**World Soxtalk Championship Wrestling Thread V**

[Rowand44]

I mean, Nakamura is literally violence and Styles is the most over thing on the roster right now probably so I don't think that's a fair point at all. There's a variety of reasons people don't like the product right now and I think a lot of the reasons are valid. I certainly don't love it at the moment but I find my reasons to enjoy it because I still love pro wrestling in basically every form. The Shield and KO/Sami stuff are perfect examples. I don't think how they got here makes any sense and is completely stupid but whatever, I'm happy they got there.

 

As for The BC stuff, I'm sure this little battle between them and the E isn't going away anytime soon. Reigns fired off shots at them last week so Cody hit him back and honestly both ways that's fine. The Bucks and Cody and Omega for that matter can fight this fight with them because they don't need the E. The Bucks especially are pretty much marketing geniuses when it comes to their own brand and they know what they're doing with this kind of stuff.

[Y2HH]

I mean, Nakamura is literally violence and Styles is the most over thing on the roster right now probably so I don't think that's a fair point at all. There's a variety of reasons people don't like the product right now and I think a lot of the reasons are valid. I certainly don't love it at the moment but I find my reasons to enjoy it because I still love pro wrestling in basically every form. The Shield and KO/Sami stuff are perfect examples. I don't think how they got here makes any sense and is completely stupid but whatever, I'm happy they got there.

 

As for The BC stuff, I'm sure this little battle between them and the E isn't going away anytime soon. Reigns fired off shots at them last week so Cody hit him back and honestly both ways that's fine. The Bucks and Cody and Omega for that matter can fight this fight with them because they don't need the E. The Bucks especially are pretty much marketing geniuses when it comes to their own brand and they know what they're doing with this kind of stuff.

 

Made an edit to what I was saying because I can see you were misconstruing my point.

 

The violence of Nakamura isn't what they want. That's the NJPW style, which equates to say a few things and then go out there and wrestle, because the wrestling is more important than anything you can say. That's simply not true for American audiences who were basically bred to have short attention spans. Look at Netflix for example -- release an entire season all at once because nobody wants to wait for anything. These casual audiences don't want to sit through 50 minute iron man matches.

 

You bring up AJ, but he's the exact sort of wrestler mainstream American audiences want...which is violence backed by a character/drama they can understand and sink their teeth into.

 

They're not accepting Naka because they can't understand him, so therefore it's hard to get behind him. The smarks start chants for him, and the casual glom onto them, but in the end, they really don't care about Nakamura. They're there to have fun, so they'll chant anything just to be a part of it...but in the end, he's just a bizarre guy that shows up and wrestles -- why he's wrestling, who the f*** knows, since they never bothered to tell that story, and even if they tried, live audiences wouldn't understand him.

 

I can relate to AJ Styles.

 

I can't relate to Nakamura.

 

And neither can the mainstream audience.

 

That's why, in the past, they used managers ... for people like Nakamura.

Edited October 16, 2017 by Y2HH

[iWiN4PreP]

On the topic of Nakumara I'm with you, however, I'd say the fault is once again on the booking. The booking for Naku was another glorious fail from WWE. They have this incredible entity who can't speak good English and decide to push him on the microphone as much as possible, exposing his glaring hole. They then have him come close to losing to jobber Ziggler (a match where Naku got like 10% offense in and won), then feed him to the worst champion in long memory in Jinder.

 

But more so, it's what they *could* have done with such an enigmic entity. Have him give 30 second pre-screen vignettes here and there that make him look like a japanese bad ass. Perhaps use captions. Honestly, don't have him talk almost at all, let his wresting do the work. Give him attitude. Have him not necessarily DESTROY opponents, but pretty close to it. Build him up properly instead of throwing him into a world title match only to lose. Pretty much have him go undefeated until his eventual world championship feud with Styles. That s*** is money!

 

On other topic, we have the return of Kane last night. I'm not going to say many negative things about this. It was a decent surprise reading the review, but Kane is long gone and not really something to get giddy about. The real question is what the f*** are they doing with this clusterf*** of a match at TLC?

5on3? When there is Kane and Big show on the 5 team? If the 5 team loses, it makes them all look like morons. If the shield loses, then still, wtf?

Don't really see any good story progression here.

[Brian]

So Sunday got interesting.

Meningitis going around. Bray and Roman out.

AJ Styles vs Demon

Angle returns to ring to replace Roman.

 

Bo Dallas been sick as well.

[thxfrthmmrs]

Wow. I like to see AJ vs Finn, but would have like to see that match being properly build up.

 

I think it would have made more sense for AJ to replace Roman, and have Finn face a heel.

[Rowand44]

So Sunday got interesting.

Meningitis going around. Bray and Roman out.

AJ Styles vs Demon

Angle returns to ring to replace Roman.

 

Bo Dallas been sick as well.

Yes, but how does this affect the house show I'm going to tonight?

