Vulture

I was thinking we’ll finally see what a 34 year old Hoyt would’ve looked like if he hadn’t tanked out on coke

No I get it. Bref says they use drs to calculate dwar. You claim they don’t. Seems reasonable to conclude you are correct because you said so

Yeah but you’d have to be a fool to think a small vocal minority is representative of the whole. If I believed that I’d have no hope for humanity left.

Ok I guess brefs current explanation that drs includes pitch framing and that dwar is derived from drs since 2003 is incorrect and you are right

It plainly says framing is included in drs and that dwar is based on drs and drs alone. If A contains B and B contains C then A contains C.

Well that completely contradicts the explanation on bref’s actual site that I pasted there

Seriously? With our 2012 update, we have switched to using Baseball Info Solutions Defensive Runs Saved for seasons since its introduction in 2003, and TZR for previous seasons. Fielding Runs: Defensive Runs Saved Defensive Runs Saved (DRS) is the most sophisticated public system available. It includes 8 factors: Fielding Range Plus/Minus Runs Saved based on BIS-trained scorer observations and batted ball timing to determine the velocity of each batted ball. Outfield arm runs saved based on exact counts of baserunner advancements and kills and the velocity of the hit ball. Infielder double plays based on opportunities and rates they were turned based also on batted ball velocity. Good play-bad play values which include 28 positive play types. For example: HR-saving catches, backing up a play, blocking a pitch in the dirt, and 54 misplays like missing the cutoff man, failing to anticipate the wall and allowing extra bases, not covering a base, pulling a foot off the bag, etc... Bunt Fielding Catcher SB/CS data (which is tweaked by the pitchers caught) Pitcher SB/CS data (which is tweaked by the catchers behind the plate) Catcher handling of the pitching staff via things like pitch framing and pitch calling Defensive Wins Above Replacement for position players A defensive measure of wins above replacement, but given only the defensive stats of the player and his position adjustment. For this calculation, we use a replacement level on defense is the league average. Based on Baseball Info Solutions defensive runs saved from 2003 on Bref dwar IS completely based on drs as above clearly states

People in the know say multiple teams will show interest in Hendriks and he will sign with one of them. I pass this along not to bolster my name when proved true, but because of the pleasure it gives to those following hot stove rumors of their favorite teams and players

You don’t even have to go that far. If they have him behind Kopech Cease Crochet and Steiver in long term outlook, it’s a good move.

Correlation doesn’t equate to causation. He made his speech at same time TA returned to lineup. If I were to speculate on which had the greater impact I’d go with TA

I was thinking 160 ramping up to 170-175 in a few years might be the range but who knows. doesn’t seem like they’ve been allocating funds willynilly to me though. Guess we’ll just have to see

Just to be clear my original statement everyone is arguing against was “if Rick hahn were slick he’d resign McCann and trade Grandal.” Shooting down the idea McCann has been comparable or better to grandal the last two years skirts the actual argument that the Sox would be better with that move. McCann could be measurably worse and that move still be favorable for the Sox.

Interesting thanks

That’s not 160 million committed in ‘22. That figure includes 36 million op is speculating will be used to cover holes. “W/ signings” The amount committed according to op including arb projections is 132. And that includes picking up eatons option. Take that off it’s about 124. Also includes Lopez who can be no tendered...brings baseline to about 120.

I don’t see the twits in question though. Any chance an actual quote could be provided?

Yeah but is the objector or the object the divisive one?

According to ray ray (and bref) bref uses drs to account for framing. But ray claims since bref uses drs in war calculation it’s not accounted for in dwar. Since war is not dwar. Despite the fact dwar’s calculation is based entirely on drs compared to expected league average. I don’t know you decide

That’s not what the chart shows. the chart asks does war use measure for framing. the answer for bref is yes via drs which is used in the calculation. You provided the data not me if it is irrelevant to dwar, then why’d you post it?If it was out of date and not reflecting fangraphs subsequent change that just means you provided out of date info. so your claim is that a graph that shows drs is used to account for framing in war means framing is not accounted for in dwar, when dwar is calculated by comparing drs to expected league average drs. That’s nonsensical. If drs accounts for framing in one equation it accounts for it in the other.

Look at heading on graph “fangraphs war” go to row “uses measures for catcher framing and blocking” go to entry under “fangraphs war” and see “no on framing’” good god man it isn’t that difficult. Now look at heading under “b ref 2.2 war” and see “yes”

No it says drs is used to account for framing in bref’s war calculation. Clearly

I’m not the one who provided it to support my argument. I just read it and can clearly see it states war calculation “measures catchers blocking and framing ‘ under fangraphs ‘no on framing’

Its not my fault you can’t read a graph that you yourself provided

Not according to the graph that look at ray linked to. It clearly states that fangraphs war calculations do not include measures for framing

I’m quoting the graph you linked that clearly states fangraphs war calculation does not take framing into account and bref does via its inclusion of drs in its war equation. where it says “uses measures...” that is referring to war calculations

I don’t disagree. three or more seasons ago grandal was the better catcher