GreenSox

I can't be picky for Frazier. There will be a lot of oohs and aahs for pop ups that fall 30 feet short of the Green Monster.

QUOTE (Knackattack @ Jul 14, 2017 -> 09:16 PM) I feel like if this was close he wouldn't be playing Agree

Has he been pulled?

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 14, 2017 -> 08:39 PM) He's ready to play now. That means moving TA/Moncada/Sanchez...considering where our window is, I'd have preferred Jimenez as well. I could go either way. Jimenez certainly has the better hit tool. They're going to have to address Sanchez/Saladino soon enough. Sanchez is #15 in WAR - middle of the pack is well above utility infielder. Could get something decent for him (young pitching! ).

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 14, 2017 -> 08:35 PM) Definitely like Jimenez/Cease over Albies/Newcomb, even despite Newcomb's handedness. Albies just was never a good fit for us. Why not? Not exactly flush with SS. One issue is that a lot of these guys don't really have a position. They will hopefully grow into one.

Have no interest in any intentional tanking...I'd like to see the maneuvers start to rebuild this outfit. Hopefully some young pitching for some of these Sanchez types perhaps. It will be a bad record anyway. To keep it going, they'll always need pitching in the pipeline. Lack of it really cost the Sox in the last decade.

QUOTE (beautox @ Jul 14, 2017 -> 02:17 PM) I'm all for eating Frazier's remaining money(6M) while eating 1/2 of Sandoval's remaining contract; roughly 50M including the buy out. To get a package like Groome + Chavis + Okimey & Beeks. Essentially paying 25m for Groome and Chavis, Sox would be giving them roughly an additional 20M of breathing room since they wouldn't be getting hit with a 40% overage, so in essence nearly clearing them from the tax burden of the contract and give them more flexibility in free agency and acquisitions in the future. And for whom would Boston need to clear that salary room so as not to hit the Tax? Re Sandoval, just DFA him upon acquisition, please.

Undetermined. The teardown went fine and is nearing completion. Soon, it will be time to build the team back up. It may be that time already. The buildup is the hard part.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 14, 2017 -> 01:26 PM) I don't even necessarily think he is a flash in the pan...but I don't think he has the ceiling that Andrew Miller has...that dude is just unreal. If the offer is there to get a guy you really, really like, you move Kahnle. But otherwise, I'd be willing to gamble with him a bit. Yea Don't move him for a meh prospect. Move him if it gets the Sox who they want.

Melky would be an upgrade for the Royals at DH and a offensive upgrade in LF. Since he's not worth much regardless, trade him for high K and high BB Skoglund

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jul 14, 2017 -> 09:37 AM) Realistically, a guy like Hand should get 1 Top 50-100 prospect and 1 more decent prospect (organizational top 20) in return. The ask can be higher, but I doubt they get a Miller/Chapman level return. Kahnle is interesting as his peripherals are outstanding this season, but the track record is not great. Relievers are getting to be very valuable trade chips now, as 7th/8th innings in the playoffs are seen as crucial to success. Will a team like the Nationals be willing to part with significant prospects for relief? They likely will have to. I'd be inclined to hold Kahnle, and let him close for a year. There's some risk that he disintegrates, but it's worth the risk, imv. Hand will be interesting.

QUOTE (balfanman @ Jul 14, 2017 -> 08:53 AM) Victor Caratini Cubs got him for Bonifacio. Man they recycled their garbage well.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 14, 2017 -> 08:13 AM) In regards to Robertson, that's because he's a "closer" on a team that doesn't win much. It's tied to his usage. Swarzak gets a lot of high leverage situations which ideally, on a better team or even just on a team where he was utilized more properly, David would get too. That's true. Volume is an ingredient in WAR. I think Swarzak has earned his #8. He's produced in those high leverage situations.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Jul 14, 2017 -> 07:11 AM) I didn't get the sense that Theo or the Cubs would be criticized for making this move. I actually think Theo being willing to do this somewhat dispels the notion that Rick has his sights set too high. Hopefully other GMs will step in now (Hello, Mike Rizzo!) and under the cover which Theo has provided and have the spine to augment their ballclubs. Professional GMs understood the true value of Quintana (although few were willing to pay it). Fans (not the Sox fans, but others) way undervalued him. But by the same token, I think fans may over value Robertson. He's 37 in WAR among relief pitchers (maybe he's better than that on the more advanced stats - don't know). I think any real value is tied to "proven closer" - which probably begins and ends with Nats. By the same token, Swarzak is #8. Wonder how high the sights are set on him; not sure where they should be set either.