[Rowand44]

Wow. I like to see AJ vs Finn, but would have like to see that match being properly build up.

 

I think it would have made more sense for AJ to replace Roman, and have Finn face a heel.

Can easily end AJ-Finn with some type of shmoz with the Club involved. Then you can start a real build to one of the big 4. That probably wont happen just cause but would be easy to do and make all the sense in the world.

[thxfrthmmrs]

Can easily end AJ-Finn with some type of shmoz with the Club involved. Then you can start a real build to one of the big 4. That probably wont happen just cause but would be easy to do and make all the sense in the world.

 

Not a bad idea, but just bad timing since AJ is starting feud with Jinder on the SDL side.

 

Also a shame that if Roman is out for the next few weeks then the Shield reunion will be short lived.

Edited October 20, 2017 by 2005thxfrthmmrs

[Brian]

Can easily end AJ-Finn with some type of shmoz with the Club involved. Then you can start a real build to one of the big 4. That probably wont happen just cause but would be easy to do and make all the sense in the world.

 

Sh*t, now you got my hopes up. I miss when the Bullet Club was cool. #Heel

 

I wouldn't look too much into Styles/Finn. Probably just filling a spot and having a good match to make it up to fans who paid.

[iWiN4PreP]

Yeah, some weird things going on.

Finn vs. AJ should be a good/great match, sucks there's no build, but hey -- its 1000000x better then the s***fest we were getting with Wyatt vs. Finn. The question is how does the match end? Do they let Finn win clean as he is likely going into a big push? If so, that makes Smackdown look a bit riduclous. Do they have AJ win? Well, of course not, it's Finn's match/Raw. So my guess is that the Bullet Club does get involved. Er, I mean, Luke/Gallows.

 

As far as Kurt Angle returning, that's a real head scratcher... you are telling me that they couldn't find anyone better? This guy is supposedly broken, yet their throwing him into Tables, ladders, and chairs for his return?? We know he is not taking any bumps... and I mean, really? Why not build up his first match to Wrestlemania or something instead of doing this. I guess it gets butts into seats, but man -- just seems like a bad move there.

 

Btw if Kurt comes out this Sunday taking dives into tables/chairs and so forth, I will eat my s***, but who is going to predict him to have any success in a TLC match???

Edited October 21, 2017 by iWin4Ron

[iWiN4PreP]

The review from rajah.com sums up a lot of good points on the main event:

 

"I know what you were gonna say. “Kurt, you’re a hypocrite. You’ve been yelling for The Shield to reunite since SummerSlam and now that they have, you’re against it.” I get it, and you’d be right. Here’s the problem though, this isn’t The Shield. This is Dean Ambrose, Seth Rollins, & Roman Reigns teaming up. There’s a HUGE difference. Look at this past Monday’s tag title match. The Shield in their original incarnation came down through the crowd, no matter what combination was in the match. On Monday though, Seth and Dean still came out to their own individual entrances. How am I supposed to buy in that this a long-term reuniting (we all know it’s not, but you can still make me believe it is because it’s not hard) when everyone is still themselves individually? The Shield was a bond, a family, that was together in EVERYTHING. WWE brought them back together just to sell some tickets, and it couldn’t be more apparent with how they’re presented. Their new shirt even has their individual logos on it. It’s not something to make the product more interesting, it’s just a money grab. For that, I can’t get behind it as much as I would love to be able to. It’s ironic though, because even though it was a money grab, ticket sales are clearly not going up and last week’s Raw DROPPED by 200,000 viewers in the ratings. It’s even more ironic that poor sales for this event is what prompted WWE to bring The Shield together and now they won’t even get that.

 

I have so many issues with Kurt Angle being in this match. First off, the most logical substitution would be Matt Hardy. It’s a TLC match and we just celebrated the 18th anniversary of the ladder match that put The Hardys on the map (No Mercy 1999). Plus, he’s not doing a damn thing now. Did that just make too much sense for WWE? Also, Angle’s first match in 11 freaking years and it’s in a match that HE made 5 on 3. Is the story going to be that he feels guilty for putting The Shield at such bad odds? Without Roman, it also makes Kane irrelevant now.

 

It seems like a much easier solution would be Dean and Seth vs. The Bar in a TLC match for the tag titles, then have Miz issue an open challenge and have Angle accept it. It’d be a really nice surprise and also be a match that makes way more sense. You can just leave Kane off the show and Braun unfortunately does become the odd man out. However, he just took a crippling loss to Brock Lesnar and he really can’t afford another one, so not having a match wouldn’t be the worst thing. Hopefully he’s nowhere near the decision. They’re teetering on blowing it with Braun."

 

All very good points ^^.

[Brian]

We live in a world where people are upset that Angle is returning to the ring.

I’m still betting he is taken out by someone and Jason Jordan takes his spot.

Can’t wait for another Ron rant after that.

 

Sure, Matt would be ok but this version of Matt isn’t an adequate replacement for Reigns on a card.

