Chisoxfn

QUOTE(danman31 @ Jan 2, 2008 -> 11:52 PM) I don't know, Michigan, Penn State, Illinois, and Northwestern also suck this year. Iowa is horrid. I wouldn't be stunned if they were dead last.

QUOTE(IowaSoxFan @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 12:33 PM) Isnt that the KF philosophy every year? Broadway, McCullough, Poreda...? They like the college guys because they have no leverage in negoitiations, it is either sign or play independent ball for a percentage of the money. Fields and Borchard being the exceptions to that rule, but their leverage was another sport, not going back into the draft. The major difference is at #8 you are also talking about a guy that projects as a potential #1.

QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 12:21 PM) Well, this is the kind of move that allows a team to reach the postseason iff absolutely everything goes right. The rotation itself is a question mark right now, but I see Contreras as a huge wild card right now. If he pitches well, the team could be in for a surprise season; if not, the Sox are screwed. If Jose is 100% you are right, the Sox may very well be able to make a lot of noise. I highly doubt he is, but it is a possibility.

QUOTE(Allsox @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 12:20 PM) From what I'm hearing, the Sox may put Swisher in CF (A position he's never played consistently and played there last yr only because the other guy was hurt so let's put him out there! Woo-Hoo!) and they may lead him off (A spot he hasn't hit in). I just don't get it. Yes, he had a great OBP but he's best at the #2 or #6 slot cuz of his ability to put the ball into play and drive in runs. If they don't trade Crede (Which the Sox would get 50 cents on the dollar for with his back) and slot Fields in LF, we're looking at the slowest OF in all of baseball in '08 for a pitching staff that has only 2 guys that consistently strike out guys (Jenks, Vazquez). That's not good. Throwing this out there, but the Sox could realistically deal Konerko and not get a first baseman back (with Fields playing 1st and Crede playing 3B). It may not be perfect but with Swisher here you could afford doing that. Plus if you are able to get a legit 2nd baseman and leadoff hitter in the deal as well a darn good pitcher I'd be all for the move. Would the Angels move Howie Kendrick and a starting pitching prospect for Konerko (I know the Sox have Richar, but Kendrick is ridiculously good). I'm not necessarily saying that is all the Sox get, but you could get the 2nd baseman for the future (and a guy who is projected to win a batting title sometime in his career) and present plus someone for your rotation. Say you get Adenhart, Kendrick, and Juan Rivera (I throw this name out there so the Sox have an option in case no one plays center, plus the Angels shed one of there outfield spots....if people would prefer Willits, that is fine). I know that is a lot of talent from the Angels perspective and they have added bats like Hunter but it is still a move they could easily afford. Again, people may jump on it because the Sox have Richar, but good lord, if you could get Kendrick...umm yeah.

QUOTE(Vance Law @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 12:18 PM) He is the #8 pick in June. I'm thinking the Sox will take the best collegiate pitcher available with the #8 pick. I'm going to hope the San Diego pitcher falls to them.

QUOTE(Vance Law @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 12:18 PM) He is the #8 pick in June. I'm thinking the Sox will take the best collegiate pitcher available with the #8 pick.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 12:17 PM) I don't see what changes from 2008 to 2009. Will anyone from the farm be coming up that will make us a contender? We basically know what we're going to be getting from Swisher -- we're going to get a player in his prime, an .850-.900 OPS player who's certainly going to be very valuable. But I don't see how this move affects 2009 anymore than it affects 2008. Even if the Sox made a ton of deadline-day moves in place for 2009, the players the Sox would be getting back would be prospects, not guys who would be ready for 'big-time' in 2009. Teams aren't going to be trading the Sox 24 year-old players who have already shown they can 'stick-it' in the big leagues for the Paul Konerko's, Jermaine Dye's and Jim Thome's of our roster. By the way, I agree a lot with your last sentence that it may not make us contenders. However, Kenny can obviously use some of those chips as well as the financial flexibility to maybe do some other things. It certainly isn't ideal, but I can think that there is at least a chance that Kenny is thinking this way (although I'm sure he's still exploring ways to upgrade the 08 club, but it does seem evident that any move he makes isn't going to be just to help the squad this year).

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 12:17 PM) I don't see what changes from 2008 to 2009. Will anyone from the farm be coming up that will make us a contender? We basically know what we're going to be getting from Swisher -- we're going to get a player in his prime, an .850-.900 OPS player who's certainly going to be very valuable. But I don't see how this move affects 2009 anymore than it affects 2008. Even if the Sox made a ton of deadline-day moves in place for 2009, the players the Sox would be getting back would be prospects, not guys who would be ready for 'big-time' in 2009. Teams aren't going to be trading the Sox 24 year-old players who have already shown they can 'stick-it' in the big leagues for the Paul Konerko's, Jermaine Dye's and Jim Thome's of our roster. I'm saying Kenny can now say he's going for things, while quietly he's preparing for 09. He knows this off-season didn't go as planned and now he has begun planning for 09 (hence the Alexi signing, Quentin trade and to an extent the Swisher deal as this is a move that gives the Sox a legit middle of the order in a couple years...ie Swisher/Fields/Quentin and hopefully another bat). Kenny can now, if things go awful, swing deals for Dye/Konerko in the off-season for pieces that he truly likes and again have a s***load of money to throw around come the off-season. Basically put he can hand pick a few more guys for his squad which will give him another shot at going for things in 09. I'm not saying it is ideal but it is a legitimate possibility. Now you could say, why not do it now and I also understand JD has his no trade clause (but if the Sox came to him I think he'd end up accepting a deal), but Kenny is still going to give things a shot. Hell, I wouldn't be stunned if Kenny used some cash on a couple one year contracts to guys like Colon/Garcia (maybe throw out some incentives and option years if things go okay).

