20, 2016 -> 02:42 PM) It's not a question of getting worked up. The bigger issue is: is this an indication of how the organization as a whole views their fans, with Cooper being the only one with the juice to actually express it? When Cooper has ripped the fans in the fast, has the organization ever come out to offer a disclaimer? That's the thing -- why would anyone assume that DON COOPER represents the thoughts of the front office? Don Cooper is the meatballiest dude I've ever seen. Of course he wouldn't be business savvy. Why do I care if he responds like a meatball? I wouldn't expect anything less. I just need him to work on pitching mechanics. The rest is whatever.