greg775

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jun 17, 2013 -> 08:19 PM) Man, how soon we forget Mark Kotsay and his 85% groundout-to-2B rate. Kotsay was horrible, as well. Sox have had a lot of bad baseball players. I personally feel Dunn is one of my least favorite ever. I agree with whoemever posted that the Sox better get somebody good for Crain and guys they deal, because that's when season tix do not get renewed. When the Sox dump good salaried players for nothing in return. There's no reason to trade Crain for some hack who will never make the big leagues. Ditto Rios. Get something for them, not just Lillibridge/Keppinger types of stiffs.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jun 17, 2013 -> 06:40 PM) The idea is that nobody is going to give you anything for Dunn. Given the other moves we're going to make, plus the imminent losses of PK, Floyd, Thornton, Crain to free agency, we really don't even stand to gain much by saving the money if someone DID take him for nothing. In this case, you keep him in your lineup. Home runs are fun and bring fans to the ballpark and if you're not contending NEXT year and he's still looking like a 40 HR hitter, someone probably will give you something significant for him because he won't cost so much $ in the final year of his contract. In the worst case, you're paying him money that we were unlikely to spend anyway so us as fans aren't hurt by it anyway. Home runs are fun, definitely, but I think Dunn is almost an exception to that rule. He's been so lousy that just seeing him stride to the plate is buzzkill. Am I in the minority on this? I just think Dunn is about the worst player in White Sox history and I hate seeing him walk to the plate. If there are any Dunn fans out there, I stand corrected.

QUOTE (onedude @ Jun 17, 2013 -> 06:33 PM) With the exception of the game my little bro got tickets to next weekend, I'm not interested in watching this team at all. I have the same mentality. It wouldn't be so bad if we expected a horrible year...but there was so much to be optimistic about in spring training. I have to admit I also hate watching them. I've been a Sox fan forever and I know bad baseball is better than no baseball, but I pretty much can't take our anemic offense. I guess it's because it has been the same for so long. The difference is this year we can't even hit enough home runs to win home games. I have no desire to turn on my mlb.com and watch the Sox fail to hit and lose so many close games. It all started with that Cub series. The team just sucked so badly. It's hard to watch.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Jun 17, 2013 -> 01:51 PM) Greg, who's having the better year: Paul Konerko or Adam Dunn? Just wondering..... I dunno. Even tho Dunn has 18 bombs, I personally think he's been lousy. Paulie is finished, I think everybody agrees with that. But I would not "stick it out" with Dunn.

QUOTE (Jake @ Jun 16, 2013 -> 07:41 PM) My plan as Hahn is to get this team back on its feet again ASAP. No extended rebuilds. We'll assume that not much is different around mid-July, which is when we'll be dealing. Step 1. Crain: He's a must-trade. I think you could really steal from someone who wants Crain, but even if you don't love your offers, you have to pull the trigger on something. Step 2. Peavy: Try to see the market. You should be able to get a lot for him, and this is a case where I'd be willing to wait until the offseason to move him if he needs to prove he is healthy or whatever else. He is the most replaceable star we have, in that our pitching depth is pretty damn good and we have a good track record of developing starting arms. Step 3. Rios: Similar story to Peavy, but even in the offseason I would demand a king's ransom. He could be on this team until 2015 if we want him at about market value and if you want to rebuild quickly, this is an option. However, if you can pry away a Mike Olt type of player then you do that and be okay with the fact you will lose production in the short term. No A-ball prospects of any pedigree for Rios. Rios can still be a part of your next winner and you make the point clear to trading partners. You can always trade him next year, because again he is not blocking any prospects. Step 4. De Aza. See about his value. He's a good player in a premium position and you might be able to get something nice for him. We just have to accept that we don't have a good way to replace him and if you want to compete in the near term you will probably have to buy a centerfielder. Again, I wouldn't be forcing the issue to trade him but if you can get a good player at any level I would probably go ahead and do it. Step 5. Alexei. This is a tough one. He isn't the same player he once was and his contract is long but not fabulously expensive. With that said, a team in need of an SS will probably pay something nice for him. In this case, you're making Gordon your short term SS. Kep is your 2B and you hope Carlos Sanchez pans out in the next 12-18 months. If you go into the offseason and want to add parts to make a competitive team, you may end up frustrated that you don't have a half-ass decent SS. Part of the deal, though. Offseason plans: you give PK the finish to what is likely to be a "meh" season, pat him on the ass, let him walk. He probably retires, I would guess. You stick it out with Dunn. You're not going to get anything for him and after dumping some mixture of Peavy/Rios/Crain/PK/Floyd, you really don't even need to save more money. Dunn may very well hit 40 bombs again and is just the type of guy that can add a little excitement to a team that may be in a transition year. In the final year of his contract, if he still looks like a 40 bomb guy, he may actually become quite valuable in trade. He isn't blocking any prospects at this point, either. Bring in one major FA piece. You have some choices and you'll try to get one that the market doesn't overvalue. My primary target would probably be Kendry Morales to give you a middle-of-the-order bat for the next 3-4 years, but it is important not to overpay. Brian McCann, Jacoby Ellsbury, Curtis Granderson, Nate McLouth, James Loney, and several others will be worth looking at as well. You don't have to get a top-top guy, but bring in a veteran that can fathomably be on your next playoff team. If you get good value, get another one. It's fine to accidentally win. Tyler Flowers will either be good enough to be your starting C or you hand the keys to Phegley. Tank gets another year, but his position is negotiable depending on your other moves. No need to look at adding pitchers. You can bring in a Matt Lindstrom-type, because again sucking isn't fun so it isn't a problem to spend a million or two on a guy that will keep you from losing some games. In the very worst case, these guys get valuable at the deadline. You should be in a position where a couple things can go right and you win and at worst you should be another productive offseason away from winning. Jake, why in the hell should you stick it out with Dunn? I'd trade him so fast if anybody would take him. I'd get Tank out of here with his .267 OBP. Sick of guys who swing at everything, thus are easy outs.

