Getz vs. Nix

[danman31]

The connection not being made here is that BABIP itself will correlate to average, but the predictor is batted ball data. If a guy has a high line drive rate and a low batting average, you could say he will bounce back next year.

[Dick Allen]

The connection not being made here is that BABIP itself will correlate to average, but the predictor is batted ball data. If a guy has a high line drive rate and a low batting average, you could say he will bounce back next year.

13%. I'm thinking that's not so good. Getz was 19.2%.

[southsider2k5]

This thread has also been moved to the proper spot on the board.

[Milkman delivers]

I'm glad Ozzie knows who to start. That's Getz.

[simba43]

There’s something about that tone I find a bit patronizing. I recognize that Getz is the starter; it doesn’t mean I have to agree with it. Just like I recognize that you don’t think of much of Nix as a player, doesn’t mean I have to agree with that either. i think overall nix is a better all around player then getz .

 

[boejouma]

i would much rather prefer getz over nix. also i view retherford as the #3 prospect in our system. (#1 and #2 are hudson and flowers, respectively)

[ThunderBolt]

I think a lot of people get so invested in the player that they think Getz will be, they fail to see the player he is. I'll readily admit that i'm the same way with Jayson Nix. I just don't see Getz ever raising his OPB above the mid-330's, and if (a big if, i'll admit) Nix can raise his average to about .250, his defense makes him a dramatically better player.

[iamshack]

If I played in the major leagues my BABIP would be like .050 and I wonder if anyone would call me unlucky, when in fact I really just suck at baseball.

 

You wish...your BABIP would be N/A, because you would never put the ball in play...

[son of a rude]

Not sure that single-year UZR provides information that is precise enough for valid comparisons of player skills or to make future projections.

 

For example, in 2009...

 

Paul Konerko = 1.9; Mark Texeira = -1.1

 

Scotty Pods in CF = .7; Torii Hunter = -4.4

 

Chris Getz = -2.8; Orlando Hudson = -3.8; Brian Roberts = -4.1

 

Ryan Theriot = 5.8; Adam Everett = 2.3 (Theriot, who can't carry Everett's jockstrap defensively, was also ranked ahead of Furcal)

 

Nick Swisher = 2.9 in right field; Alex Rios = -2.3; Nick Markakis = -5.5

 

AJ ahead of Joe Mauer, Dioner Navarro, and Yadier Molina...

 

Etc., etc....

All of Nix' scouting reports rave about how he has incredible range. It wasn't a fluke. He is amazing on defense at 2B.

 

Nix has so much more potential than Getz. I really hope he breaks out in spring training. A powerful 2nd basemen who plays gold glove type defense is rare. Getz' ceiling is a low slugging, slap happy player who can steal a lot of bases and hopefully put up a .360 OBP. He blows. If Nix doesn't break out in spring training, I hate what we have at 2nd base.

 

The only reason I see us playing Getz is because we hope he can become a future leadoff hitter. If we had one right now, it would be a simple choice to who we play at 2nd. With our pitching staff the way it is, why wouldn't you want an extremely good defensive infield? Nix' defense would help tremendously.

Edited October 22, 2009 by son of a rude

[iamshack]

Personally, I am not sure I like either of these guys to be an everyday player. But I am still waiting for an answer as to how Nix is suddenly going to begin hitting righties.

 

I don't know how much more clearly this could be stated, and it has been several times. Nix's production came in absolute ideal situations for him. How is placing him in ALL situations going to somehow improve his production, rather than a slight increase in his raw output due to significantly more opportunities?

[lostfan]

You wish...your BABIP would be N/A, because you would never put the ball in play...

That would just make me even more unlucky.

[Kyyle23]

Everyone talks about Nix range and skill at 2b, but honestly I cannot recall one moment where I thought to myself "damn that was a good play" when he was out there.

 

And I am not saying I saw that from Getz, but Getz isnt the one who gets this defensive prodigy tag set on his head.

[ChWRoCk2]

Lillibridge should not even be in the discussion as a utility player. He is awful. Give CJ a chance, no need to waste space with Brent.

[lostfan]

Lillibridge should not even be in the discussion as a utility player. He is awful. Give CJ a chance, no need to waste space with Brent.

Agreed, throw Lillibridge in AAA and see if he can salvage his career and earn another shot at some point in the future, but the future is not now for him.

[Harry Chappas]

Why isn't CJ in the starter conversation?

 

If Nix and Getz improve upon last year they are both fine. If they do not, neither is worth anything and thus CJ should get a shot.

[ChiSox_Sonix]

I think a lot of people get so invested in the player that they think Getz will be, they fail to see the player he is. I'll readily admit that i'm the same way with Jayson Nix. I just don't see Getz ever raising his OPB above the mid-330's, and if (a big if, i'll admit) Nix can raise his average to about .250, his defense makes him a dramatically better player.

 

He was a rookie this year. He had an OBP of .340 in the second half of this year. It just completely baffles me how people continue to ride this guy. Look, he'll never be an all-star. We get it. But we're also not the Yankees, we can't have 9 all-stars hitting 20 HRs a year for us. Getz looked fine to me in the field and does little things much better than Nix; making contact, hitting behind runners, bunting etc...Getz is a baseball player. He plays the game the right way. He also was 25/27 in SB this year and missed a bunch of time. What that tells me is if he can raise his OBP and stay healthy he could potentially steal 35 bases a year. You put him in the 9 spot in our lineup and I'll take it. I've said it plenty of times but Chris Getz reminds me of the prototypical Minnesota Twin little infielder that doesnt seem to have great tools but just gets the job done and we all wonder how or why. Then we complain we don't have anyone like that blah blah blah. Well now we do. I'd think more people would be happy about that and recognize that what someone does in their rookie year plagued with injuries shouldn't be viewed as their ceiling. Nix supposedly has so much room to grow but somehow Chris Getz has topped out? Sorry, I just don't buy it. Getz is a gamer, I expect him to have a solid 10 year career in this league.