Edited October 22, 2017 by Brian

[iWiN4PreP]

I would much rather Angle be taken out early, creating a dynamic storyline and a correctly built up Angle match down the road. That would be more interesting to me then randomly popping Angle into a 8 person mess. Angle has no business here, not with any of the combatants, not facing a 5 on 3 (where he made the match a 5 on 3), etc.

Why they couldn't just say OK Reigns is out, so we are adding in Matt and Jason Jordan. That would have produced a higher quality match (as Angle can't go right now, He's broke mannnnnnn, I guess will see tho..). I'm hoping that they are going to create a storyline here for Angle and not just have him in the match for s***s and giggles to get the crowd happy. That's bogus.

 

This whole thing was bogus from the beginning which I pointed out in this thread. Having the Shield come back for a money grab was another slap in the face of any fan who enjoys storylines.

As the rajah.com writer stated, Strowman is also losing the magic they had with him. It's definitely not completely lost, but this guy has been on fire this year and they are just toying with him as he is overshadowed by Reigns and Lesnar constantly. They better make him look strong in this match or give him a storyline to work with (perhaps walking out on his team). They can't have Strowman lose a 5on3 match when it isn't even against the Shield.

 

The whole f***ing show of Raw is a s*** fest. From the cruisers who are walking out, to the woman who are also displeased (Nia), to the main championships. There's not a single good thing going on Raw right now, and don't tell me to stop watching/following -- I don't spend a dime on them. If there was any competition, they'd be run out of town, but because they've had a monopoly for the past 10 or how many years they are safe for a while producing s***.

 

[iWiN4PreP]

As a prediction before the show, I am almost certain that Jason Jordan gets added to the main event. It makes too much damn sense. They need another body (it can't just be Rollins/Ambrose vs. the 5) We know Angle isn't going to go for much/long.

[Buehrle>Wood]

The 3, minute long twitter promos by AJ/Balor/shield to talk about the changes were excellent. Low production values and completely off the cuff yet it worked.

[iWiN4PreP]

Yes, the promo work has been fantastic in the past 24 hours. Rollins/Ambrose promo on the pre-show was A+, the 5 Heel Promo on the PPV was A+.

 

Asuka should have SQUASHED Emma the Jobber, but instead went close to 10 minutes or something with somewhat even offense. Asuka's downfall starts....

[Brian]

Ron, go for a run or pick up a book. To constantly complain about almost everything, you need to take a break.

Emma n Asuka had a great match at Takeover London a few years ago that is one of the best women matches in the last decade. This wasn’t going to meet that but it was solid.

You can’t showcase Asuka’s moves and personality to a new audience in a squash.

Edited October 23, 2017 by Brian

[iWiN4PreP]

Yes you can and should have.

Emma is a jobber on Raw.

Asuka is supposed to be a beast.

They hurt Asuka by having Emma get in a decent amount of offense when Emma is jobbing out on Raw in 3 minutes to every women there. It's just basic storytelling.

[iWiN4PreP]

Welp, I called it.. Kurt has no business in this match, he looks extremely slow/laggy.

I did get the prediction wrong with Jason Jordan being put into the match. Still not sure how they expect this to be believable when The Bar vs. Ambrose/Rollins was taking to the limit last month. Then you have angle vs. Strowman/Kane/Miz... hmm...

[iWiN4PreP]

Was it necessary to put Kurt Angle in the match if all he was going to do was take one spot and be done?

 

It's really sad when the main event here is worse then the 3 women's matchs and the 2 cruiserweight matches.

This match might be in the top 10 of worst matches I've ever witnessed simply due to how incredibly messy it is. Brings back WCW memories.

[Buehrle>Wood]

I really enjoyed the main event

[GGajewski18]

Ron, is there anything you like in the WWE right now?

 

On TLC, thought Balor/Styles match was the match by far. Main event was good at the beginning and end. Middle of it kind of stagnant. I did pop when Angle came out to his music, would of loved if he had his gear on though. Overall, I thought the PPV was average.

Edited October 23, 2017 by SoxPride18

[thxfrthmmrs]

Was it necessary to put Kurt Angle in the match if all he was going to do was take one spot and be done?

 

It's really sad when the main event here is worse then the 3 women's matchs and the 2 cruiserweight matches.

This match might be in the top 10 of worst matches I've ever witnessed simply due to how incredibly messy it is. Brings back WCW memories.

 

Spoke too soon? If you thought the was how the match would end, you must be something else.

[thxfrthmmrs]

Ron, is there anything you like in the WWE right now?

 

On TLC, thought Balor/Styles match was the match by far. Main event was good at the beginning and end. Middle of it kind of stagnant. I did pop when Angle came out to his music, would of loved if he had his gear on though. Overall, I thought the PPV was average.

 

Second this. And you can probably it up the cluster in the middle as calling an audible in the last minute.

[Rowand44]

Can we talk about how incredible Finn and AJ was?