Boy does our team stink. I think we're all ready to turn over the everday lineup. I'd be OK with getting rid of every hitter in the starting lineup bar none (I've never been a big Rios guy and I have to admit Paulie's finished). From my vantage point, Hahn has to keep all our pitchers (except for Thornton of course) while completely rebuilding our lineup/defense. How's he gonna do that? I dunno. But I wouldn't trade every good pitcher we've got or it could be a 20-year rebuild.

QUOTE (Brian @ Jun 15, 2013 -> 02:19 AM) I wouldn't call fans in Chicago who hope the Blackhawks win it all "bandwagon" fans. It's not like someone who lives in California their whole life and likes the Yankees. I admittedly am a fair weather fan, if that's the same thing. I'm a fair weather Hawks fan, too. But I grew up a diehard with season tickets for many years. QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 16, 2013 -> 01:03 AM) The only bad thing about that period is for as much as they dominated Boston, they are only up one. That has to give Boston something to fall back on. I thought we were in big trouble when it was 1-1 because the Hawks coulda/shoulda been up BIG. I was amazed at all the opportunities Boston had in the second half of the third and the OT. If we play like that and they play like that in Boston, we're gonna get blown out of at least one of the next 2 games.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jun 16, 2013 -> 03:04 AM) Astros and Cubs are playing better baseball than the Sox. Mets are going to be calling up Wheeler soon, but their offense is abysmal. When it's all said and done, I fully expect Marlins to get 1st pick and Astros 2nd. One "advantage" the Sox have to racking up the losses is the tough schedule they have the rest of the way. I think we finish with the second worst record behind the Marlins. I guess we could finish with the third worst.

I voted 'No,' but I do not blame him for putting together this godawful baseball team.

QUOTE (IowanSoxFan @ Jun 14, 2013 -> 09:30 PM) Lol. True story, I have a friend (Cubs fan) who honestly believes that National League teams are better because of the past three All-Star games. They also keep beating us in the World Series. We can claim superiority all we want as they win all the hardware.

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Jun 14, 2013 -> 09:27 PM) Per MLB Trade Rumors: •The White Sox have acquired outfielder Carl Thomore from the Rockies in exchange for cash, according to Baseball America's Matt Eddy (on Twitter). Thomore was a second-round pick by the Rox as recently as 2011, but he's hit just .196/.308/.309 in 58 games in the Rookie-level Pioneer League. Thomore has recovered from a devastating leg injury suffered in high school (as chronicled by Brian Falzarano of MaxPreps.com two years ago) to make it to pro ball. Does he go on the 40 man roster? Or is this minor league move? Good. Keep picking up players cause it's rebuilding (reloading) time.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jun 15, 2013 -> 03:14 AM) This team looked like they were obsessed with the short porch in LF tonight. But yes, I agree they're content in losing. I don't know about that. Our team looked content in losing a lot last season despite finishing way over .500. And it looked dead during some of Oz's winning seasons. I think when you can't hit, simply cannot hit the ball for s***, and are horrible defensively, you look flat. Of course you could counter this by saying they are content to not hit and not concentrate in the field. If our guys played like this last year, Robin would be catching some flak probably. I think because of the success last year, most people blame the lazy millionaire players and young ones like Viciedo who swing at everything.