QUOTE(Controlled Chaos @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 12:15 PM) I cheked out the A's boards and none of them are thrilled with this deal and all have great things to say about Swish. Assuming he starts the year with the Sox, there is a good chance I will invest in a Swisher jersey. I f***ing love the way this guy plays the game and he has a boatload of pure ability.

QUOTE(yoyozuna @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 12:13 PM) Just an FYI, I called my buddy in SF (He's a die hard A's fan). He didn't hear about the deal yet. I told him and he was pissssssssssed. He loves Swisher and says that they better have gotten some "studs" in return. I chuckled and told him they were! lol I always think its good to get another teams perspective. Like when we traded Jon G. and there were some UPSET fans but not as upset as the fans in LAA. People are still livid out here about the OC deal from the Angels perspective.

QUOTE(bmags @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 12:00 PM) But if floyd/danks fail, i don't think that it would've been Gio and DLS that we would've gone to this year anyway. I can flat out tell you that Kenny is a major Egbert backer. Aside from Heads there may not be many more that like Egbert as much as Kenny has. Kenny has also been very under the radar about that.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 11:51 AM) I'll ask again but does anyone know how good of a cf Swish is? I honestly don't recall see him playing center, so I'm very curious. He has a strong arm and when he was coming up was 5 tool but with Kotsay in CF the A's shied away from using him in Cf when he first came up. I honestly couldn't tell you, but It will be probably somewhere in between Brian Anderson and Rob Mackowiak (basically he could be anywhere from one of the best to one of the worse, LOL).

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 11:47 AM) A lot? Almost no publications picked the Sox to go post-season. Now on here, I wasn't around, so I don't know. Were Soxtalkers saying the 2005 team was post-season bound? I remember a lot of us were saying that if Garland/Garcia/Contreras pitch like they were capable that this team would be stellar. It turned out that all of those things happened and the Sox kicked butt. People were really in love with the 05 off-season (I know I was). The only potential knock was the fact that value wise the Sox got there asses handed to them in the Carlos Lee trade (but the extra money helped the SOx out big time).

QUOTE(maggsmaggs @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 11:47 AM) It seems pretty clear to me that Fields is going to go for a young pitcher. I think that is the next move. You could be onto something. Than again I could also see one of the Sox vets heading for some young pitching.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 11:40 AM) That's all fine and dandy, but what Rowand is saying -- and rightfully so -- is that the wins that Swisher is adding to this team isn't taking us from being a contender to a top-of-the-AL team -- it takes us from being a mediocre team to being an average team. Look at our roster and compare it to Detroit, Cleveland, Anahiem, New York and Boston. We're still MILES behind each and every one of those clubs. And we have no farm system. I agree that we have the making of a nice, youngish core. But we need our minor league system to supplement that, and now there's nothing down there that looks like it'll be able to do that. Broadway? Give me a break. One start and now he's comparable to Gio? Shelby looks nice, but when he's your top prospect, you're in an assload of trouble. And Gio/Sweeney/DSL were going to be the answer? Sweeney is still suspect and the Sox actually got value for him (I should note, if I were an opposing GM I'd have traded for Ryan cause I think he'd be a steal in the sense that you buy low and it could really pay off in the long term). What I'm saying is the Sox are now in a better spot to contend in 09. I honestly think that quietly Kenny is turning his attention to getting as many quality guys he can for 2009 and hoping maybe things work out perfectly in 08 but if it doesn't you'll see him making tons of moves at the deadline to try to get things in place for 09. Hell have you seen me call the Sox a contender in this thread? I've only said they could maybe slug there way, hoping that the offense can carry them completely while the young pitchers develop.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 11:39 AM) Then we'd be a serious contender, too bad we probably don't even have one prospect that Baltimore would want at this point. But could Paul Konerko, Joe Crede and prospects get that deal done?

QUOTE(SnB @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 11:31 AM) 3 pretty high rated prospects for just about any player is alot. He overpaid right now, with the position the team is in, but I like this deal because it has such a high upside. Swisher could be a huge centerpiece for this team for a long time. I got to be honest, none of these guys would be top 3 prospects in a good farm system. Sweeney would have been high in any system two years ago, this year he'd probably be borderline top 5 in a good system. DSL is three years away and a ball prospects are very risky. Bottom line is the odds are greater that his value would have taken a crap within the next 3 years than he ends up panning out (This is coming from someone who loves DSL). I've always said, I got zero problem maximizing your trade value of prospects as long as you get guys who can help you long term (and Swish will be here a long time).

