May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (knightni @ May 5, 2012 -> 09:34 PM) Vance Worley would work for me. Philly can afford to move a SP to shore up their bullpen. Are the Phillies really in a position to give up that much in return for Matt Thornton, especially with his salary? Seems like fixing their offense on the fly with some band-aids for this season would be more of a priority.
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 5, 2012 -> 10:37 PM) Are the Phillies really in a position to give up that much in return for Matt Thornton, especially with his salary? Seems like fixing their offense on the fly with some band-aids for this season would be more of a priority. I didn't say that it would happen. I just speculated that it would be a nice trade for the Sox.
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (knightni @ May 5, 2012 -> 10:34 PM) Vance Worley would work for me. Philly can afford to move a SP to shore up their bullpen. Philly is sitting at $174.5 million team salary in the USA Today version here, and the Luxury tax level is $178 million. Phils are sitting at that level for a reason, just like the Red Sox, so that they don't hit the luxury tax level and get compound penalties if they go over it another year.
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 5, 2012 -> 10:38 PM) Philly is sitting at $174.5 million team salary in the USA Today version here, and the Luxury tax level is $178 million. Phils are sitting at that level for a reason, just like the Red Sox, so that they don't hit the luxury tax level and get compound penalties if they go over it another year. How are they going to do roster expansion on Sept 1 then? Won't that add more than 3.5 mil to their salaries?
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (knightni @ May 5, 2012 -> 08:41 PM) How are they going to do roster expansion on Sept 1 then? Won't that add more than 3.5 mil to their salaries? They don't have to bring up more than a handful of players (3-4-5-6 guys), and their salaries are pro-rated for just that month, right?
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (caulfield12 @ May 5, 2012 -> 10:43 PM) They don't have to bring up more than a handful of players (3-4-5-6 guys), and their salaries are pro-rated for just that month, right? Correct on both, I'd guess. Each team might have a million or two worth of space to add, but they're starting at $174-$175 for a reason, to stay under that tax.
May 6, 201213 yr Plus those guys are going to be making the MLB minimum for the most part. The bigger question would be adding a bat at the deadline.
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (knightni @ May 5, 2012 -> 09:34 PM) Vance Worley would work for me. Philly can afford to move a SP to shore up their bullpen. No way Philly will give up Worley for Thornton. Maybe Sale or Reed though (not sure I'd be okay with that though).
May 6, 201213 yr So lemme get this straight. We're going to continue on with Hector Santiago in our bullpen. Addison Reed in our bullpen. Chris Sale in our bullpen. and Zach Stewart in our bullpen. who the f*** is starting for us next year? Danks, Humber, Axelrod, ________, _________ if the plan were going to be either one of Stewart and Santiago, why the f*** haven't they already been sent down to work as starters? I hate everything about white sox baseball right now.
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (Reddy @ May 6, 2012 -> 12:30 AM) So lemme get this straight. We're going to continue on with Hector Santiago in our bullpen. Addison Reed in our bullpen. Chris Sale in our bullpen. and Zach Stewart in our bullpen. who the f*** is starting for us next year? Danks, Humber, Axelrod, ________, _________ if the plan were going to be either one of Stewart and Santiago, why the f*** haven't they already been sent down to work as starters? I hate everything about white sox baseball right now. Well, Bud Selig and friends have been making a lot of changes of late. The draft, extra Wildcard. Maybe they'll institute a rule in which the first five innings of baseball games are eliminated and go from just innings 6-9. Then the White Sox will be a potential juggernaut. Damn, that was kinda lame. But yeah, you don't build your franchise around bullpen arms. I don't care how good they are. Look at Tampa. That's how you're supposed to treat the bullpen. Edited May 6, 201213 yr by Jordan4life
May 6, 201213 yr And this gets back to the point of why I'm so angry with Williams and the Sox management in general. Chris Sale was the key component for us to be competitive in the future, him becoming a sort of Randy Johnson-Lite. Without that, having the greatest young bullpen since The Nasty Boys in Cincy doesn't mean a thing unless you have the starting line-up and rotation to put the back end of your bullpen in a position to consistently close out games. Granted, they still have the option of holding onto Floyd ONE MORE YEAR if they feel they can actually compete in 2013, but that's 50/50 at best right now. So there legitimately could be at least THREE openings in the starting rotation, and if they're filled with young/rookie pitchers, it will take them at least 2-3 years (see Baltimore Orioles of today or Glavine/Smoltz/Avery in the late 80's/early 90's) to become consistent winners at the big league level, and there are SUBSTANTIAL doubts in the minds of everyone around baseball those guys have the talent to even do it. We're not the 30th ranked farm system in the majors without reason. Danks Floyd ??? (option for 2013) Humber Axelrod, Molina, S. Castro, Hector Santiago, maybe Pedro Hernandez (BIRM)...you'd have to say the odds for Zach Stewart look very long to be a starter again...and perhaps Petricka, but that would be a huge reach or stretch for 2013. So we really have 5 guys for two and possibly three open spots (although surely we'd get young pitching back for Floyd in a trade). But, yeah, not really pretty projecting forward into future years past this one. Edited May 6, 201213 yr by caulfield12
May 6, 201213 yr You know what we should do? We should project everything based on what happened two days ago and expect nothing else to happen, ever. that is what we should do.