I doubt there's anybody but ElRockin and maybe Dick Allen that isn't convinced this team is going nowhere. I won't be fooled again if the team gets hot for a week. This team has some good pitchers to go with one of the worst everyday lineups in baseball. Sox might have survived if they caught the ball this year as they did last year. But you combine the worst offense in baseball (or one of the worst) with the worst defense (or one of the worst) and you get a last place team in the AL Central (unless we beat out the Tribe). Start wheeling and dealing, Mr. Hahn. Get those trades brewing and please put this team in position to win next year following the acquisition of some GOOD free agents to go with the trades you make.

Considering how badly the Sox have played this year and the fact Peavy is hurt, Paulie appears done, Viciedo has not yet come of age, Flowers is about as bad as it gets, Dunn is Dunn, Lexi is complacent, lazy or something making him a buffoon, our corner infielders have no pop in the bat, DeAza is a defensive nightmare and the relief pitching is blah except for Crain and our closer ... Do you guys fully expect the Sox to reside in last place the rest of the season? Another ? If the Sox looked this bad last year, would Robin have been back this year? As good a job as he received credit for last year, he's been that bad this year. My answer to my questions ... I do think we'll finish ahead of Cleveland. I doubt Robin would have tried year two if we played this badly last year.

From Wikipedia. .... On December 4, 2008, Tyler Flowers and fellow Braves prospects Brent Lillibridge, Jonathan Gilmore and Santos Rodriguez were traded to the Chicago White Sox for Javier Vázquez and Boone Logan.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyler_Flowers#cite_note-2 Well, Tyler is lousy; Lilly is (was) lousy. What's upwith Gilmore and Santos Rodriguez? This was one, nondescript trade. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyler_Flowers#cite_note-2

I've seen some bad baseball games. I think one year the Sox got shut out in both ends of a doubleheader. That'd go down as the worst day of baseball ever. Does anybody know if that is true? Or maybe it was 4-1, 4-0 or something. I didn't like today's game cause I tuned in in time for the Bautista homer and the awful baseball after that.

Wasn't Flowers a 33rd round draft pick? Seems about right. He seems like a career backup if he's lucky/pinch hitter type (praying he might get lucky, make contact and elevate). Certainly he's shown the Sox front office nothing to make them want to start him again next season.

QUOTE (Flash Tizzle @ Jun 12, 2013 -> 03:50 AM) Also, it was a pleasure watching another stellar minor league product in Troncoso throw junk up there. Boy, he looked horrible. From the way he started out of the stretch to his delivery of the ball, to the meat that laid over the plate ... fail.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jun 12, 2013 -> 03:41 AM) Greg, they'd already used him earlier. He almost blew the game himself, but miraculously got out of it...and preserved the lead. Oh, I never even thought of that. I didn't check the box score. I started watching pretty late.

QUOTE (bbilek1 @ Jun 12, 2013 -> 03:34 AM) The first pitch of this game that I watched was the 1-2 to Jose Bautista. Same with me. I'm at work and that's when I clicked my mlb.com to start watching.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jun 12, 2013 -> 03:30 AM) They've used Crain and Lindstrom a lot of late because this team doesn't understand the meaning of building on a lead. QUOTE (Jake @ Jun 12, 2013 -> 03:32 AM) Those were all the pitchers we had. It was him or Deunte Heath left. We've played only close games lately, everybody was/is burned. Fair enough, but I'd have rather seen, gulp, Mr. Light-Me-Up himself, Matt Thornton over a guy I've never heard of.

No offense to Robin, but it seems to me even with the defensive miscues, we decided to give them this game by putting in that new pitcher I've never heard of in the 10th inning. Why just give ANOTHER game away?? Ridiculous. It's almost like this game was fixed.

I think it's safe to say the Sox are playing like the last-place team they are.

The odds of the Sox winning this game seem very small right now.

Get Ramon out of there. Please give us a chance to win at least, Coop.