WAR doesn't account for pitch framing though.

And why is that? If pitch framing data is as reliable as some here seem to believe, why would WAR exclude it from its valuation of catcher defense?

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/sortable...php?cid=1821757

I'd call #3 "one of the best".

 

Eh that's 2015.

And why is that? If pitch framing data is as reliable as some here seem to believe, why would WAR exclude it from its valuation of catcher defense?

Because it's complicated. Framing helps pitchers (which probably increases their WAR), and if you include it for catchers then you're double-counting WAR.

@scotgregor: Looking ahead: Sale starts for #WhiteSox tomorrow vs. Boston's Steven Wright, who has allowed 10 R, 11 H in 9.1 IP in last 2 starts

 

 

Offense should tee off again tomorrow

Good. We need to sweep and Sale needs to get a win to improve his Cy Young chances.

6 outs away from a Chris Sale start and a shot at .500

 

Not bad.

 

 

And then we quickly find out how real this team's transformation is when they face some real competition in teams like the Yankees and Cubs.

 

Last time they reached .500, they went 1-7 to follow it up. Let's hope that's not the case this time or there will be a lot of disappointed White Sox fans.

 

 

 

Hamels is close to going to the Rangers again...supposedly.

My argument? Ok, hitting-wise, he's extremely inconsistent and he basically sucks. But, defense at the catcher's position is very important. And while he is a "replacement level" defensive catcher, he is better at throwing runners out (stealing) than Soto, and he is one of the best pitch framers in all of baseball. If framing were a part of WAR, he'd be a positive WAR player. So, yes, he's not a good player, but he doesn't suck.

 

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Pitch framing has more to do with catching guys who don't walk people. It's the pitchers not the catchers. Building an argument for Flowers and bringing up pitch framing is dubious at best.

@ckamka: Jose Quintana's last 7 starts:

2.81 ERA, 48.0 IP, 43/2 K/BB, 3 HR

 

 

Edited July 30, 201510 yr by SouthSideSale

I liked that graphic about the Royals after 98 games last year.

Melky now 18-32 on the trip.

Melky back on track

I was starting to get worried about Melky. It had been a while since he had an extra-base hit.

Because it's complicated. Framing helps pitchers (which probably increases their WAR), and if you include it for catchers then you're double-counting WAR.

I think they should either double count it or if it is a catcher skill, take that particular aspect away from the pitcher, and give it to the catcher.

Abreu RBI

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Pitch framing has more to do with catching guys who don't walk people. It's the pitchers not the catchers. Building an argument for Flowers and bringing up pitch framing is dubious at best.

Ok, even if you completely eliminate framing, he still hovers around the "average" mark defensively, has huge hitting streaks twice a year despite normal sucky offense, and is the preferred catcher of our staff.

Because it's complicated. Framing helps pitchers (which probably increases their WAR), and if you include it for catchers then you're double-counting WAR.

While a fair point, not sure it's fair to assign the full value of pitch framing to the catcher when the pitcher clearly has some impact on the process.

The Pirates essentially built their defensive philosophy around pitch-framing and shifting. The other component was pitchers throwing more to contact with two seamers/sinkers and keeping the ball on the infield and then having superlative outfielders paired with them.

 

It's worked extremely well for them with both Russell Martin and then Cervelli this season.

Edited July 30, 201510 yr by caulfield12

I love this swagger they have going. They're having fun

Winning is fung.

Nice heads up play by Abreu!

f***ing Bad News Bears Red Sox

Damn the Red Sox are terrible.

The Red Sox are hilaribad.

What was that? LOL.

Adam LaRoche=Stonewall Jackson?

 

LOL.

 

The Red Sox radio announcers are really bored...