Chisoxfn

QUOTE(Markbilliards @ Sep 30, 2007 -> 07:47 AM) To whoever has it, does a baseball america subscription feel worth your money? My subscription just lapsed, but I really enjoyed it and when I get off my butt I'm gonna renew again for a 2 year span. For those that like the minors and draft the info is just top notch and the magazine is a good read, imo while the website has a lot of really cool archives and its great to search up for random players when your interested in seeing who this guy is or who that guy is (especially as your reading and getting pumped up about the draft). BA also has a lot of great free stuff like the daily dish and some other things.

QUOTE(3E8 @ Sep 30, 2007 -> 04:32 PM) Lucy wasn't a matter of scouting, it was signability. Everyone knew Suzuki was better. Signability had nothing to do with it. Suzuki was an easy sign and money wasn't an issue had they went with Suzuki (nor was it an issue with Lucy).

QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Sep 29, 2007 -> 05:52 PM) Surely you'll recall the support for one Kurt Suzuki around here in June of '04? We have no other options for two reasons. 1. The Sox failed to draft/produce a capable ML catcher the last 10 years. 2. Instead of a firesale, the Sox elected to resign any aging veteran with trade value. In that respect, I would hope this extension raises your blood pressure. It highlights the poor short and long-term decisions the organization has made to back themselves into this corner. I was sick when Donny Lucy was drafted instead of Suzuki. I pretty much figured the Sox were gonna take Suzuki and we'd have a guy that could project into a pretty damn solid all around catcher.

After sitting by watching all the constant critism Grossman took (some of it deserved, much of it undeserved) its time for me to hope that everyone watched today's game and saw that the issue with the offense is much bigger than Rex Grossman. The main issues are the playcalling (Ron Turner, could you be any more imaginative), the lack of playing to a player strenghts (ie, no deep passes through the first 3 weeks when Rex played as well as the improper use of Cedric Benson by consistently putting in other backs which prevents a power back from gaining a rhtyhm), and of course the offensive line (which is HORRID). I don't know what to say about Turner. I still think he's superior to any of the coordinators we have had since his first go round at the OC (but I also think Shoop was second to that as Shea and Crowton were horrid and I had no problem with the idea of Shoops system of being a run run run type team). Still, he's failed to use his weapons on numerous situations. All season he went away from Rex and failed to ever stick with the run (something they need to do if Benson is our RB). He has also consistently put Peterson in on passing downs despite being a suspect blocker (compared to Benson or anyone else in the NFL). Worse than that I want to know where Greg Olsen was today? The only place Griese was able to find anything was down the middle of the field (or his little 2 yard passes to Benson or the WR's) yet I saw Olsen nowhere to be seen (he has speed, good hands and the ability to spread the field). They have also failed to get our best "tools" WR on offense (next to Berrian who has had the drops) Mark Bradley onto the field. Bradley has always had success with the Bears when healthy yet until today I hadn't seen him step foot onto the turf. Offensive Line: Than there is the line. Its old, old and old. Obviously age has gotten to them and they either have to make up for it with experience or the Bears are going to have to deal with this all season (as they don't have suitable replacements on roster) and will obviously need to focus on this area heavily in the draft (to get some young blood into the oline ranks). QB: Brian Griese is WORSE than Rex Grossman. You can call me a Rex backer, but bottom line, Rex has the ability to spread the field (both horizontally and vertically) and find a way to help the oline (if he can get passing they will respect the rush more and the oline won't have to deal with so many guys in the box to start every play). I know Griese doesn't have the strength to throw an out and he can't throw a deep ball. He did have just enough to throw balls to receivers crossing over the middle of the field but even than there were instances where his lack of arm strenght allowed defenders to close and make hits that can prevent the Wr's from catching the ball. Griese also showed that he too can make mistakes. He threw 3 horrid picks, two in the red zone. I also realize it was one game and he has rust, but my problem wasn't even in the results, it was in what I saw from his arm (he doesn't have the ability to throw a lot of "NFL" passes anymore). He also threw a lot of crosses flat out behind players. Bottom line, Rex is a more accurate QB with a far stronger arm. Rex can also make good reads but he is not known to overcome being flustered and when things do get going bad they seem to stay going bad (But that is at least semi understandable when you are talking about a younger QB). Hell, I've seen Rex try to step up and I've seen him even at his worse lead the team on good drives (remember the Vikings game last year where he hit Davis for the game winning score). The team needs to go with Rex (and see if he can do it these next few weeks) or turn the reigns over to Orton and see if he can be the QB going into next year or if the team needs to go after a guy like McNabb and draft a QB.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Sep 30, 2007 -> 03:28 PM) He does deserve a couple more starts, and of course it is impossible to say with certainty that Rex would have done worse or better. But as most people predicted, it wasn't much of a difference. And doesn't history tell us it rarely is that big of a difference? I can flat out say that Grossman is a more accurate passer with the ability to throw all kinds more routes. Griese made horrible decisions (the thing that is supposed to make him better than Rex). Griese is terrible....TERRIBLE. Also, this game isn't all his fault, but than again neither were hte other games where Grossman got all the s*** for (and those games were against teams better than the Lions, imo).

