Look at Ray Ray Run

Last year was their first trip since 2013. Which is my point; the Rays have very small windows given their division and the talent within it. The Rays have so many assets that they could literally trade 5 of them to get star MLB talents and still have a deep and talented farm. This is what the Rays should be doing; it's not though. This year they have a real chance to be GREAT, but they traded away a very good MLB outfielder to get another prospect. It's maddening, and it is certainly not a commitment to winning it all and Sox fans are envious of them while ridiculing the organization for not giving Stras 250 million.

Thanks for this. I find it odd that this is from 2015; the data surrounding framing has changed so much even since then. I wonder how big their sample was to draw that conclusion; I think most catchers in general drop off around 32 so maybe those things are just correlated.

How has it worked out well? How many titles do the Rays have? It's funny to read what Rays fans think of the way the team operates and what White Sox fans think. I always find it humorous how envious Sox fans are of the way the Rays do business. I posted this earlier today, but the Rays just traded Pham to get another MIF prospect; they already have 3 elite ones. This is where someone could counter and say, yeah but they can trade these assets to go all-in when the time comes. Well, the time has come - the Red Sox stink, and the rest of the division besides the Yankees is blah. What did the Rays do? Accumulated more prospects and didn't help the MLB roster. The Rays never go for it; ever. At some point, you need to trade your assets to try and win. Say what you want about Beane, but he maintains a competitive window while constantly trading for all-in pieces (Ces, Lester etc etc) even if it hasn't worked out for him. The Rays are really smart, but they're maddening to follow. They never actually take the final step for contending, and they continue to stockpile pieces without ever trading them for elite MLB talent.

I'd be shocked. This is the Rays best window to compete in the last decade. They have the pieces to do it too. If the Rays can't hang onto a pitcher like Snell at his cost (after signing him to a great extension) while trying to compete then they should just contract that team. At some point, the Rays need to try and actually win it all with all these assets they've accumulated.

Framing stats are like 7 years old; how do you have aging trends from a stat that hasn't been around long enough to even evaluate aging? Not saying it doesn't exist, I just have not seen it. Just because Strasburg is good it doesn't mean giving him 7/245 is smart; that's the issue here. At some point you have to have a ceiling on negotiations, regardless of how much you want a player. I'm not saying they shouldn't overspend the market anywhere - they were willing to with Wheeler for example - but you can't just expect them to overspend the market on every target because some guys may have higher valuations with one team than they do across the rest of the league; this very easily could be the scenario with Stras and his ties in Washington. Am I mad that the Sox didn't offer Stras some absurd 7/260 contract? Of course not, that would be a horrible signing for an organization in which salaries matter - regardless of what Sox fans want to think. That's far too much risk attached to a guy who has never had a 6 WAR season. Now would I give Cole 7/280? Sure. Absolutely. I think he's much less risky and about as sure of a thing as you can find in the modern game.

Yeah, I'm not sure why people think Snell would net less than Sale. Snell has more control than Sale had, and while Sale had been better more consistently, and he's nearly as good in terms of ceiling and level of performance. Snell would cost a boat load; it would cost a Vaughn/Madrigal/Stiever type package. Moncada was the #1 prospect in baseball and Kopech was the #2 arm prospect.

There are nearly twice as many position players with WAR's > 5 the last decade as pitchers. A position player has held the WAR crown like 20 years in a row. Position players are more valuable than pitchers. Elite pitchers are certainly more rare - at least consistent ones.

7 years 245 million is a lot of money no matter how you look at it. If you think the Sox payroll is going to be 160ish million, that's 21% of their payroll allocated to an arm with a lot of red flags. If you're going to play at the top of the market, you should be paying Cole whatever he wants; not Stras. That's just my opinion.

I'm not sure why you're being critical of another reporter posting information that might not have been accurate.

Except every other team in baseball thought he was worth less than 118 million.

Again, you can't ask the organization to be intelligent and responsible and then ask them to throw 260 million dollars at a guy who is worth about 180 million. They either become a good and smart organization in all facets or they don't. Sox fans are really bipolar. I want them to make intelligent and savvy decisions, supplement their core with effective and talented players, and I don't want them to just spend money and not care about the expected value in return solely to show people they're going to spend. That's how you destroy the future of the team. You don't build up the core for 4 years of complete misery, only to throw all the value you get from your young controllable assets at a SP who has an injury history that would make any doctor cringe. If you want to sign Stras for 7 years 260 just to say the Sox did, go right ahead. It doesn't prove anything. Only winning does.

Cool. Sorry my opinion on the Phillies has had such an impact on your life.

Did you want the Sox to sign Stras for 7 years 260+ million? I certainly didn't want them to do that.

I think people wanting to blame the White Sox for not signing Stras can move on now. The Sox would be complete idiots to sign him for that deal.

Doesn't matter if it's front loaded or not, honestly. The way baseball does the cap distribution, front loading doesn't really help much down the road. I imagine, if anything, the Nats put a 10 year deferral in place at about 5 million per. Maybe less, but I would guess that's the only thing creative they do here.

Deferrals are really important here. If 50 million of this is deferred, it's more like a 7 year, 220 million dollar present day offer.

What does this mean for Cole is the real question? Cole is at least 25% better than Stras over the next 7 years. He should be getting north of 300 million now. Yankees felt all good about their "all-in" Cole offer of 7 years 245 million jajaja

Very good comp, although Felix was at least a bill of great health. Stras may be a better pitcher with lesser stuff, but that stuff is going to fall and it's going to fall quickly.

1. A guy who has had 2 seasons of 200 IP in 8 years. 2. A guy coming off the most substantial work load increase in baseball last year by a wide margin. 3. A guy with chronic injury issues. The only thing I'll say positive about Strasburg aging is that he has shown an ability to pitch without his peak stuff which does matter. That said, this contract will be an absolute abortion in 3 years.

7 years, 245 million. LOL what a disaster of a contract. I'm sure there's a lot of deferred money in there as the Nats love deferred money, but that is still absolutely absurd.

this is the least shocking news of the off-season. I think Stras was -500 to go back to WASH.

No, I think people think the Sox are in on players because they've been incredibly aggressive. I'm not sure how Sox fans can continue to say the Sox are all bluster and no action this off-season. They signed Grandal before any other major signing was made at a very fair valuation. Then they turned around and offered 125 million to Wheeler which was 7 more than anyone else in the league. Baseball thinks the Sox are going to be aggressive, because they have been aggressive and they have told everyone who will listen that they're ready to compete and contend and they're going to spend the money to prove it. I don't know how people can look at this off-season so far, and say "same old White Sox."

I get it, and one of the things that may be the Sox biggest piece of supporting evidence is how much they are spending this off-season. They can likely claim that they were clearly trying to win, and thought this was the best decisions for the organization (keeping him down). I also agree that having a case is different than winning; if Bryant loses his case, none of this matters and it's a moot problem. If Bryant wins though? This opens up a big can of worms.

Dick also said that Hector was way off on the Eloy extension, that's just not true: Héctor Gómez@hgomez27 BREAKING NEWS: The White Sox are close to an agreement with Eloy Jimenez for an 8-year extension that would pay him between 65-70 US$ Million. With Incentives the contract could get to the 75-80 million Range. Source says deal is pending only a Physical.@z101digital @ZDeportes Hector said the deal could reach 100 million; but it ended up closing at 80ish million peak value.

They've been linked to almost everyone at this point; whether real or not, who knows, but they've been rumored as involved with anyone who has a pulse. Also, that's not really a bad thing anyway. They weren't linked to Grandal and boom.