On 7/10/2019 at 9:03 AM, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

The Sox don't have to make him a QO. They can let him walk without one, plus, if he accepts, which he would, then it's around $18M for 2020 which the Sox probably don't want to pay him. That's why we are seeing speculation of a 2 or 3 year extension at much lower AAV.

If they don't offer him a QO then he can sign with any team including the White Sox for any offer he wants to accept.

If the Sox prefer to go year to year with Jose it's probably best not to offer him a QO because when he accepts it at $18M and if he has a good year then they have to do it all over again the next season probably at around $19M . It's better to not offer one and resign him at a lower AAV. But then you are taking the chance someone else offers him a much better deal than the Sox are willing to pay. However given the fact he wants to stay on the Sox really bad judging by his comments it's highly doubtful he accepts another offer unless it blows away the Sox offer.

Jose will pull out of the ditch with a good finish and they will offer $10M next year. He could even be a player-coach at some point.

3 minutes ago, pcq said:

Jose will pull out of the ditch with a good finish and they will offer $10M next year. He could even be a player-coach at some point.

A "strong finish" would cement his status as a 1.5 WAR 1B.  A mediocre one cements his status as  washed up replacement level 1B.  There's no there there.  He's done.  The Sox have Collins if they want to try a 1 WAR 1B next year that won't cost more than the league min.

39 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said:

I love his ability to draw walks and hit for some pop.

Unfortunately behind the plate umpiring isn't getting any better so drawing walks is a crap shoot.  In fact I see better umpiring in the minors.

Is there an anti Ron out there? Somebody to start a pro-Jose thread? One with all compliments? That would be neat.

2 hours ago, chitownsportsfan said:

A "strong finish" would cement his status as a 1.5 WAR 1B.  A mediocre one cements his status as  washed up replacement level 1B.  There's no there there.  He's done.  The Sox have Collins if they want to try a 1 WAR 1B next year that won't cost more than the league min.

Good points but I expect they will retain him. Loyalty.

2 hours ago, kitekrazy said:

Unfortunately behind the plate umpiring isn't getting any better so drawing walks is a crap shoot.  In fact I see better umpiring in the minors.

Um, they still have the human element in the minors as well where I'm sure it is just as bad if not worse.

Edited August 5, 20196 yr by soxfan2014

The anti-Ron would say “I love you, Gregster, and will never report you to the board administrators for potential banning because we’re all Sox fans here and certainly don’t ever want to see one of our players to fail.”

He would be Elrockin mixed with a dash of Joe Maddon.

Edited August 5, 20196 yr by caulfield12

7 minutes ago, pcq said:

Good points but I expect they will retain him. Loyalty.

Like I said, I'm good with him coming back cheap for one year to DH since the options are very meh in free agency. Help Robert out with the transition to the MLB, spell Collins at 1B here and there. Rosters expand to 26 (capped at 13 pitchers) so the team will be more versatile anyway than the past like 5 years where they have only had 3 bench spots and 13 pitchers.

Edited August 5, 20196 yr by soxfan2014

9 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said:

Like I said, I'm good with him coming back cheap for one year to DH since the options are very meh in free agency. Help Robert out with the transition to the MLB, spell Collins at 1B here and there. Rosters expand to 26 (capped at 13 pitchers) so the team will be more versatile anyway than the past like 5 years where they have only had 3 bench spots and 13 pitchers.

Except he's made it known he doesn't want to DH.  I just hope that if he does fucking get resigned out of some stupid ass loyalty or "player coach" reasons he's a full time DH I cannot possibly sit through another year of every single ball 5 feet to his right going into the corner in RF.

5 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said:

Except he's made it known he doesn't want to DH.  I just hope that if he does fucking get resigned out of some stupid ass loyalty or "player coach" reasons he's a full time DH I cannot possibly sit through another year of every single ball 5 feet to his right going into the corner in RF.

I get that but when the guy is basically begging to come back, you let him know he's DH'ing a bulk of the time to give someone younger a shot at 1B.

1 hour ago, soxfan2014 said:

I get that but when the guy is basically begging to come back, you let him know he's DH'ing a bulk of the time to give someone younger a shot at 1B.

The problem is that someone younger is probably a placeholder type like a Smoak. Moreland, Adams.

That said, it would be more logical for Jose to accept DHing with established veterans playing the position than someone like Collins, Palka, etc.

I can just see it now...Renteria claiming Jose’s throwing ability makes up for his other defensive weaknesses.

I don't understand why everyone thinks every starting player on this team needs to be a 2+ WAR player. That's not the way it is on virtually any team. It certainly wasn't the case on the 2005 White Sox. Pods was a 1.7, Crede was a 1.6. Carl Everett was a 0.0 and Frank Thomas was a 0.4 - so our combined DH was a 0.4.  Why should the standards be different for Jose Abreu than any other position? If we take him out of defense, his WAR for this season goes way up - warts and all. I think he has one more hot streak in him. Yes, when he hits he's amazing and when he doesn't he looks done. His last 120 at bats are what everyone's focusing on in making a referendum about whether his career is over. I'd be careful with that. 120 ABs is still a miniscule sample size.

