So How Does Hahn Fix This Mess?

[southsider2k5]

There's also appropriation reasons that would make it more financially feasible than other years. The Sox draft pool is 5.35 million which is good for 25th in the MLB. Last year they doled out nearly 10 million in draft spending. I would love to see them pour in some assets to mitigate the weak #8 pick and lost 2nd/3rd round slot values.

 

The really nice thing about dipping into Cuba is you have years of growth and development that you don't have to guess at. Most of these kids are much older than the Latin America kids signing on July 2. You have a much more accurate look at a Eddy Martinez at age 20, then you do Fernando Tatis Jr at age 16.

[LDF]

The really nice thing about dipping into Cuba is you have years of growth and development that you don't have to guess at. Most of these kids are much older than the Latin America kids signing on July 2. You have a much more accurate look at a Eddy Martinez at age 20, then you do Fernando Tatis Jr at age 16.

 

nice and very accurate.

[GGajewski18]

When does RV get fired? And I can see us really only trading Alexei and Soto (someone will want a back up catcher)

[caulfield12]

Hahn will have no choice but to trade Samardzija if these keeps up, if for no other reason than payroll relief.

 

And Rick can't think about what a comp pick is going to do in 2020. He needs to save his job, starting next season.

[LDF]

Hahn will have no choice but to trade Samardzija if these keeps up, if for no other reason than payroll relief.

 

And Rick can't think about what a comp pick is going to do in 2020. He needs to save his job, starting next season.

 

how bout asking to start early, like tomorrow.

[harfman77]

Hahn will have no choice but to trade Samardzija if these keeps up, if for no other reason than payroll relief.

 

And Rick can't think about what a comp pick is going to do in 2020. He needs to save his job, starting next season.

 

That would be shortsighted. Going into the rebuild process most knew it was going to be painful and take some time to get the system to a place where it needs to be to compete. Giving up a comp pick for salary relief is counter to what has happened since RH took over, the idea should still be to build a farm system that can graduate ML talent on a regular basis and fill in the gaps through FA. They took a short cut last year in free agency to try and make the ML team more competitive in the short term, but the vision is still there. The Sox have more high end prospects (Anderson, Danish, Adams, Montas) then they have had in a long time. I don't think JR is going to pull the plug on the rebuilding effort because the results in year 3 of the rebuild are average.

 

Hahn is going to be fine, he has a plan and so far he has done a very good job at acquiring talent. I think RV moves on at the end of the season and they bring in a more blue collar guy.

[LDF]

That would be shortsighted. Going into the rebuild process most knew it was going to be painful and take some time to get the system to a place where it needs to be to compete. Giving up a comp pick for salary relief is counter to what has happened since RH took over, the idea should still be to build a farm system that can graduate ML talent on a regular basis and fill in the gaps through FA. They took a short cut last year in free agency to try and make the ML team more competitive in the short term, but the vision is still there. The Sox have more high end prospects (Anderson, Danish, Adams, Montas) then they have had in a long time. I don't think JR is going to pull the plug on the rebuilding effort because the results in year 3 of the rebuild are average.

 

Hahn is going to be fine, he has a plan and so far he has done a very good job at acquiring talent. I think RV moves on at the end of the season and they bring in a more blue collar guy.

 

i was not shortsighted in this yr, nor was i going to step back from i believe going into this season. my opinion then and now is not the point of this post.

 

lets look at the salary contract that the sox have now. on the FA's that were signed last off season, the longest and not for my point, i will not talk about the RP's. the hitters, Melky at 3 yrs, Adam at 2 yrs. EB a 1 yr option for yr 2.

 

hitting wise, Hahn did a wise thing with the hitters, making the assumption that the farm will be able to supplement the parent club.

 

still the 2 hole are still there.

[Big Hurtin]

With a giant one of these.

 

[knightni]

With a giant one of these.

ARod isn't coming here.

[Southwest Sider]

This team has for too long had a lethargic tone about it. They'll show flashes of excitement, like any team, but never seem to seize the momentum from it. They bring in seemingly good players, but it never amounts to what is a good baseball team. I'm remembering back to the offseason, and all the talk of the Blue Jays wanting to hire KW as their team CEO. Ultimately, it seems like a real shame the Sox decided to go for it, at this point. This would have been a golden opportunity for JR to clean house without having to mean-spiritedly "fire" everyone. JR could have been like "Well, I lost my team president, might as well let all of 'his' people go because they haven't been working anyway". But that's just the problem. KW's people are also JR's people. JR is praised for his loyalty, but he truly is loyal to a fault. I used to think it was a great quality of our ownership, but now I see it as a serious detractor.

