JUAN PIERRE

[beck72]

Of course our OF defense will definitely be weakened. It also means that 1 of Pods or Pierre probably won't be around in 2007 I'd say, considering the OF prospects we have waiting in the wings.

A case could be made that Pierre would get to more balls than Rowand, which would help the sox defense. And Ozzie has talked about not wanting to hurt the defense

[SSH2005]

Just imagine how fun it would be watching a 1-2 of Pods and Pierre.

 

THE KILLER P'S!!!

[beck72]

I'm not sure how devestating that 1-2 would be.  They each are basically the same type of player, and to hit in the 2 hole for Ozzie, you have to have great bat control and move the runner over, like Iguchi did this year.  Can Pierre/Pods actually do that?

I know they can get slap singles, but I'm not completely sure they have the best bat control in the world to be that effective at the top of the order.

Pierre would hit in the #2 spot and Castillo would hit leadoff for FLA. He has a few hundred AB's in that spot

[SSH2005]

This rumor of the Sox wanting Pierre is also in today's Miami Herald:

 

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/sport...ll/13209959.htm

A LOT OF INTEREST

 

Juan Pierre might find himself in the Windy City if the Marlins trade their center fielder.

 

But the Cubs, who are said to be interested in Pierre, could be bidding against the Chicago White Sox, who also have interest in the speedy lead-off hitter.

 

And the White Sox might make a better fit for the Marlins.

 

The reigning World Series champs would likely be willing to part with left-handed reliever Damaso Marte.

 

The Marlins have had previous interest in Marte and are seeking bullpen help while looking to shave payroll.

 

Marte fell out of favor with White Sox fans and manager Ozzie Guillen late in the season when he struggled.

 

His earned run average before the All-Star break: 2.81. After: 5.03.

 

Marte could prove affordable, though. He's due to earn $2.25 million next season with club options of $3 million (or a $250,000 buyout) for 2007 and `08.

 

The White Sox could also dangle center fielder Aaron Rowand, who is set to earn $3.25 million next season.

[beck72]

For their price, defense, and offensive potential, I would rather Aaron Rowand in the outfield than Juan Pierre for the Sox next year.  I don't really understand why the Sox want Pierre so much in the first place, or at least, appear to want him so much.

 

If the sox do go after Pierre, it would be because they think Pierre could do more for the sox than Rowand

[beck72]

If the sox are going hard after Pierre, [and the rumors of the sox interested in Thome--which Rowand would probably go to Philly], the question would be this---would the sox be a better team with 1] Pierre and Thome or 2] Rowand and Marte?

 

All things being equal, the sox need another on base guy at the top and power from the left side of the plate more than they need Arow and Marte.

[beck72]

In looking at this further, the sox need for another leadoff man in case of a Pods injury, makes this deal even more likely. Having Ozuna hit leadoff for awhile makes me cringe.

[Steve Bartman's my idol]

Assists numbers can be misleading.Of course manny lead the league cause he played the ball well of the Monster. His arm is average at best. Now Ichiro and Vlad's numbers are down cause of no one taking chances.

 

If you wanna talk about cannons. I got 3 in mind. Jesse Barfield, Dwight Evans and Roberto Clemente

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Harold Baines had a cannon!

 

[Guest JimH]

In looking at this further, the sox need for another leadoff man in case of a Pods injury, makes this deal even more likely.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Pierre is not a perfect player by any means, he has flaws, but taking away our personal likes/dislikes and biases, there's a good chance they'll try to get this guy.

 

Guillen came out and said he wanted more speed at the top of the lineup and presumably he wants a good hitter up there as well. He knows Pierre from Florida and the White Sox sure appear to be shopping Marte.

 

I think this rumor has validity.

[beck72]

Pierre is not a perfect player by any means, he has flaws, but taking away our personal likes/dislikes and biases, there's a good chance they'll try to get this guy.

 

Guillen came out and said he wanted more speed at the top of the lineup and presumably he wants a good hitter up there as well.  He knows Pierre from Florida and the White Sox sure appear to be shopping Marte.

 

I think this rumor has validity.

