Buehrlesque

Fans complaining to Sox employees, even with season-ticket cancellations, isn't going to change anything. Reinsdorf doesn't care and probably isn't monitoring the response anyway. The only ways things could change are Someone gets through to TLR himself to voluntarily step down Sox players revolt The commish or other owners threaten some kind of punishment Even still, I think Sox fans and media need to continue to voice their displeasure to all this. Despite Reinsdorf not being available publicly, the heat needs to continue to be turned up on Hahn, KW, Reifert, etc., even though they clearly had no real part in the decision and have no real power to reverse it. Heck, an organized in-person protest at the ballpark would probably be appropriate.

I'd take a chance on Mazara, obviously assuming the cost is nothing significant. The guy is very young.

I think the "he might help win a close game in April that could affect a tight playoff race down the line" actually minimizes the impact of a delayed call-up. IMO the bigger loss of not calling a guy up until late April is the delayed major league adjustment period. In the big picture, I think that would cost a team more wins and hurt their playoff chances more than anything specific to Ws and Ls in the first two weeks. Rookie Player X with two months and two weeks of experience >> Rookie Player X making his ML debut in win-now mode

This would be interesting.

The Sox know they have to do something significant this offseason, and I think they will. They won't be left holding the bag like last year. That said, there's no chance they end up with Cole.

For me, this is /thread. Perfectly put.

I come at this from a bit of a different angle than many of you, in that I don't demand as many HRs out of prospects, so I don't have that obsession with power. I find it too reductive to pin such a majority of a player like Madrigal's value purely on power production. This isn't HR derby, or a WAR contest or fantasy baseball. The idea is to build a good, balanced, winning major league team. He's going to be in a lineup with Eloy, Vaughn and Robert — three guys with monster power, TA — a guy with good power for his position, and possibly Collins or Burger — two guys with massive power if they make it. The White Sox will not lack for HRs to the point they desperately need their 2B to hit a lot of them. How many HRs Nick Madrigal hits is just not that important to me to how he will provide value to the White Sox. JMO.

1. Robert 2. Kopech 3. Cease 4. Madrigal 5. Vaughn 6. Dunning 7. Basabe 8. Rutherford 9. Sheets 10. Walker I understand the lack of enthusiasm over Rutherford and Sheets, but I think some of the concerns are a little overblown. For comparison's sake, Walker is a full year older than Rutherford and has been playing a level or two lower all year. (Also, I don't dock guys for lack of HR power as much as other people do.)

Probably not worthy of a new thread, but what do you guys think of Wil Myers as a buy-low guy? He's owed a bunch of money, isn't having a great year (I think he's been benched lately) and the Padres already have too many OFs as it is. You could probably get him just as a salary dump. Is his track record good enough to give him RF for a while here and see if he flourishes again?

I think we're all working overtime mentally to wishcast some formulation of Collins that is better than he actually is. A three-true-outcomes 1B (or pretty bad defensive catcher for a team that couldn't stand Narvaez) is barely above next year's crop of DFAs. I'm hoping for the best, like @bmags said, maybe a Joc Pederson type offensive peak if all goes right, but I don't think he'll be a "borderline star."

I feel good about Vaughn, but can someone reassure me again that he is significantly better than Pavin Smith? What differentiates the two? Smith was a top 10 pick, college 1B, good contact/power combo with a low strikeout rate, but he's been really underwhelming so far in the DBacks' system.

I know it is cynical of me, but part of the solace I would take if the Sox drafted Abrams is that his prospect value could be leveraged in a trade next year, or even this winter, for an established MLB player Kelenic-style. The Sox don't have many high upside guys like that, so it would be nice to have that as an option. And it could be accomplished before his actual minor league performance becomes a factor one way or the other.

Not sure. Obviously, if the cost is even remotely high, it's an easy pass. I'd try to start with one of Basabe/Gonzalez/Walker, then add a second piece (maybe Flores or Pilkington?)

This thought has actually crossed my mind before. In a vacuum, it's a so-so move. But when you consider the realistic options available, it's really not that bad.

They also have Nick WIlliams and Roman Quinn too. I think it's fair to think Odubel could be available. NBC Sports Philly was speculating about it yesterday.

In historically embarrassing, incompetent and cheap fashion, the Sox lost out on Manny Machado. This thread is not about him. Let's keep all the murderous rage and legitimate anger out of this thread, and just focus on any possible remaining moves now that that situation is resolved. The Sox seem to be set with an infield of Moncada (3B), TA (SS), Yolmer (2B) and Abreu/Alonso (1B/DH), and honestly, at this point I am fine with that. Alonso is obviously one of the worst possible acquisitions value-wise, but it is what it is now. The OF on the other hand, is a dumpster fire (and would have been with or without Machado). Would anyone here be interested in Odubel Herrera from the Phillies? He's about to get forced out when they (eventually) sign Bryce Harper. He's 27, bats left, can play CF or RF, and while he hasn't been outstanding the last two years, he was darn impressive in 2016 and still could tap into that upside, especially with a change of scenery and an everyday job. Compared to, say, Mitch Haniger, who would cost a Dylan Cease or something, Herrera would come relatively cheap, and still has several years on his contract left. What do you guys think? I'd say Herrera is my guy right now. Anyone else worth considering? Joc? JBJ? Pony up for Haniger or Starling Marte?

I really like this idea. Probably a little light though — throw in Carson Fulmer and an org-type guy.

I don't mind selling high on Narvaez, but for two years of a relief pitcher? Doesn't seem like the best use of his value. I guess Colome will get flipped for different prospects sown the line anyway.

Yeah, there is just about literally no way a 10-year contract could work out for the Sox. If Harper/Machado bypass their opt outs, that means they are underperforming and overpaid. Best case scenario is they set the world on fire for the Sox, opt out and then become some other team's problem if their performance falls off into their 30s.

The club option makes this interesting. Ultimately though, I don't think Avi would do that. He could just take a one-year contract and hit FA after 2019. The club option hurts him without any real upside for him.

Yeah, right now, this is the Sox' clearest path to getting a big fish.

Not necessarily. The Phillies will almost certainly get one of Harper or Machado. If they choose Harper, the Sox are left to outbid the Yankees for Machado, which won't happen. But... if the Phillies opt for Machado, the Sox path for Harper would be a little clearer since the Yankees aren't interested. So anything the Sox can do to nudge the Phillies specifically toward Machado could pay off for them in the long run. That said, trading for Santana could open 1B for Hoskins, which opens an OF spot for Harper. So that could be bad. But trading for Franco to open an infield spot could help the cause.

No, in this model, the worst-case scenario is not signing Harper altogether because you wouldn't relent on the opt-out at year three. So instead he signs elsewhere, that team enjoys success in 2020 related to Harper, then he uses his opt-out leverage to get a raise for the remaining years on his contract without hitting the open market. The Sox, meanwhile, save $40 mil/year for three years but have nothing really to show for it.

Creative trades you say? Angels get: Luis Robert, Nick Madrigal, Dylan Cease, Dane Dunning Sox get: Mike Trout That's four top-100 prospects for two years of Trout. Who says no?

That's just not realistic. Harper is getting an opt out no later than year four. If the Sox want a leg up on the rest of the bidders, they should should front load the contract and acquiesce to the opt out after year three. Sure, it's a serious risk that they lose him after three years, but at least they'd have the leg up on renegotiating with him in that scenario (like ARod with the Yankees, Upton with the Angels, Kershaw last week with the Dodgers, etc.) The greater risk is not signing him altogether. It's better to have Bryce'd and lost than never Bryce'd at all!