 

As it is, this team is underachieving. They play sloppy baseball. Yes, a lot of it falls on Robin. But, this brand of baseball has been in place since 2007. Even the World Series champion Ozzie Guillen could not stop it from happening. So yes, Robin is partially responsible for this. But most of all, everyone is responsible for this, including the front office. Ken Williams and company, it is time to go. You have overseen too many years of an absolutely horrible brand of baseball, and you don't even have an elite farm system to show for it. Rick Hahn, might be more willing to give him the benefit of the doubt... but he is probably a KW guy. I like Rick Hahn, but I don't know if he is the voice or leader this team needs, or if he would implement a different organizational philosophy were he team president.

 

All in all, none of this will happen. We sit here with a solid group of "core" players that we really lucked into. Abreu, Sale, Quintana, Garcia, Robertson, Eaton (I believe he is better and is having a sophomore slump) and soon to be Rodon. That's a pretty decent group. But faced with the idea of trading from that group to rebuild the farm, or trying to add to that group to contend, what do you choose? It is extremely difficult to digest the idea of trading Sale or Abreu. That's probably also how KW feels, and only a new leader of the front office would have the stones to trade those guys. You can trade them, tank a couple more years a la the Cubs. These players are good players but without them, you were going to have to do an all out rebuild anyway. Face it, the Sox lucked into Abreu, lucked into Sales arm not falling off yet, and lucked into Quintana being a good player. These players could be your golden ticket to a rebuild. Or you can keep trying to build around them. Keep adding to the payroll. The problem is, will they add to payroll, add significant free agents? They have chosen the path of minimal farm system, but in order to do that you need to add REAL quality free agents, and have to pay market value. You can't sit here and say "I won't ever give a pitcher a 5 year deal" if you aren't willing to really focus on having a great farm system. You can't scoff at the idea of paying a player 200 million dollars. If you want to play with the big dogs, you have to PAY the big dogs. If you want to play with the big dogs but not pay the big dogs, well then we should have focused on rebuilding the farm right around 2007, and continued to focus on the farm. I fully understand that buying all the elite free agents can leave your franchise in a worse state financially, but I also don't believe there is a middle ground. If you want to compete, you have to buy the Max Scherzers of the world. Not sit there in the next tier of free agents and hope that you can catch lightning in a bottle again.

 

 

As a fan, I am highly disappointed. I bought into this team. Yes, it was only a 7 game ticket plan, but I was sold that this team would be decent. I am willing to bet that a lot of others were, because of the amount of ticket plans sold before the season started. This is going to leave a BAD taste in a lot of peoples mouths, and may lead to even lower attendance in the coming years. It's the whole fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me. Fans vote with their dollars. I know a lot of people complain about our attendance, but I truly believe now that fans really are voting with their dollars. A lot of fans were already fed up with the uninspiring baseball, and weren't coming out because of years past. A lot of fans bought into the hype of this team, and now might start to feel disconnected from the team. If the season ends the way I think it is, I am definitely NOT buying tickets again next year, no matter what they do in the offseason. I am now a proponent of change. I don't know what kind of change, but SOME kind of change. And change will only come when their profits go red. If this season ends the way it seems like it will, then I am now all for cleaning house and starting fresh.

 

Will it happen? Probably not with JR as the owner. As much as people might complain about the Bears ownership, they had the stones to clean house and bring in Ernie Accorsi as an adviser to help rebuild their front office. I think JR could use the same, but would he be willing to live with himself after firing everyone? Probably not. Will JR sell the team? Probably not. To the OP's original question, how does Rick Hahn fix this mess?

 

Rick Hahn alone cannot fix this mess. He's trying to the best of his ability, but he cannot purge this organization of the bad baseball disease that has been around for too long. The real question to me is, how do WE fix this mess? Vote with your dollars.

Edited June 3, 2015 by South Sider

[chitownsportsfan]

Great post South Sider. It's a stale orginization that needs new blood all throughout the system, not just at the top or bottom but the minor leagues, the roving instructors, advance scouts, the whole org top to bottom needs a thorough reboot.

