Chisoxfn

I thought our analytics department was smallest - not the scouting. Not that it makes it any better. Probably shrinking by the week as they divert more and more resources to robo dialing suckers (err fans) to get white Sox tickets.

Thome on an interim basis.

The problem is Sox fans expected elite - he has been good and can be frustrating in terms of not living up to his hype - but outside of the injuries he has been a good player. Get him in Dodgers as the 5th/6th best player and they will love him. He is such a good defensive player even though bat hasn’t lived up to hype.

Getz was quoted about his job security and basically said - well I just finished the deadline so lets see what tomorrow brings or something like that. He could have said almost anything better than what he did. Told me - my focus last couple weeks have been on executing trade deadline, now let me figure out what we are going to do with our Mgr (to me that means - who are the interim options and what is our plan and we'll get that aligned here in the next couple of days) and I think the leak around that quote is going to maybe accelerate that timeline.

The last part has been said many times and many times those players revert back to historical norms. I can think of Phil Humber who everyone thought was fixed and after a season...poof went right back to who he was. It happens - especially for someone who didn't have elite swing and miss stuff, which reality is MLB focuses a ton on that. Kopech will be around for a long time on that basis.

I'll just state this - on Robert and Crochet - I don't think they got an offer from either that involved an elite prospect (and I'm being loose on elite - I'm going top 50 guy). I think Crochet would have - but the extension and late news probably ruined any chance, but reality is the inning limit(s) were always a risk. Given that both Robert and Crochet are elite talents and are around a while from a contract perspective -> I think Getz made the right move punting and moving forward. Trading Crochet for a back end top 100 and 2 other top 250 guys isn't worth it in my opinion and would be a poor use of asset(s) and also set a poor precedent. And I fully don't blame any team that wasn't willing to offer that sort of capital up for Crochet knowing it was far more likely they are using chip(s) now for an asset that more likeley helps them next year and the following (vs. this year - teams in contention don't make those type of moves at the deadline). On Robert - I think reality is you would have got 75 cents on the dollar for him - I wonder if maybe a team through something out - but with how big of a funk he was in down the stretch and the Sox probably asking for multiple top end position prospects (which is what he would have been worth a few months ago) - I think rolling the dice on Robert either finishing strong (and/or having a bounce back next year under new management and with a fresh off-season) and than you flip him for far better value than today.

Now seeing the Flaherty deal - I guess one question is - who was worth more, Flaherty or Fedde. But with that in mind - I would probably argue Flaherty had more value - given he has a long term track record where he flashed vs. Fedde being a one year wonder. Both have been very good this year though - Flaherty has a much better ERA and FIP this season and track record. It wasn't like Flaherty got a Top 100 prospect. It seems like the reality is the market for these guys (in fairness Flaherty is a rental vs. Fedde) was not what anyone thought it was. So as I look at that, while I still think they got a guy less, I don't think ultimately the Fedde deal was as bad as I previously thought (unless the Sox wanted to roll the dice and keep him rest of this year and through the trade deadline in which case maybe they get one extra guy or something else).

This was super cool ?

With Sox sucking - been so great to just watch Olympics with the family at night. Nice work by girls gymnastics after the men’s did an awesome job day before.

Caufield - wishing you a quick recovery and no long term impacts. Get better quick!!!

I really think the 2020-2023 White Sox will go down as the shining example of why you don’t hand a bunch of elite talents a ton of money when they either hadn’t yet made the majors or were barely in the majors. At the time - I loved the idea, but in hindsight the Sox did it too soon and set the wrong precedent around ensuring players have the right hunger to earn that initial major pay day vs get it handed to them too soon (in fairness they earned it but it was clearly premature).

Heads up that in next week we will likely shut down site for a bit to upgrade the forum and clean up some server stuff. Was hoping to limp through season but trade deadline outages on site showed we got to take care of sooner vs later. Will give more of a heads up when I know exact timing.

Reality is - as soon as we hit tomorrow - some of the short-timers need to go and they need to give consistent at bats to Lee, Sosa, Colas and a bunch others over the next 2 months. I don't know what they'll do with Quero but you could put him on the list and obviously Vargas is a given. I'm sure I'm missing others - not saying you should rush everyone - but for those that have gotten enough expeirence and you need to see if they are MLB'ers or AAAA ers now is hte time.

I don't get it - Fedde was at least a #2/#3 starter or was pitching like one (FIP devalued him a bit but still a legit #3 at minimum). DeJong is a utility guy who can step in and start if someone is hurt but that is it. Getting a flyer which is what they got is all we should expect. Heck - if it were me, I Would have been trying to find international slot and / or draft picks where I could because I think in today's market teams are kind of undervaluing those vs. existing talent (call it time value - one is already here, the other is soon to be here).