I agree. Ozzie knows far more about Pierre than any of us. The sox need to have a solid backup plan for leadoff in case Pods goes down. They don't have one now. Pierre could hit #2 and leadoff.

[Chisoxfn]

Assists numbers can be misleading.Of course manny lead the league cause he played the ball well of the Monster. His arm is average at best. Now Ichiro and Vlad's numbers are down cause of no one taking chances.

 

If you wanna talk about cannons. I got 3 in mind. Jesse Barfield, Dwight Evans and Roberto Clemente

As far as Vladdy goes, the smart teams run on him. His arm is great, but the odds of him throwing a good throw are slim to none. I definately appreciate all that Vladdy has done for the Angels, but one of the things he's yet to figure out is to hit his cutoff man and keep his throws down.

 

Although on any given play he can make an amazing play with his arm.

 

Manny gets all his assists because the scouting report is to run all day long on him so he gets a lot of opportunities to make throws. He does happen to play the monster really well (when he barehands and fires) which helps.

[Chisoxfn]

Ozzie knows all about Pierre. If he thinks adding Pierre [at the expense of Rowand probably, who'd have to be dealt to another team to make room] would make the sox a better team, then a few things would be clear:

1] Pierre's offense [ability to get onbase, steal bases, hit near .300] would help the sox score more runs on a consistent basis

2] Pierre's speed in the OF would take away more hits then his arm will give up

3] Pierre and Pods in the same OF wouldn't weaken the sox overall defense

I hate giving up Rowand, but I think if the Sox were able to give up Rowand for a Thome like presence (a trade centering around Rowand from the Phils perspective) and than Marte and maybe a prospect for Pierre (and considering Pierre's salary and coming off a down-season I don't know if they'd have to give up much more than Marte).

 

The Sox would revamp there offense with more speed, but they'd also have more power. On top of that, I can't say I've seen Pierre enough in center field, but he does cover pretty good ground and can make some nice plays.

 

I don't know how he compares with Pods at getting jumps (I sure hope he's better) but I wouldnt' worry too much about his arm as long as he is able to get solid reads on the ball and use his speed to get a good jump.

 

I can definately see Pierre making sense on the South Side. Problem is his salary, but that always means he could come here cheap in terms of what the Sox give up. Afterall, this is a guy who steals 50 bases a year and has hit over .300 in 3 of his 5 full major league seasons. The other 2 years he hit .287 and .276.

 

Here is his avg season:

.305 AVG, .355 OBP, 22 2B, 9 3B, 47 RBI, 51 SB (18 CS, 73% success rate), 43 BB, 40 K (you got to like the fact he doesn't strike out much).

[3E8]

The White Sox have interest in acquiring Juan Pierre, perhaps for Damaso Marte and/or Aaron Rowand.

It doesn't make a lot of sense, but with multiple sources reporting the story, there must be some truth to it. Pierre is both a worse player than Rowand and the more expensive of the two. Plus, he'd only be under the club's control for one year. If the White Sox do decide they need Pierre to go along with Scott Podsednik, they should at least refuse to give up Rowand in the deal and try to use him to upgrade elsewhere. Nov. 19 - 1:17 pm et

[qwerty]

Scott's is as well.

 

Yes, but he will just go to arbitration and will have no chance to leave. After pierre puts up very good numbers ( he most likely will in a contract year) he will go off to rape a team.

[Chisoxfn]

I could see the Sox trading Pierre and trying to lock him up at to a favorable contract (and fair one) knowing that he's probably a more long term option at the top of the order than Pods.

[Soxpranos]

I'll Take Pierre over Rowand any day. Give me the offense he provides along with making the opposing pitcher go out of his game when hes on the pads. Has way more speed than Rowand (doesnt play 385ft away from the plate) and will make the catches out there.

[Soxpranos]

Pierre is not a perfect player by any means, he has flaws, but taking away our personal likes/dislikes and biases, there's a good chance they'll try to get this guy.

 

Guillen came out and said he wanted more speed at the top of the lineup and presumably he wants a good hitter up there as well.  He knows Pierre from Florida and the White Sox sure appear to be shopping Marte.

 

I think this rumor has validity.