QUOTE (Wanne @ Jul 14, 2017 -> 12:44 AM) One thing that concerns me now...the press has universally been praising Hahn for his last 3 trades and the returns he's gotten...and I'm thinking Rizzo (who's still probably a little butthurt)...but Rizzo or any GM might be a little leery being "the next GM" to get fleeced by Hahn. Ricky has done a masterful job with this rebuild so far for sure...but I'm almost thinking we're not getting what we want for Robertson unless it's a nice package that includes more than just DRob. While Hahn was praised for getting good value, the only trade in which the serious media suggested he did any fleecing on was the Eaton trade. And any fleecing he did on the Eaton trade is less than the extent to which he was fleeced on the Shields trade, so I doubt any GM will hesitate in dealing with him. I think people were surprised that Hahn could get could value for these players in this environment, which is not always easy to do. Serious GMs want win-win trades. All a GM has to do is look at how Sale is pitching

Tampa Bay could certainly use another reliever. Could use a 2B too. I'd like to see Cooper get his hands on Blake Snell - looks like a good fix-em project. I see a team that could use Melky.....Royals.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jul 13, 2017 -> 11:02 PM) Dee Gordon would be more interesting....with contract extension? Mercy

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jul 13, 2017 -> 10:29 PM) Yeah, unfortunately he probably isn't part of the next contender because it's so unlikely he signs an extension. But the time to move him is after he becomes a consistently above average pitcher. We'll have him for at least another calendar year, maybe two. And by the time the Sox are ready to trade him, they may be looking for a different type of prospect - the more polished ML ready in the Eaton, Quentin, Davidson mode. I would mind seeing the Sox flip one of their guys like Yolmer for a similarly situated pitcher. they just can't throw out 4 James Shields out there, rebuilding or not. Hahn's going to have to start making some moves of that sort soon enough.

QUOTE (Joshua Strong @ Jun 17, 2017 -> 05:09 PM) Joe Gray showing off the plus plus plus arm. https://twitter.com/hudsonbelinsky/status/876193735821983744 Wow - that guy might be able to reach home plate from the wall!

QUOTE (GenericUserName @ Jul 13, 2017 -> 07:26 PM) I would not be against it, especially because it seems like no teams are going to be offering good prospects. Like if we could get away with giving up a few of the guys we having bouncing between the majors and AAA and get him I think it would be a good deal. What do to with the current pre-arb players (Davidson, Leury, Yolmer, Engel, e.g.) who, hopefully keep improving, will be an interesting part of the next phase of the rebuilding. Will they be part of the plan, traded, etc.?

Yes, especially considering they used practically the entire 2017 draft on offense. Bigger gaps reside in defense at certain positions and perhaps pitching, imo. The tear down should be 80% done in about 2 weeks. Then the really difficult work beings; building a contending major league team.

QUOTE (StrykerSox @ Jul 13, 2017 -> 06:58 PM) Ok, the Reed thing makes me wonder, and I want some input from older folks... Back in the day, late 1990s-early 2000s, I was a pre-teen so my actual understanding of prospects was pretty limited, but it seemed like we had a pretty kickass system. Rauch, Reed, Owens, Borchard, Sweeney, Honel, Hummel, Malone, Wells, Fogg, Barcelo...just to name a few. None turned into anything for us, and very few did anything for anyone else. (I admit I may be squeezing together players from different eras too). So, that said, was our farm system ever like this? You never know. That wave of prospects didn't turn out to be much; that's a big reason 2005 wasn't sustained much past then. On the other hand, the Sox had a wave of young players between 1995 and around 2000/01 that was terrific: Mike Cameron, Ray, Durham, Magglio Ordonez, Mark Buehrle, Carlos Lee, Joe Crede, Aaron Rowand, Greg Norton, James Baldwin, Chad Bradford, Jon Rauch, It was light in starting pitching, and Williams spent most of 2001-2005 getting it fixed. Most of these guys weren't even on the 2005 team, but the talent pool was rich back then.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jul 13, 2017 -> 04:47 PM) I think the Sox would need a considerable package in order to move Abreu. I see them keeping him another season or two to mentor younger players, and as a potential bat to flip later Agree - there's not much of a market this year. Yanks don't appear ready to make serious deals yet. Wait a year, and they may be willing to pay. Or Henley could be scuffling this time next year. Or whatever - the market couldn't be worse than it is this year.

Tally Ho, Hahn. Well-done! Gonna miss you, Q.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Jul 12, 2017 -> 11:44 PM) If we get a guy like Jimenez, Brinson, or Acuna, we are likely not going to have heard of anyone else in the deal. I'm not convinced any of those guys are even on the table. I doubt they are, but if they were, I'd fine with nothing else but lottery tickets. Braves are a team that I think the Sox could start further own the prospect list, but end up with a good deal. But I suspect any Cubs deal = Schwarber. That's their spare part - he's killing their defense - they hope an AL team will take him as DH. Which one may; but it makes no sense for the Sox. Sox could have probably had a Schwarber deal any time in the last 10 months, so tend to doubt it's him, unless they are completely capitulating.