 

Hahn is only one man and at the end of the day so if RV. The structure and (don't laugh) "the White Sox way" hasn't worked for close to a decade now. It's time to broom IMO.

[chitownsportsfan]

Sox brought in plenty this past September/October? Why do you think otherwise?

 

Well we could start with the fact that apparently nobody knew that Gallo is pretty f***ing good. Or maybe Shark's ego just told him to challenge the talented rookie.

[Balta1701]

Sox brought in plenty this past September/October? Why do you think otherwise?

There used to be times when Walker was here, I remember a couple against Detroit, where it seemed like the whole roster came into a game with a plan. "We're all going to take a couple extra pitches and get Verlander out of here" or "We're going to wait on his fastball".

 

I can't remember the last time I've felt like that, particularly against someone who is actually a challenge.

[chitownsportsfan]

There used to be times when Walker was here, I remember a couple against Detroit, where it seemed like the whole roster came into a game with a plan. "We're all going to take a couple extra pitches and get Verlander out of here" or "We're going to wait on his fastball".

 

I can't remember the last time I've felt like that, particularly against someone who is actually a challenge.

 

Maybe they go into the game with the plan but it quickly goes out the window. Guys are certainly pressing, trying to make too much happen with every AB instead of just simply looking to take the ball up the middle, get a base hit, and move the order along. Avi, bless his heart, has come through quite a bit this year, but he's also been one of the main culprits in not letting the pitcher get himself in trouble.

 

It's common sense: the guy has just thrown 5 straight balls, he's walked the last hitter -- don't f***ing go up looking for a strike on first pitch. Again, goes back to trying to do too much IMO. It's a vicious cycle.

 

This is a radical solution but if I was RV I would consider telling everyone not named Abreu or LaRoche to take until they get a strike the first time through. At least see a few more pitches, get the pitch count a little higher, and try and see if the starter will get himself into trouble.

Edited June 3, 2015 by chitownsportsfan

[LDF]

Great post South Sider. It's a stale orginization that needs new blood all throughout the system, not just at the top or bottom but the minor leagues, the roving instructors, advance scouts, the whole org top to bottom needs a thorough reboot.

 

Hahn is only one man and at the end of the day so if RV. The structure and (don't laugh) "the White Sox way" hasn't worked for close to a decade now. It's time to broom IMO.

 

i see this whole org from the top down is a group of complacent personnel who are just used this this and don't realize it.

 

that is why, as i said last week, bring in someone to gauge and come in with a harsh audit.

 

somewhere in this org, something change and again, what was the "it" that change.

[LDF]

There used to be times when Walker was here, I remember a couple against Detroit, where it seemed like the whole roster came into a game with a plan. "We're all going to take a couple extra pitches and get Verlander out of here" or "We're going to wait on his fastball".

 

I can't remember the last time I've felt like that, particularly against someone who is actually a challenge.

 

i posted this on another thread, i will do it again.

 

my confusion is, is it:

 

1. RV fault and he is out of his element

 

2. is it the players fault completely.

[Balta1701]

i posted this on another thread, i will do it again.

 

my confusion is, is it:

 

1. RV fault and he is out of his element

 

2. is it the players fault completely.

I don't know the answer to this. But my answer in reply is:

 

If it's #1, then the coaching staff needs cleaned out.

 

If it's #2, then the people who brought in these players need cleaned out.

 

I'm ok with either and heck, I'm ok with both. A response of "neither" means that the franchise is ok with this continued losing.

[chitownsportsfan]

Good thing everybody knew Fielder was good. That's all it took to get him out.

 

You asked for an example and I gave one. I don't think I'm the only one a bit puzzled they kept throwing him heat over the plate like he was Carlos Sanchez.

[LDF]

I don't know the answer to this. But my answer in reply is:

 

If it's #1, then the coaching staff needs cleaned out.

 

If it's #2, then the people who brought in these players need cleaned out.

 

I'm ok with either and heck, I'm ok with both. A response of "neither" means that the franchise is ok with this continued losing.

 

you make a point, my point is, at this state, where should the finger be pointed toward.

 

all during the past several weeks, i am ready to jump on the sox upper management fault. now i am trying to keep an even opinion. which after looking at yesterday, i am confuse to whom is at fault.