Eminor3rd

#solvingcaptchasforchrissale

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Jul 6, 2014 -> 07:51 PM) Sale just deserves it more. Sale deserves it more than Lester and Darvish, is the problem.

They all deserve it, honestly. Too bad.

http://www.fangraphs.com/not/ten-things-yo...out-jose-abreu/

QUOTE (Vance Law @ Jul 6, 2014 -> 01:22 PM) Who's better than Danks on the potentially-available list now that Mccarthy, Smardjia, and Hammell are gone (besides Price)? Hamels, IF you think he's actually available, and Lee, IF you think someone will gamble on his health.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jul 6, 2014 -> 11:13 AM) No it isn't, you of all people should want Abreu hitting third. That guy needs to hit in the first inning every time Fourth batter hits more frequently with baserunners on.

QUOTE (hi8is @ Jul 5, 2014 -> 11:01 PM) Oh! Hey!! It's this thread... Yawn.

QUOTE (Joshua Strong @ Jul 5, 2014 -> 11:23 AM) For Danka, I would want back Gary Sanchez and maybe three of the INTL guys that they just signed, specifically Juan De Leon, Jonathan Amundary and Dermis Garcia and cash considerations. lol you guys

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 2, 2014 -> 03:56 PM) We should trade him while he is still at peak value. If we don't, we're just wasting Chris Sale's prime years.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jul 2, 2014 -> 02:43 PM) Overall though, there's no harm in this deal. If you throw enough s*** at the wall, eventually something's gonna stick. QFT

QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Jul 2, 2014 -> 09:10 AM) Woah, looks like we got us a strawman here. If I knocked down a strawman there, it was the one you just set up. QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Jul 2, 2014 -> 09:10 AM) Viciedo isn't good defensively, but he's not a "butcher." It's not like he's Carlos Lee out there. He's substantially below average. I acknowledge there have been worse defenders before, but DV remains a clear liability no matter which type of information you choose to ignore. Bad instincts, bad range, good arm. QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Jul 2, 2014 -> 09:10 AM) As far as his future, I wouldn't have a problem paying him $5M for another year. I really wouldn't have a problem with letting him go either, but it's somewhat foolish to let a 25 year old with his talent walk during a rebuild. If he was being pushed, it would be different, but he's not. I agree that his upside would likely be more valuable than the meager return we'd get trading him. That said, if Hahn has a line on a replacement, either via trade or free agency, he should not hesitate in the name of that aforementioned upside. The interesting thing to me is how he's done it. I'm legitimately not sure whether to feel good or bad about his improved approach. I've always been low in Viciedo because I didn't think he was capable of better pitch recognition/selection. Didn't think it was a matter of attitude or approach, but rather his eye or brain or whatever it is that lets him figure out if it's a good idea to swing or not. But I think everyone, myself included, agreed that if he could find a way to be even league average in terms of patience/approach, he'd be much better. Curiously, he's been a lot more selective, and he still sucks. His O-Swing% is hovering right around league average, which has always been his biggest issue, and his number are practically identical. It is weird. On one hand, he's shown an ability to adjust I didn't know that he had. But on the other, all those tantalizing tools, even being applied better, haven't added up to a good hitter. Hopefully Dick Allen is right and his results are just now lining up with his work.

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Jul 1, 2014 -> 11:29 PM) So not only did I miss the Abreu homerun today, and not only did the ball land in my seat I had just bought 4 seconds before he hit the pitch there, BUT I PREDICTED ALL OF IT. The line was so painfully long to exchange the rain out tickets that I told my buddy and the other people waiting in line that Abreu would hit a HR and it would land in our seats in the bullpen bar, and we'd miss it all because of the damn line. And I f***ing nailed it. I was pissed off for like 3 innings. The guy in the seats next to us who picked up the ball wouldn't entertain and offer to sell the premonition ball to me. Bastard.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 1, 2014 -> 08:16 PM) That's where we will have to agree to disagree, and neither of us know the answer as it's all just speculation. If it's 2 years instead of 4-5, and he's projected to be a true impact player by Abreu, then I'd put all my eggs in that one basket. If you can instead put him on the Hawkins/Anderson track, and you're just adding pipeline depth/lottery tickets, then pass. I haven't read anything that suggests he has the talent level to be that kind of guy. It's always possible, but it doesn't sound like it's any more likely than with your average decent SS prospect.

QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Jul 1, 2014 -> 11:06 PM) Get out of here with your Bulls*** War garbage. Viciedo is a better player with more upside. I don't care what your garbage defensive stats say. I'm fine with advanced stats for offense, but when it comes to defense, just stop. QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Jul 1, 2014 -> 11:28 PM) I'm calm. I'm just not going to listen to a guy that's never seen a baseball game try to quantify a player's defensive ability and how it impacts a game. I'm not going to listen to the same guy talk about tools and upside. I'm sorry, but it's garbage. Chances are that Viciedo and Beckham will continue to disappoint, but I would be patient with the younger, more gifted player. Whoa, looks like we got us a pro scout here. By the way, if you're going to try to argue that Viciedo isn't bad on defense, I'm going to have to argue that you are the one who has never seen a game.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 1, 2014 -> 01:02 PM) no Interesting.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jul 1, 2014 -> 11:58 AM) I'd love to see it, it's a lot of fun, but if he's so set against it, that's his call. Get Dunner in that thing Don't you have to be an All-Star to be in the derby?

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jul 1, 2014 -> 12:04 PM) Honestly Franklin doesn't do much for me either, but I sure as heck don't want a failed over hyped 2B prospect and a 1B who can't hit either. And none of these guys should be in the discussion for Alexei. We need real prospects, even if A or AA. Why is he a failed prospect? He has less than a season of MLB ABs under his belt. Guys don't have to be phenoms to be good players. My whole point is that the longer a guy fails at the ML level, the less likely it is that he'll eventually succeed. Viciedo is 25 with 3.5 seasons of ball under his belt, whereas Franklin is 23 with like .75 ML seasons under his belt. Both guys were considered to have similar ceilings at one point. To me, there's no questions that Franklin is the better prospect today.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jul 1, 2014 -> 11:06 AM) Technically, I'd argue that Viciedo was worth the investment. Not sure he hit the upside as possible but he's a legit major leaguer who still has some potential although it might not be realized here. Can't really look at things in a vacuum either cause franchise could have traded him for some pretty good players at various stages when he was in the minors and early on after his rookie season. Maybe we shouldn't do anything because one guy was a bust. It is a risk / reward. If we made that statement (Viciedo didn't work) with your logic applied we should never have went after Abreu either. Give me as many elite talents as possible and with this cuban IF being subject to the international FA pools it should help corall his cost which means more likley you get a pretty good reward. No guarantee but I'd wager some of our cash. Then again I'd have done what the Rangers / Yankees have done in the past (and Yanks this year) which is just go like crazy and do an every other year in the FA pool. I think the bang for your buck is there. QFT I think Balta was just challenging the assertion that this kid will make a Puig-like (or even Viciedo-like) immediate impact.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 1, 2014 -> 06:22 AM) Actually, Aiken hasn't signed, and there is speculation there could have been a problem with his physical. I didn't see that. That would be nuts

He's a prospect, not a ML player.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 1, 2014 -> 11:00 AM) Gordon Beckham. Brian Anderson. Haha good point.

I wish he would. But DA is right that if he's worried about it, then he probably IS one of the guys who might let it mess with his head.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 1, 2014 -> 10:53 AM) One last time, this is what I was responding to: You are also talking about guys that are the exception to the rule. No one is saying that the Sox should cut bait with Viciedo or give him away for peanuts or stop playing him all together, but I don't think I've ever seen this much support for a guy who has never shown anything but flashes. Not trade value, support. I don't know what Viciedo's trade value is, nor do I care. I still think he can be a very good hitter. He had a real horrible streak. Eventually he will get hot again. I'm telling you that the "support" that wite is referring to is the "support" that has been given, in this thread, regarding Viciedo's trade value. Specifically that he should have some because of the fact that he might be a flukey late breakout. That is what "this much support" means here. That is the context of the conversation. That is why Felipe Paulino does not belong here.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 1, 2014 -> 10:31 AM) You were the one who called out the Viciedo supporters. Not me. I just pointed out if that is irrational, you also give some irrational support. As a guy who had substantial trade value, not a guy who does or doesn't have some prayer of being good ever. I don't know how you don't see the difference.

To me, it just comes down to whether or not he can get both R and L handed batters out. So far, it looks like there's definitely a platoon split: http://www.fangraphs.com/statsplits.aspx?p...=P&season=0