QUOTE(Texsox @ Sep 30, 2007 -> 01:11 PM) Let's see how he does after a couple more starts. After all he does have that splashy career rating. BTW, and since Brett Favre is in the news, his QG rating is only a couple notches about Griase's. 85.5 v. 86.05 and 17th place versus 15th place. Screw that...it should be Orton or Grossman. Griese is a backup, pure and simple.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Sep 30, 2007 -> 01:54 PM) The Dolphins are the worst team in football. The Rams are f***ing awful.

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Sep 30, 2007 -> 11:16 AM) Yup, poor decision. But the offense still looks lightyears better. Are you kidding me. Griese was f***ing horrible today. He showed why he isn't any good. He can't make quite a few "NFL" passes. He can't throw an out pattern to save his life, can't throw a deep ball and the only pass he can throw are screens and short passes to the wideouts as well as the ocassional crossing pattern 15-25 yards down the field (and even than his lack of arm strenght causes there to be more time for a CB/Safety to close on the WR potentially making a hit that jarrs the ball lose and causes a completion to be incomplete. Hell, he wasn't even accurate on short crossing patterns (hence at least one of the interceptions).

QUOTE(fathom @ Sep 30, 2007 -> 10:11 AM) Terrible call by the refs. Also, isn't it time to bench Berrian? He's been the worst player on the Bears this year, and it's not even close. He's dropped some passes but he's the bears best receiver by a long ways. Worse player...haha.

So I got some good Halo action in tonight. We had two xbox's linked up and god damn is Halo 3 awesome. THan went into some NHL 08 and its even better than ever. Not quite as arcadey as 07 (which was such a fun game) but the CPU is just so much smarter which allows better puck possession. It is like impossible to score though (which is the opposite of last years game).

Hott Fuzz is absolutey awful (and I loved Shaun of the Dead). I had to turn the s*** off halfway into it for being so bad.

AJ is one of the better catchers in the league and another two years works for me. I am scared that they have so many guys under contract > 30 as that could get this team into trouble. However, AJ is an asset and one of the better catchers in the league.

QUOTE(klaus kinski @ Sep 28, 2007 -> 06:53 AM) F for this year F for last year F for poor farm system He does not seem to be getting better at his job. Time for a change I can't see how Kenny deserved an F for last year as the team on paper was superior to the one that won the world series in 05. No one would have been able to predict just how severely the rotation would collapse in 2006 (along with the failures of Politte and Cotts). And a GM's job is to put together a great team on paper while the managers job is to get that team to reach its success (and in some instances the team just completely fails in which case I don't see it worthy blaming either guy).

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Sep 28, 2007 -> 08:31 AM) This game and the Cal-Oregon game should be a lot of fun this weekend. Then of course, you have the game of the year next week with LSU and Florida. Oklahoma-UT as well next weekend. Wow. Oregon and WVU win. Oregon wins by a good margin, WVU game may be close (I just can't evaluate how good South Florida's defense is since they haven't played any truly good offensive teams).

Bottom line I think any time you discuss what the Sox can do to get better you always have to factor in the rest of the division. In an easy division, I'd be much more of a fan of sticking with the veterans and trying to find another stop gap because I believe that type of team would easily be able to take out a bunch of young or mediocre teams (say if the sox were in the NL Central). If you are in the AL Central, an already strong division with a couple teams that are already strong and possess good farm systems than you have to factor in not only the fact that you will have to be a lot better next year, but you also have to factor in that those teams may even get better in the coming years based on youth development alone. The Twins are one of those teams that I actually think will be better next year (more likely in 2009 though) than they were this year as I think Slowely and Garza and some of there other young pitchers will have figured things out all while that offense should stay strong (especially if they are able to get a lot for Santana).

Hall may have been the worse player in all of baseball. In fact, given the amount of games he played in, he has to be the worse player in all of baseball.

QUOTE(YASNY @ Sep 28, 2007 -> 09:56 AM) Good thread guys. A lot of different but well expressed opinions. I didn't see the game, so my comments will be based on what I've read here and elsewhere. Broadway stated the he pretty much threw his cutter exclusively as that was the only pitch he could consistently throw for a strike. I believe I read that at the Trib's website. If that's the case it tells me two things. One, if he was facing the Yankees or Red Sox, they would have lit him up the 2nd time through the lineup. Two, either he just had a feel for the pitch or it is a pretty damn good pitch. That remains to be seen. Regarding the comment that a pitcher shouldn't learn how to pitch in the majors, well, that is correct but only to certain extent. The only way to learn how to consistently get major league hitters out is to face major league hitters unless you just really have some seriously nasty stuff. It usually takes time for a pitcher to develop the know how to be an effective big league pitcher. That is something you can't learn in the minors. Of course, there exceptions to that rule, but Lance Broadway will not be one of those exceptions. You are exactly right. I think the key is to get a pitcher ready to be able to mentally handle the major leagues and have enough command to where he can get by. The rest he is going to learn on the fly at the major league level as there is only so much you can learn at the minor league level. Broadway seems to have very good confidence and mound presence to go with great movement and I think long term he will actually turn into one of the better members of that draft class (and this is after I consistently ripped him). Guys with that type of movement don't tend to get hit very hard (although I obviously have to see him repeat the performance but I assume he typically has that much life to his pitches).

