2 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

There are times to be conservative and there are times to take risks. It all depends on who is on the board. They never take a fucking risk. 

In terms of first rounders. Drafting Mitchell (even though he was a college player he was raw) and Hawkins were considerable risks. And they didn't pan out. The days where they were drafting the Lance Broadways of this world are over.

Edited February 19, 20197 yr by GermanSoxFan

Can't Develop talent

Can't evaluate big league talent. 

Won't spend money to acquire talent. 

Next step is hope we get lucky again.

If nothing else, all of Manny's family and friends on the team can keep us up-to-date about his performance. What a laughable off-season. Honestly, I really am not a huge Machado fan, but the Sox were and looked like frolicking jesters in pursuing him. He was always going to where the money was most. Sox failed to understand that. 

1 minute ago, GermanSoxFan said:

In terms of first rounders. Drafting Mitchell (even though he was a college player he was raw) and Hawkins were considerable risks. And they didn't pan out. The days where they were drafting the Lance Broadways of this world are over.

Those were under the old rules. They're doing the Lance Broadway/Kyle McCulloch shit again but it is taking a different form. 

Not sure whats next for me and my Sox fandom. It really isn't about not having Manny on the team as that would have been just an incremental improvement. It IS ALL about the context of this particular failure and they really hammered the point home this time. They will never be capable of building a winning team with Jerry and the current FO. Because of ownership's financial restrictions and from the overall mismanagement by the GM we are totally screwed as fans. I wouldn't begrudge any fan that would jump ship from this organization and follow another team.   

 

1 minute ago, shipps said:

Not sure whats next for me and my Sox fandom. It really isn't about not having Manny on the team as that would have been just an incremental improvement. It IS ALL about the context of this particular failure and they really hammered the point home this time. They will never be capable of building a winning team with Jerry and the current FO. Because of ownership's financial restrictions and from the overall mismanagement by the GM we are totally screwed as fans. I wouldn't begrudge any fan that would jump ship from this organization and follow another team.   

 

I’m not a hockey fan, but is this not similar to the issues the Blackhawks were having until they had a change in “ownership”?

2 minutes ago, shipps said:

Not sure whats next for me and my Sox fandom. It really isn't about not having Manny on the team as that would have been just an incremental improvement. It IS ALL about the context of this particular failure and they really hammered the point home this time. They will never be capable of building a winning team with Jerry and the current FO. Because of ownership's financial restrictions and from the overall mismanagement by the GM we are totally screwed as fans. I wouldn't begrudge any fan that would jump ship from this organization and follow another team.   

 

I wouldn't either. I'm going to try to find a secondary team to follow this year while biding my time until the JR kicks the bucket. I've already had a somewhat secondary rooting interest in the Red Sox for years, so I'm just going to transfer most of my time there. I will be back when new ownership is in place, and KW/Hahn are gone. 

4 minutes ago, fathom said:

I’m not a hockey fan, but is this not similar to the issues the Blackhawks were having until they had a change in “ownership”?

It is incredibly similar. Especially B. Wirtz/Pulford=JR/KW=MR/Paxon. Pulford didn't get whacked until Dollar Bill was near the end. 

Edited February 19, 20197 yr by Jack Parkman

4 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

Those were under the old rules. They're doing the Lance Broadway/Kyle McCulloch shit again but it is taking a different form. 

I wouldn't put Madrigal in that boat yet. Yeah he's a high floor guy but that's because he's got a 70 or 80 hit tool and plays good D up the middle. That's super rare and you bet on him being able to develop a little power and/or some better selectivity to walk more.

Being out of town I’m not always privy to the inter-workings of the organization....is there any kind of contingency plan in place for when JR does leave (putting it nicely)? Like this won’t be a Jerry Jones/Al David situation where his entitled kid is 2nd in line with no hope in sight will it? 

1 minute ago, almagest said:

I wouldn't put Madrigal in that boat yet. Yeah he's a high floor guy but that's because he's got a 70 or 80 hit tool and plays good D up the middle. That's super rare and you bet on him being able to develop a little power and/or some better selectivity to walk more.

The highest I've seen on him is 65 hit and most places have him as 60 hit/35 power. The lack of walks also concerns me. 

Edited February 19, 20197 yr by Jack Parkman

Just now, TheFutureIsNear said:

Being out of town I’m not always privy to the inter-workings of the organization....is there any kind of contingency plan in place for when JR does leave (putting it nicely)? Like this won’t be a Jerry Jones/Al David situation where his entitled kid is 2nd in line with no hope in sight will it? 

I don't know that i've seen a definitive answer but around 2017 I remember people whispering that it would be likely he would sell sox but keep bulls with michael. 

I'm sorry, I can't find any supporting articles though. 

1 minute ago, TheFutureIsNear said:

Being out of town I’m not always privy to the inter-workings of the organization....is there any kind of contingency plan in place for when JR does leave (putting it nicely)? Like this won’t be a Jerry Jones/Al David situation where his entitled kid is 2nd in line with no hope in sight will it? 