Edited August 6, 20196 yr by Greg Hibbard

On 8/5/2019 at 12:55 PM, chitownsportsfan said:

A "strong finish" would cement his status as a 1.5 WAR 1B.  A mediocre one cements his status as  washed up replacement level 1B.  There's no there there.  He's done.  The Sox have Collins if they want to try a 1 WAR 1B next year that won't cost more than the league min.

I hate to comment negativity about Collins because hasn't had much of a chance to prove himself but he is far from showing that he can be a 1 WAR first baseman.

2 hours ago, Greg Hibbard said:

I don't understand why everyone thinks every starting player on this team needs to be a 2+ WAR player. That's not the way it is on virtually any team. It certainly wasn't the case on the 2005 White Sox. Pods was a 1.7, Crede was a 1.6. Carl Everett was a 0.0 and Frank Thomas was a 0.4 - so our combined DH was a 0.4.  Why should the standards be different for Jose Abreu than any other position? If we take him out of defense, his WAR for this season goes way up - warts and all. I think he has one more hot streak in him. Yes, when he hits he's amazing and when he doesn't he looks done. His last 120 at bats are what everyone's focusing on in making a referendum about whether his career is over. I'd be careful with that. 120 ABs is still a miniscule sample size.

Poor Ron...another Abreu run left in him.

 

As to the post, that’s kind of the point though, that offense had 5 guys between 2-4 fWAR (balance) with Pods, Crede and AJ the bottom along with DH split.

Pods and Crede would be second and third on this year’s team.  

Right now, there’s only Moncada and then a huge gap to a fading McCann.

Then you have four starting pitchers from 3.3 to 5.9, with the worst of those in Contreras the best pitcher in baseball the final two months...the equivalent of Giolito when he went on his consecutive win run earlier this year.

Edited August 6, 20196 yr by caulfield12

2 hours ago, Greg Hibbard said:

I don't understand why everyone thinks every starting player on this team needs to be a 2+ WAR player. That's not the way it is on virtually any team. It certainly wasn't the case on the 2005 White Sox. Pods was a 1.7, Crede was a 1.6. Carl Everett was a 0.0 and Frank Thomas was a 0.4 - so our combined DH was a 0.4.  Why should the standards be different for Jose Abreu than any other position? If we take him out of defense, his WAR for this season goes way up - warts and all. I think he has one more hot streak in him. Yes, when he hits he's amazing and when he doesn't he looks done. His last 120 at bats are what everyone's focusing on in making a referendum about whether his career is over. I'd be careful with that. 120 ABs is still a miniscule sample size.

No not everyone is going to be a 2 win player, but you should look to improve on the people that aren’t. 

Also I don’t think this team can afford to trot out a below average lineup like they did in 05. 

Jose Abreu is terrible defensively but there's not that many guys out there that hit 25+ home runs and drive in 90+ runs as consistently as he does.  It's about to be 5 times in 6 seasons and last year, the one season he failed to do so he was injured. 

3 hours ago, Greg Hibbard said:

I don't understand why everyone thinks every starting player on this team needs to be a 2+ WAR player. That's not the way it is on virtually any team. It certainly wasn't the case on the 2005 White Sox. Pods was a 1.7, Crede was a 1.6. Carl Everett was a 0.0 and Frank Thomas was a 0.4 - so our combined DH was a 0.4.  Why should the standards be different for Jose Abreu than any other position? If we take him out of defense, his WAR for this season goes way up - warts and all. I think he has one more hot streak in him. Yes, when he hits he's amazing and when he doesn't he looks done. His last 120 at bats are what everyone's focusing on in making a referendum about whether his career is over. I'd be careful with that. 120 ABs is still a miniscule sample size.

Great post. That's why I was posting that our fans of the rebuild don't want to contend until every position player is a star and we are projected to cruise to the WS title. The basis of the Sox rebuild is to have superstars or stars at virtually every position. And they get a lot of projected stars as is: Stars to superstars: C-Collins. 3B-Moncada. SS-Tim. 2B-Madrigal. 1B-Vaughn. DH-Burger. LF-Eloy. CF-Robert. RF-Star to be acquired if Rutherford isn't a star.

Pitchers- for some reason they will allow mere mortals to be projected as part of the rotation but certainly there's hope this group will include several stars or superstars: Cease, Gio, Kopech, Lopez, Bummer reliever. Colome good nuff closer.

If the above mentioned every day players aren't star caliber, Hahn is gone. There doesn't appear to be as much depth down on the farm as we thought there'd be, though we get another top draft pick next year.

Edited August 6, 20196 yr by greg775