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QUOTE (SOXOBAMA @ Jul 18, 2012 -> 09:40 AM) There's a guy in the Sox lineup that makes many outs and I would love to see him get traded this off season, that person being Adam Dunn. I'd make Viciedo a DH and make a trade for a player like Pence. Dunn's OBP of .362 is second on the team only to Konerko. Dunn makes fewer outs than ANYONE in the Sox lineup other than Konerko. Don't let the strikeout totals and the mass media hype machine fool you.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 18, 2012 -> 09:40 AM) It's not what he hits, it's WHEN he hits. Take away those two three run bombs against the Yankees and Royals and we're only 1 1/2 games ahead of the Tigers and in danger of being passed this weekend. Yes, I acknowledge this. But my point is that hit distribution is not predictive, it's just worked out well this year. There no reason to believe it will or won't work out the same way over the remainder of the season. That's what I mean by mentioning the timely homeruns QUOTE (WHarris1 @ Jul 18, 2012 -> 09:46 AM) While talking about certain metrics and how they translate in terms of average, above average, etc. Viciedo has an ISO of .195 this year. .200 typically translates as "great". He is 23. wOBA and wRC+ account for his excellent power, and weigh it properly with the other factors, like his lack of ability to get on base. The most complete picture is with these linear weights-based metrics.

Guys, I'm not a Viciedo hater, but I think you're overstating his contribution this year. He's at a 98wRC+, which means that wehn you adjust for league and park, he's been a tick below average offensively for left fielders. This, combined with slightly negative defensive and baserunning ratings put him at 0.3 WAR. ZiPs projects him to end the year with 0.8 WAR -- an "average" MLB player usually sits around 2.0 WAR for a full year. This is mostly driven by his sub-.300 OBP. Yes, he is 23 and has lots of upside and will probably improve, but so far this year, the only difference between Viciedo and Delmon Young has been some timely homeruns.

The key here when evaluating giving up a guy like DV is remembering who you're getting back. If we had to giveup DV to get Greinke for this year and an extension, you just do it, and here's why: Greinke is a 29 year old top-10 SP in the MLB. Healthy, he's a 6-7 win pitcher over the next few years. Guys like DV have the potential to be 6-7 win guys, but they almost never are. Prospects are super important because it's impossible to build lasting success without cost-controlled talent, but when you're in the middle of a race to the postseason, you jump at the chance to give up a lottery ticket for the real thing. Now, if we're talking about some veteran with a year or two left like Dempster, or if we're talking about a pure half season rental, you pull the reins back. But in a win-now situation, if you can get Greinke for the next few years, by trading a couple guys that have a 1% chance of being that valuable, you gotsta pull the trigger.

QUOTE (balfanman @ Jul 17, 2012 -> 02:44 PM) Kenny Williams Jr. !...................oh, nevermind Oh, that would be hilarious. If KW Jr. is included as a throw-in in a big-time deal. You know, that is a fantastic setup for a baseball movie scene. Some off-the-wall cocky GM knows how bad some desperate GM wants his star pitcher, so he insists that the desperate GM include his son in the deal, even though the cocky GM knows the son is useless. Now the desperate GM has to choose between a family rift and blowing a legitimate shot at the postseason. Gold.

I'm trying to think of who (prospects-wise) I wouldn't want to give up for Greinke, assuming there's a good chance to extend him. I think it's nobody. As a rental, that's tougher.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Jul 12, 2012 -> 01:46 PM) NOOOOOOOO on Volquez This^ Volquez would give up homers at a Stewartian level in the Cell. I'll take Street though.

A sweep of the Royals here gets us a new SP/RP from the trading market, methinks.

Sickels mentioned only Molina and Sanchez in his "Honorable Mentions" section for his recent top 120 update. So he presumably thinks that Sanchez is the second best Sox prospect (not including this year's draft). Not making an argument, just thought it was interesting.

QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ Jul 10, 2012 -> 08:58 AM) If you make a trade for a SP with an expirering contract you BETTER extend him right away. One thing you have to remember is Peavy's big contract is off the books after this season so that gives the team a better chance at signing another pitcher to a long term deal. Not to mention the Sox may opt to no take that option of Floyd giving them even more flexibility. I think we have a much better chance in acquirering a mid-level starter over a guy like Grienke/Hamels. At least that is the case if we want to keep Viciedo. It's true, though I'm sure KW was planning on Peavy coming off the books while negotiating with Danks too. Also, I don't see us giving up Quetzacoatl, because that opens up the same hole we fill with getting a SP. That being said, there's no one in our system I wouldn't move for Greinke or Hamels if we would extend them -- the lottery ticket type prospects we have are such incredible longshots to become a players like Greinke/Hamels, and both guys are plenty young enough to be worthwhile signings. I just don't think KW or JR want to throw a $100m contract at a pitcher right now.