The popular thinking is that Michael Reinsdorf will keep the Bulls in the family and sell the White Sox, but who knows.

1 minute ago, bmags said:

I don't know that i've seen a definitive answer but around 2017 I remember people whispering that it would be likely he would sell sox but keep bulls with michael. 

I'm sorry, I can't find any supporting articles though. 

Yes that is the common perception 

The worst thing other than not having manny is the stink of this negativity. Nobody is going to go games. The people that do are going to boo Jay and Alonso. Team morale is going to be low and that's not a good thing for a young locker room. 

18 minutes ago, GermanSoxFan said:

Exactly, I cancelled mlb.tv for the first time in over a decade. I have zero trust in this organization to do what has to be done to build a winner.

I love how everyone thinks cancelling mlb.tv is someway somehow a jab that the White Sox will feel.  The White Sox are not affected in any way shape or form by you cancelling mlb.tv.  

Note - this isn't directed only at you, German.  Its been all over this board today. 

Just now, ChiSox59 said:

I love how everyone thinks cancelling mlb.tv is someway somehow a jab that the White Sox will feel.  The White Sox are not affected in any way shape or form by you cancelling mlb.tv.  

Note - this isn't directed only at you, German.  Its been all over this board today. 

Yes. The biggest way to hit their pocketbook is to decline to go to games and purchase merchandise. 

Just now, Jack Parkman said:

Yes. The biggest way to hit their pocketbook is to decline to go to games and purchase merchandise. 

Isn’t that what has already happened the last few years?

3 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

The highest I've seen on him is 65 hit and most places have him as 60 hit/35 power. The lack of walks also concerns me. 

Yeah, youre right. I thought I saw 70+ on him but I can't find it now.

That's still great. He'll need to hit for more power and draw more walks though for sure. Let's see what he can do in a full season with no prior injuries and fatigue. If he's still a 300/315/390 type then I'll be alarmed.

8 minutes ago, fathom said:

I’m not a hockey fan, but is this not similar to the issues the Blackhawks were having until they had a change in “ownership”?

Yeah I think an issue is that while Reinsdorf used to be competent if not good, he has an old school mentality that hasn't evolved.

You hire basketball people to run a basketball org and baseball people to run a baseball org.

But the baseball people have changed, and his have not. 

The white sox org doing what its doing now may have been successful in 2005, but it is not in 2019.

The best orgs are looking at the rules and looking to exploit every possible advantage.

The white sox are just keeping an eye on emerging trends and will catch up if it proves to work, and by that time those teams have already evolved (check out the athletic article on narvaez using body tracking devices to improve his defense at catcher)

He thinks that the progressive organizations are bad for the sport and now how you win, despite them all winning and his orgs falling behind.

They need a changing of the guard badly. Hahn failed. Seriously my god putting together that list of free agent acquisitions over 6 years is unbelievable. You couldn't find a worse list I promise.

Just now, ChiSox59 said:

I love how everyone thinks cancelling mlb.tv is someway somehow a jab that the White Sox will feel.  The White Sox are not affected in any way shape or form by you cancelling mlb.tv.  

Note - this isn't directed only at you, German.  Its been all over this board today. 

It's not meant to be a jab at the White Sox. I just need some time off from baseball.

Maybe it's just short term frustration and I'll be back on board on opening day, but I don't think I have it in me this year to watch 140ish games again.

Hahn’s just going to have a miserable year.

The only saving grace for him care that the Padres aren’t in the same league or division.

Really feel bad for some posters who believed two whales were actually possible.

THIS is what has been the typical feeling for White Sox fans for generations...just not good enough.  The Cubs’ fans are already wallowing enough in their own misery, but undoubtedly are about to start feeling pity on us.

This will be remembered as the year of toasting Alonso, Jay, Castillo, Nova, Herrera and Colome...for NOT being Manny Machado.

About the only way this can get any worse would be injuries to Jimenez, Cease, Robert AND then Omar Narvaez going on to become an All-Star catcher for that ONLY other team to suffer longer than the Padres and Sox waiting for that elusive playoff spot, the freakin’ Mariners.

 

Just now, fathom said:

Isn’t that what has already happened the last few years?

This is going to be a brutal opening for the nbcsn.

Just now, bmags said:

This is going to be a brutal opening for the nbcsn.

Sox were already as irrelevant as can be for casual baseball followers, and now you have the diehards saying they’re done going to games. This is a very bad day for a very bad franchise.

4 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

I love how everyone thinks cancelling mlb.tv is someway somehow a jab that the White Sox will feel.  The White Sox are not affected in any way shape or form by you cancelling mlb.tv.  

Note - this isn't directed only at you, German.  Its been all over this board today. 

The money gets split...in actuality, the Sox will still end up making more money because of all the SD fans subscribing for the first time in a decade.  

Yay!  Profits that can NOT go to 2nd round Bulls’ draft picks.