 

And Rowand is? Rowand has much more flaws than Pierre. Like No offense, strikes out 2 times as much as Pierre, cant make the routinecatch on bloops over 2nd base that have fallen for (last time I counted over 50 hits) Hits. No threat on the Pads when he actually gets on. Cant bunt for crap, just that reason alone is worth trading Rowand. How many times he couldnt get a simple bunt down is just ridiculous.

[Chisoxfn]

And Rowand is? Rowand has much more flaws than Pierre.  Like No offense, strikes out 2 times as much as Pierre, cant make the routinecatch on  bloops over 2nd base that have fallen for (last time I counted over 50 hits)  Hits. No threat on the Pads when he actually gets on. Cant bunt for crap, just that reason alone is worth trading Rowand. How many times he couldnt get a simple bunt down is just ridiculous.

We get your hatred of Rowand. Just ask scouts about Rowands defense. They'll tell you he's one of the best in the biz.

[Soxpranos]

We get your hatred of Rowand.  Just ask scouts about Rowands defense.  They'll tell you he's one of the best in the biz.

Not hatred, hes not even one of the top 6 Cf's. I just dont sweat his jock. Rowand is good, but far from great as you make him out to be.

[Soxpranos]

We get your hatred of Rowand.  Just ask scouts about Rowands defense.  They'll tell you he's one of the best in the biz.

 

 

Scouts say he his arm doesnt exist? Who cant make a deep catch playing 380 plus feet back?

[qwerty]

And Rowand is? Rowand has much more flaws than Pierre.  Like No offense, strikes out 2 times as much as Pierre, cant make the routinecatch on  bloops over 2nd base that have fallen for (last time I counted over 50 hits)  Hits. No threat on the Pads when he actually gets on. Cant bunt for crap, just that reason alone is worth trading Rowand. How many times he couldnt get a simple bunt down is just ridiculous.

 

How bad is our team as a whole bunting wise? We should be trading everyone offensively but about three. Fifty routine catches? You said fifty routine bloop hits...

[Rowand44]

Not hatred, hes not even one of the top 6 Cf's. I just dont sweat his jock. Rowand is good, but far from great as you make him out to be.

There are 2 centerfielders that are head and shoulders above everyone else in Jones and Hunter and then Aaron is in the next group with Cameron, Kotsay, Wells, and maybe a few others I'm not thinking of right now.

[CWSGuy406]

3] Pierre and Pods in the same OF wouldn't weaken the sox overall defense

 

Sure it would.

 

You'd be replacing Rowand with Pierre. Pierre is worse (I'm not sure how much worse, but it's fairly substantial) defensively than Rowand is.

 

So, you're losing runs on defense. And, I don't see a whole lot of offense improvement from Pierre... He might have the edge, but I think he's giving it right back 'cause he isn't anywhere near the defender that Rowand is.

 

But hey -- we'll have some more stolen bases. So that's good.

 

Beck, you go ahead and find me a statistic that shows Pierre being a better defender than Rowand. Please, do so.

 

Not hatred, hes not even one of the top 6 Cf's. I just dont sweat his jock. Rowand is good, but far from great as you make him out to be.

 

Name six better defensive centerfielders.

Edited November 19, 2005 by CWSGuy406

[qwerty]

Sure it would.

 

You'd be replacing Rowand with Pierre.  Pierre is worse (I'm not sure how much worse, but it's fairly substantial) defensively than Rowand is.

 

So, you're losing runs on defense.  And, I don't see a whole lot of offense improvement from Pierre...  He might have the edge, but I think he's giving it right back 'cause he isn't anywhere near the defender that Rowand is.

 

But hey -- we'll have some more stolen bases.  So that's good.

 

Beck, you go ahead and find me a statistic that shows Pierre being a better defender than Rowand.  Please, do so.

Name six better defensive centerfielders.

 

http://www.protrade.com/insight/InsightArt...utfieldArm.html

 

Scroll to the bottom for pierre.

[jphat007]

I could see the Sox trading Pierre and trying to lock him up at to a favorable contract (and fair one) knowing that he's probably a more long term option at the top of the order than Pods.

 

Why isn't Pods a long term option at the top of the order? And why in the world would Pierre be more of an option than him?