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Sep 28, 2007 -> 08:48 AM) I know, I know. BUt just by judging the hitters reactions to the different pitchers, Lance impressed me. And I keep pointing to the at bat where gathright almost broke his arm trying to swing at an inside fastball on a 3-2 count. Lance was filthy, and really impressed the hell out of me last night. I would love nothing more than to havethis kid come up and be Garland-esque. I definitely think he has the ability and obviously more seasoning for him in AAA could be in order. As Gene mentioned, if he consistently pitched like this he wouldn't have posted the numbers he did down in AAA (as they were pedestrian). However, you could flat tell he was confident and even without excellent command (as he didn't have the greatest control during parts of last night game) he was still able to dominante a mediocre to poor Royals lineup. And it wasn't just the results, it was more the HOW (ie the sick movement and the fact that there were only 2 or 3 hard hit balls).

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Sep 27, 2007 -> 05:33 PM) *waits for Ned Yost is an idiot response by Greg the Bull or, well, you* Yost has done a horrible job.

QUOTE(fathom @ Sep 27, 2007 -> 08:03 PM) I think the more effective one will be whoever gets better command sooner. I definitely don't think having both in the same rotation would be a winning combination. Gavin has a better FB and curve, but Broadway has much better mechanics and movement and will be the better long term pitcher. I do think Floyd can be a solid 4th or 5th though but he won't be an ace.

QUOTE(fathom @ Sep 27, 2007 -> 08:00 PM) It's too bad he didn't get more starts over the last month or so. I still think Floyd needed starts as did Danks (just to see if he could recover). I wouldn't have minded not starting Contreras (hell I'd have waived his ass) but it turns out that ended up working out pretty well (as he may just have some trade value after all). In fact, I dont' know if Jose has another start left, but if it were me, his season would be over and we'd see Heath Phillips or someone else go (just to make sure Jose's season ends on a positive and the club can try selling his last 8 starts ERA and what he did last year and the year before that).

QUOTE(3E8 @ Sep 27, 2007 -> 05:38 PM) No love for House? House is a tremendous comedy/drama. The new season is pretty cool and it will be interesting to see what they do with the team (I assume the other people aren't coming back and I don't want any spoilers if anyone actually knows based on contracts).

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Sep 27, 2007 -> 07:56 PM) There was an article in the last couple days in one of the papers, saying that Broadway was learning two new pitches this year. I'd guess his walk total may be somewhat related to that. The Comcast gun was showing 88-89 for the FB, but, it also showed Riske not getting above 88 or 89, and I know he can throw low 90's. So I'd guess Broadway was about where the scouting reports put him - 90-91 FB. I'm not sure if the slider or changeup is the other pitch as I always thought he had thrown the change in the past (although I briefly recall hearing something about him changing grips on his change so that could very well be it). I do know he worked very very hard on his 2 seamer this year (which was a new pitch for him in 07).

QUOTE(fathom @ Sep 27, 2007 -> 07:53 PM) The gun seemed accurate based on the other pitchers in the game. I'd say he was at 87 consistently. I wonder how he'd do against a patient team, as the Royals weren't exactly working the count. The best thing that could come out of this is if his trade value increases, as he's not an AL starting pitcher, IMO. The Royals did work the count early in the game. The Royals obviously aren't a good hitting team, but with his movement he can get anyone out and there is no reason not to be surprised with his lack of confidence in the command of the 2 seamer (its what led to all the walks and its a completely new pitch). I've heard from a couple people that I trust down in the minors who indicated how his control problems were directly tied to him working really really hard on getting his 2 seamer down. I don't feel its unrealistic (considering he has always had pretty solid control prior to adding this pitch) that he will get more used to the pitch and movement and really turn into a guy that has good command. If you can have good command of an 87-89 MPH (with that sort of movement and the ability to move it every freaking way) and that curve (plus a mediocre change/slider) than you will have a long career in the AL or NL.

QUOTE(greg775 @ Sep 27, 2007 -> 07:43 PM) Great post. Very informative on what you saw out of Broadway. I think it's dangerous to deal Jon, but that's just me. I would not trust Danks/Flod/Gio/Egbert. Hopefully we'll get some new long relievers if our rotation consists of just 2 reliable starters and a bunch of unknowns. I'd really like to keep Garland too, but If the Sox aren't interested in resigning him (and are already maxed out payroll wise with Buehrle/Javier in the rotation) than I would have no problem moving him and Contreras. I do think if you did that you'd have to get at least one starter from somewhere else and than pencil two young guys into the back spot. I have zero interest in bringing back the 45 year old Contreras and I just hope his good pitching down the stretch leads to the Sox being able to get a good prospect for him or a guy like Furcal (really good player that makes a decent amount of dough). Than you parlay Garland into more wiggle room financially (which could go to the club acquiring a position star) as well as some good prospects (hopefully a promising starting pitcher and position player).