I live out in SoCal - my Dodger friends all thought pretty highly of him and think he's going to be a good player, but he just didn't get enough playing time. Wouldn't be the first Dodger stuck in that position. Its kind of hard to get regular playiing time (vs. platoon) on that roster unless you are a bonafide superstar. Dodgers thought a lot more highly of Vargas than Busch. Busch has put up 2.5 WAR thus far this season. I really don't think it would be a shocker if Vargas became a 3 WAR+ type of player. With 5 years of control...that isn't bad.

I think the, they gave up Kopech and Pham needs to get levelized a bit. Pham wasn't going to get you much. He's a veteran leader who was a waiver pick-up and he's put up negative WAR. He has good grit and has been better than the rest of the Sox garbage, but he's still one of the last 2 guys on the roster - no one is giving up much for him at all. This was more of - we are moving you to a contender and maybe you got some iterative value. Kopech is a guy with a great arm and one year of control left - but he isn't super cheap either as he'll likely get a raise of some sort. I think getting 1.5 intriguing guys is probably right for him which means .5 of the 19 year old goes to Fedde plus Vargas. In my mind - that means Fedde is a bit of an underpay - but that is depending on how Sox rate Vargas. If they still think he is that top 40 type player who was roster squeezed - than they will end up looking pretty smart in this deal. I actually think there is a chance the Dodgers look the worst in this - as if the SS never regains form from injury, they basically get Kopech for 3 guys at that point. Cards did well in my mind - no denying that.

Have they really not won on a Monday all year?

Where is this coming from. I am not one to defend Getz but it sounded like they wee talking and working with him on a plan and than they got completely blindsided.

I think of it that way - if Vargas ends up a 3 WAR player for 5 years of control - that is a pretty darn good trade. If one of the other prospects turns into something as well - that is an excellent deal. I’m not betting on the second thing happening - but more they take chances on these type of guys on trades, the more one or two might hit. On Vargas, I think with him just being able to play regularly without getting consistently in and out (part of challenge for young dodger players breaking in)….we are going to end up seeing him blossom. He is a good hitter. I don’t know if he will be great - but I see him being a 750 to 825 ops type of guy without projecting too much. Also let’s not compare him to Sosa - his minor league numbers and hit tool is light years ahead of Sosas. Maybe he ends up like Sosa but they aren’t the same echelon of prospects.

Oddly enough - they both have the same FIP this year.

I actually don’t mind him ripping Crochet. Sox have him under contract so it isn’t like they have to move him anyway. But given the quotes I suspect they will…again I’m not optimistic but maybe Fedde was a bit more depressed of a value since he doesn’t have #1/#2 stuff and so teams discounted that and fact it’s a half season of progress after a number of years of sucking. Kind of like that one year Humber was good before he went back to s%*#.

This doesn’t seem like anything for Sox fans to get up in arms about. Bloss is an a ball player over elevated into bigs due to injuries and a number 9 prospect in a system not loaded.

Defensively I don’t believe that is true.

I think that is my thing - if Kopech didn't have much value, there wasn't much reason not to hold onto him and keep working on him and give it a final shot next year at the deadline or in the off-season (if he finished the year strong).

I would argue if the SS is no longer a SS and all they are getting is a bat plus the contract, than the Dodgers did just as bad as the Sox, if not worse. Cause I do think Vargas and the other 2 is pretty good value for Kopech on his own (and I do expect Kopech at some point will put together a good run). So that is the part that kind of has me puzzled - maybe league just wasn't going to give up a lot for Fedde so it came down to which best prospect in any deal did Sox like the most. I don't know who the others were. Vargas is a big leaguer who has a hit tool that hasn't shown up (but his actual hitting tool is pretty good) and he had gotten pulled around a bit by the Dodgers. Any which way - I think we all agree that its a good deal for Cardinals - they get a potential playoff run with Fedde plus next year on a cost control deal. I'm still puzzled - can't really find a lot to be excited about, but I definitely could see a scenario where Vargas ends up a 3 WAR type of outfielder or 2B type (or a guy who can do a bit of both but get tons of at bats so a 3 WAR versality guy). I suppose potentially better - maybe 4 WAR (I kind of limit his upside there because he isn't getting plus points for his defense). But he should be a decent base runner, etc so not like they are getting Eloy in the field / on the bases (and hopefully not on the IR either).