The Greinke mental thing is overblown. He's a top 5 or 10 starter in the MLB right now in an environment stacked with amazing starters. I'd love to have him. I'd love to extend him. That said, we won;t get him because he won;t be worth the talent unless we extend him, and I believe most of that money went to Danks.

I'm afraid he's going to be very expensive after this year, but not likely at all to repeat these numbers. At 35, this smells of the kind of situation where it's really hard to let the guy walk, but might be easily the right decision. I like him, would love to keep him, but not for 3/36 or anything.

I just don't see someone whose heart became the morning star getting beat by Nick Swisher tonight.

Konerko DFA?

RAAAAAAAAANDY WILLIAMS

QUOTE (StrangeSox @ Jun 27, 2012 -> 04:57 PM) The guy's seat on the bench isn't even cold yet and already people are speculating on who's going to replace him. Wait, did you not create this thread as a joke?

QUOTE (winninguglyin83 @ Jun 25, 2012 -> 11:43 PM) wasn't Zach Stewart what we had to show for Daniel Hudson? Sort of like Nestor Molina is what we have to show for Sergio Santos. The joy of Kenny Stanford. No, Zach Stewart and a season of Edwin Jackson and dumping Teahen's entire contract. I'll never understand how some people can think that "what you have to show" for a trade is only who remains on the roster years later. You're paying for performance seasons, you're not actually owning players' lives.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jun 26, 2012 -> 04:09 PM) .329 in June. Which, if that represents his slumps, is totally fine as well.

Guys, if you're seriously still concerned about batting average, you need to learn about linear weights. Tom Tango devised a system of measuring overall offensive contribution by including all hitting events based on their relative expected run values. You don't have to subjectively decide how much strikeouts matter when compared to homeruns because it has been done mathematically: http://www.tangotiger.net/wiki/index.php?t...=Linear_Weights The most commonly used statistic that comes from this is wOBA, and looking at a hitter's wOBA is a much better way than batting avg, on base percentage, total bases, homeruns, etc. to evaluate his performace in a vacuum. wOBA is scaled in such a way to match OBP -- so if someone's wOBA number would be a good OBP number, then it's also a good wOBA. Adam Dunn's wOBA is .375, and that is fine and dandy.

It's all about wOBA

Sox have struggled vs. lefties, but they also tend to feast on hard-throwers. I wouldn't be surprised if we won tonight and dropped the next two against whatever soft-tossing garbage the Twins will trot out.

QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Jun 25, 2012 -> 11:17 AM) If I'm on the other side of the fence, I would question why Boston made this trade. It doesn't seem good for them. The Youk/Middlebrooks drama was starting to become poisonous, methinks, which factored into their haste. Beyond that, temporary utility guys that can play the OF but won't demand a starting spot when the DL empties is something the Red Sox definitely need. I think they have something like 6 OFs on the DL right now. Also, they need pitching real bad. I just don't understand how they think Stewart is the solution to that problem.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jun 25, 2012 -> 09:46 AM) "On one hand, it probably was time for him to go. The Red Sox needed to be committed to Will Middlebrooks," (Terry) Francona said. "He's a good young player, and he's proven he's a guy they can build around. "But, saying that, the White Sox are going to get more from Kevin Youkilis than the Red Sox did so far. If Youk is healthy -- and he says is -- he grinds out at-bats as good as anybody in baseball, and you can hit him second, third, fourth, fifth, sixth. He hits left-handers, he hits right-handers. It's a big pick-up for the White Sox, who have gotten no production at third base." http://www.freep.com/article/20120624/SPOR...is-from-Red-Sox Tigers' response is supposedly interest in Carlos Quentin, although the only "smoke" to this so far is Morosi blog/tweet about it 11 days ago. Really hope that the Tigers don't get him. I'd rather he go to CLE, but Damon's actually been closer to serviceable. Still, you don't let Damon stand in the way if you have the pieces to add Quentin in the next month, assuming he's still healthy. I've always liked Carlos, but he's always been SO streaky. You have to figure that some team is going to get him just in time for him to go cold, right?

I don't see any way to interpret this as a bad trade. Yes, LilliBomb endeared himself to us last year, but even if you think he's a plus utility guy, then you just gave up a plus utility guy. This is a major upside play. And Stewart is horrible. Funny side note: I clicked on the MLBTradeRumors link on Twitter last night and loked at some of the comments. There was one BoSox fan that said something along the lines of: "Ha! White Sox give up a top pitching prospect and more just to take on the corpse of Youkilis!" Someone is misinformed on Stewart, lol.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Jun 22, 2012 -> 03:24 PM) Given the current rotation situation, that doesn't make much any sense. I'm assuming Axelrod will be the starter. They can't possibly think it is Stewart? Any idea on the recovery period from a sprained flexor. I'm curious if this just came up or if he had been pitching through it for a while. Didn't Stewart just get DFA'd?