[elrockinMT]

 

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseb...74.story

 

According to the last paragraph of this article, Ozzie thinks that C. J. Retherford, or someone else already in the organization may be able to take the utility job away from Nix and/or Lillibridge this spring.

 

 

Lili maybe. You have to be able to hit the ball to stay in the majors

[WCSox]

I don't understand the "luck" issue on BABIP either. If a guy throws me a slider away and I turn it over and ground out to short I'm unlucky, but if I take it the other way and double into the right center field gap, I'm lucky. It seems to me players do that a lot when they are slumping and I have never heard anyone call what Jermaine Dye went through the second half of the season as unlucky. I haven't looked, but as players get old and their skills erode, I would imagine their BABIP goes down as well. Wise and Lillibridge most likely have well below average BABIP. Does their "luck" have to change?

 

There's no such thing as long-term "luck" (or lack thereof). People may get the short end of the stick every once in a while, but people who are "lucky" or "unlucky" over a prolonged period of time are so for a reason.

 

He was a rookie this year. He had an OBP of .340 in the second half of this year. It just completely baffles me how people continue to ride this guy. Look, he'll never be an all-star. We get it... I've said it plenty of times but Chris Getz reminds me of the prototypical Minnesota Twin little infielder that doesnt seem to have great tools but just gets the job done and we all wonder how or why. Then we complain we don't have anyone like that blah blah blah. Well now we do. I'd think more people would be happy about that and recognize that what someone does in their rookie year plagued with injuries shouldn't be viewed as their ceiling. Nix supposedly has so much room to grow but somehow Chris Getz has topped out? Sorry, I just don't buy it. Getz is a gamer, I expect him to have a solid 10 year career in this league.

 

Great post.

 

As for Nix, I guess it's nice to see Ozzie light a fire under his rear. But it'd be pretty silly for Ozzie to relegate him to Triple A. He's an almost ideal utility infielder who can also play the corner OF positions in a pinch. And if Getz goes down with another injury, we're going to need him.

 

[balfanman]

The guys that we're talking about, Getz, Nix, Lillibridge, Retherford, are all relatively young and still capable of improvement. Next spring I think that any of the four could show improvement or regression depending upon how things are going for them at that time. Personally, I hope that Lillibridge improves enough with the bat to win the utility role because I view him (jmho) as the most versatile, and good enough defensively to be the most valuable in that role.

Edited October 22, 2009 by balfanman

[SoxAce]

He was a rookie this year. He had an OBP of .340 in the second half of this year. It just completely baffles me how people continue to ride this guy. Look, he'll never be an all-star. We get it. But we're also not the Yankees, we can't have 9 all-stars hitting 20 HRs a year for us. Getz looked fine to me in the field and does little things much better than Nix; making contact, hitting behind runners, bunting etc...Getz is a baseball player. He plays the game the right way. He also was 25/27 in SB this year and missed a bunch of time. What that tells me is if he can raise his OBP and stay healthy he could potentially steal 35 bases a year. You put him in the 9 spot in our lineup and I'll take it. I've said it plenty of times but Chris Getz reminds me of the prototypical Minnesota Twin little infielder that doesnt seem to have great tools but just gets the job done and we all wonder how or why. Then we complain we don't have anyone like that blah blah blah. Well now we do. I'd think more people would be happy about that and recognize that what someone does in their rookie year plagued with injuries shouldn't be viewed as their ceiling. Nix supposedly has so much room to grow but somehow Chris Getz has topped out? Sorry, I just don't buy it. Getz is a gamer, I expect him to have a solid 10 year career in this league.

 

Jesus Christ. Somebody f***ing gets it!!!

[son of a rude]

There's no such thing as long-term "luck" (or lack thereof). People may get the short end of the stick every once in a while, but people who are "lucky" or "unlucky" over a prolonged period of time are so for a reason.

 

 

 

Great post.

 

As for Nix, I guess it's nice to see Ozzie light a fire under his rear. But it'd be pretty silly for Ozzie to relegate him to Triple A. He's an almost ideal utility infielder who can also play the corner OF positions in a pinch. And if Getz goes down with another injury, we're going to need him.

Ugh, why would you want players like that? Nick Punto! Oh yeah!

 

There's a reason the twins never make it past first round...

[East Side Z]

Im a Getz guy myself..........Always liked him and he should be the starter at 2nd.That being said Nix is a pretty good ballplayer and he will improve and he has the capacity to improve.I think Nix will push people for their jobs the question is where??

I personaly would like Nix at 3rd Beckham at SS and Getz at second.I would try and get something significant for Alexie and I was a big Alexie guy also.I picked him when i was on PSD to make the team out of ST 2 yeras ago.

[Chisoxfn]

Ugh, why would you want players like that? Nick Punto! Oh yeah!

 

There's a reason the twins never make it past first round...

Ya, they don't have the quality pitching to make it farther.

[WCSox]

Ugh, why would you want players like that? Nick Punto! Oh yeah!

 

There's a reason the twins never make it past first round...

 

You're right. We're better off running out more expensive veterans who can't hit in August or September, can't run the bases intelligently, and can't play defense.

 

[son of a rude]

You're right. We're better off running out more expensive veterans who can't hit in August or September, can't run the bases intelligently, and can't play defense.

You made a sarcastic commenting alluding to Chris Getz playing good defense. Keep up the good work.