QUOTE(fathom @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 11:24 AM) Why would Konerko be gone? If you're going to trade 3 of your top prospects, you don't turn around and trade the cornerstone of your team. The one option is they take the approach of outslugging things. See how things go and if Floyd/Danks come along they end up being fine. If those guys don't come along, Kenny quickly can move OC/Konerko/Dye for a massive amount of guys that can help the Sox in 09. This way the Sox made a lot of moves this off-season, and can say hey, we gave it a shot, but if things go bad Kenny still has tons of opportunity to turn this into a competitive club.

QUOTE(SnB @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 11:28 AM) swisher is young and we will be able to build around him. While I think kenny overpaid a bit, they are just prospects. It's not like swisher is just a veteran on the downside of his career. I must be the only one who thinks the Sox underpaid. Whether it makes us a contender or not, I don't know, but I think the Sox could turn around a year from now and get more for Swisher than they gave up. That is the definition of a good trade to me.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 11:23 AM) For me it's simple, two years ago I would have loved this, right now, I hate it. Our franchise is still in no position to compete and now we've made it that much harder to compete in upcoming years. How, by getting a guy who is going to be a very good baseball player for the next 4 years? By getting a guy who potentially allows the Sox to have a couple good young players in the field for the next couple years. The Sox didn't have the guys to stick around and rebuild. The dumbest thing the Sox could do is sit around and let there prospects develop cause bottom line, they have s*** in the farm system for the most part. Kenny is agressive and has gotten himself a group of 4 young major league core players (Fields/Quentin/Richar/Swisher). Obviously some are more proven than others in that group, but he still has a group of Egbert/Broadway/Floyd/Danks in terms of pitching prospects and those guys will be slotted behind Buehrle/Javy who are slated to be here for a while. Plus you have Jose (whether I like it or not he's here). So the Sox had an assload of pitching prospects who are all ready to go now and keeping them in the minors for an extended period of time would have been detrimental. So Kenny probably graded them all out, decided which ones had more value (and if they had a lot more value while other prospects with less value graded out similarly in his mind) he decided it would be best to move one or two of those guys. I also think he now has the ability to make some other moves that I would love to see. I don't know if he has the balls to do it, but I think the addition of a guy like Swisher allows you to potentially swing a Konerko deal (cause Swisher could very well be the new offensive face of the franchise as he's a very loved player in Oakland and I guarantee you the city of Chicago will take to him).

QUOTE(Hatchetman @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 11:20 AM) Not that I'm against the trade, although I'm leaning that way, but it's weird to not have a single minor leaguer you know will be in the majors. I mean nobody. Shelby and Poreda are marginal prospects. I got news for you, if Shelby develops as expected he will be one of the highest impact prospects the Sox have had on the offensive side of the field since Chris Young (note that I don't say he's that explosive, but Shelby has an incredibly LIVE bat).

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 11:18 AM) Shelby or Poreda. Egbert/Broadway/Shelby/Poreda in no particular order. Gatrell may even round out the top 5.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 11:14 AM) And we're still in no position to compete for anything. I like Swisher but to give up your 3 best prospects for him with the position that our franchise is in, is just bad imo. I hate this. 3 best prospects for a guy whom you have control through 2012 (given his option). This is the exact type of move I love. Quentin/Swisher are two long term outfielders to go with Josh Fields and Danny Richar. I agree with you about maybe not being able to compete but this move really allows the Sox to potentially make another move or two and given the cost, I think this is great value for one Nick Swisher (DSL is 3 f***ing years away....so much can happen than that I have no problem selling him at a high now; Sweeney is probably the guy I will miss the most because we may be selling him low; Gio is being sold high and the one thing that sucks is that he was close to being MLB ready). This may also be indicative of the fact that Kenny thinks pretty highly of Lance Broadway and Jack Egbert. Honestly, I can't blame Kenny from moving a couple prospects. Sweeney was being replaced by Quentin so basically when you really think about it, you could make a case that it was Chris Carter/DSL/Sweeney/Gio for Quentin/Swisher. Also better yet, the Sox didn't financially f*** themselves or give up 2 draft picks like they could have with a massive signing of Hunter or Fukodome. In fact, couldn't you make a case that Fukodome at his peak would be lucky to be as productive as Swisher already has been at the major league level. I hate giving up prospects, but god damn, I'm in love with this move in the sake of the Sox getting what I consider fair value on a young stud in baseball. The only thing is, I will admit, I don't necessarily think it makes them a contender.

QUOTE(Steve9347 @ Jan 3, 2008 -> 11:12 AM) How do they not? Swisher fits in the 3-4-5 somewhere, and they have Dye-Thome-Konerko there... I think Pauly has a foot out the door now and hopefully we see him on the Angels for a good return soon. Swish could also be a stud #2 hitter. It looks to me like the Sox are taking the approach that they will outslug the rest of baseball or try to while they try to put together some semblance of a back of the rotation, which will hopefully allow the young pitchers like Floyd/Danks to develop.

Below is the official press release. This is the first benefit of the new found relationship between the TCS Network and CS Weekly as we were able to get the scoop on this before the major media outlets.