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ May 6, 2012 -> 08:17 AM) You know what we should do? We should project everything based on what happened two days ago and expect nothing else to happen, ever. that is what we should do. That's exactly what I was thinking, too...Because this is the exact roster we will have for the next 7 years.
May 6, 201213 yr I've been busy the past few days and honestly not following the team. Imagine my surprise this morning as I read this thread. I kept looking over my shoulder to the window, half expecting the sun not to rise. I don't like that the team is in a position that they feel this is a necessary step.
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (iamshack @ May 6, 2012 -> 08:19 AM) That's exactly what I was thinking, too...Because this is the exact roster we will have for the next 7 years. Well we both know Kenny never trades anyone, and he always has the same roster. With caulfields predictions of doom and death, and fathom's worrisome assessment of Robin Ventura through 26 games, and Marty needing to trade everyone and anyone, we should really start to think about the Sox quitting the AL and moving to the Independent league.
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ May 6, 2012 -> 08:28 AM) Well we both know Kenny never trades anyone, and he always has the same roster. With caulfields predictions of doom and death, and fathom's worrisome assessment of Robin Ventura through 26 games, and Marty needing to trade everyone and anyone, we should really start to think about the Sox quitting the AL and moving to the Independent league. And we dislike Cowley
May 6, 201213 yr Hey, I only talked of impending DOOM, no mentions of death as of YET. My metaphorical signature doesn't count. It's an allegory, not to be taken literally, lol. Edited May 6, 201213 yr by caulfield12
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (Tex @ May 6, 2012 -> 08:39 AM) And we dislike Cowley why the green? it is true
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ May 6, 2012 -> 08:17 AM) You know what we should do? We should project everything based on what happened two days ago and expect nothing else to happen, ever. that is what we should do. Where are they going to get a potential top-of-the-rotation starter next year. If Danks doesn't step up they'll need two. Every year they go without that settled is a rebuilding year. Edited May 6, 201213 yr by Marty34
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (Marty34 @ May 6, 2012 -> 09:20 AM) Where are they going to get a potential top-of-the-rotation starter next year. If Danks doesn't step up they'll need two. Every year they go without that settled is a rebuilding year. Chris Sale and Nestor Molina.
May 6, 201213 yr I dont know Marty, it is really hard to tell within this large vacuum that everyone is making predictions from
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ May 6, 2012 -> 08:28 AM) Well we both know Kenny never trades anyone, and he always has the same roster. With caulfields predictions of doom and death, and fathom's worrisome assessment of Robin Ventura through 26 games, and Marty needing to trade everyone and anyone, we should really start to think about the Sox quitting the AL and moving to the Independent league. QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ May 6, 2012 -> 09:14 AM) why the green? it is true Fixed. Just pointing out that Cowley would fit better here than we like to think. BTW, great post earlier.
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ May 6, 2012 -> 08:23 AM) I dont know Marty, it is really hard to tell within this large vacuum that everyone is making predictions from we have no minor league system from which to cultivate two starting pitchers we have no minor league system from which to deal for two starting pitchers we have no major league pieces with friendly enough contracts to deal for two starting pitchers we have absolutely zero track record on drafting decent players, and even if we did, that would be a couple years off. the reality is, we're not going to be competitive for the next couple years. and that bums me out.
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (Reddy @ May 6, 2012 -> 09:47 AM) we have no minor league system from which to cultivate two starting pitchers we have no minor league system from which to deal for two starting pitchers we have no major league pieces with friendly enough contracts to deal for two starting pitchers we have absolutely zero track record on drafting decent players, and even if we did, that would be a couple years off. the reality is, we're not going to be competitive for the next couple years. and that bums me out. This has been said pretty much every season since KW has been the GM, yet somehow he has been able to trade for proven starters like Peavy, Jackson, Garcia, Vazquez, etc. Somehow the Sox minors doesnt look as bad to opposing GMs as it does to us, weird.
May 6, 201213 yr QUOTE (Reddy @ May 6, 2012 -> 09:47 AM) we have no minor league system from which to cultivate two starting pitchers we have no minor league system from which to deal for two starting pitchers we have no major league pieces with friendly enough contracts to deal for two starting pitchers we have absolutely zero track record on drafting decent players, and even if we did, that would be a couple years off. the reality is, we're not going to be competitive for the next couple years. and that bums me out. Now you have a lot of extra time during the summer to do something you might enjoy.
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