fathom

QUOTE(iamshack @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 06:25 PM) So now you're going to argue that Josh has nothing left to learn as a hitter? There is no one in the minor leagues from which he could learn something? He needs to learn more plate discipline. He needs to learn how to put the ball in play to the opposite field more. He needs to work on his footwork and timing at 3rd base. Look, I don't disagree that Josh wouldn't substantially hurt the team if he were the starting third baseman. But I also don't believe that he had nothing more to learn as a baseball player, whether it be at Charlotte or not. Fields has quite a few homers to the opposite field. He's also our best breaking ball hitter. Quite simply, he struggles against good, high fastballs. The only level he can get experience with that is in the majors.

QUOTE(iamshack @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 05:53 PM) Ok, so I just wasted several minutes of my life reading through this entire s***storm. This thread is like every negative poster on Soxtalk's wet dream. Why is it that some people actually enjoy when the organization does something they disagree with so they have a chance to tell everyone else how much smarter they are than the general manager? As much as all the pro-Fields people want to poke fun at "Crede's Crew," and facetiously compare Joe to Brooks Robinson, one would think Josh Fields was David Wright or Ryan Braun. The world will not end if Josh has to go to Charlotte for a few hundred ab's, guys. Just like the world will not end if Joe is traded to SF or LAD. But wow, why do some of you even watch the team or read the newspaper if it makes you so damned miserable? Some of you are incredibly-gifted whiners. It's sad, as there was actual legitimate baseball conversation in this thread. I can't wait for someone to open up the all-negative thread so we have to stop reading comments that have nothing to do with the Sox or baseball, and are just attacks on what people think.

QUOTE(SoxWS05 @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 05:11 PM) KW also said he would not negotiate with Buehrle mid-season...boom 5 year contract. Wake me the next time we negotiate successfully with Scott Boras. We're like a college basketball program that can't accept partial qualifiers and junior college players.

QUOTE(SoxWS05 @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 05:07 PM) If he comes in and proves himself healthy, I would give him 4 years 30 million. That's 7.5 per year. Good deal on both sides. You do know that KW has said that Crede/Boras have no desire to extend their deal with the Sox this season, correct?

QUOTE(Jenks Heat @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 05:05 PM) For every Marlin, the Royals, Pirates, Reds, Twins, D-Rays, etc. say hi. And what do all those teams have in common....lack of financial resources!

If the Sox were intent on letting Crede start at 3rd base if he was still on the team this year, then they made another huge error in judgement by not making Fields into a left fielder.

QUOTE(Vance Law @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 04:35 PM) I like how having too many players at a given position is a "hole." When they're not good players, it's a hole.

QUOTE(SoxWS05 @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 04:22 PM) Wow. Hate to burst your bubble but Fields is the next coming of a poor man's Adam Dunne. Adam Dunn's a pretty damn good player.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 04:18 PM) Well this thread is just ugly as hell. After last season ended, there were only two players on the team who should have been locks to be on the 2008 White Sox. Buehrle and Fields...it just baffles my mind that it's possible Fields won't be with the big league club.

QUOTE(SoxWS05 @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 03:39 PM) Detroit has holes, Cleveland has holes, Jesus, let the season play out before you right them off. Thanks Hawk

QUOTE(SoxWS05 @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 03:34 PM) They have these players called "free agents" every year. We have young talent to build around. A move here, a move there..holes filled. We have a lot of money tied up in salaries for the next few seasons. And we really don't have a lot of young talent to build around in comparison with other teams. Pretty soon, we're going to have to spend a lot more money than we have been on positions like SS, Bobby Jenks, etc. Our core players are not considered to be young, cheap players. We're looking more and more like the AL version of the Giants.

QUOTE(Princess Dye @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 03:29 PM) If you think attempting winning in 2008 is pointless, then you probably believe we'll be bad fast, and Fields will be UP HERE ANYWAY by midseason. Furthermore, does Fields playing in AAA another year really "stunt" his progress? My belief is talent comes to the forefront or it doesnt. He's 25. Yes, I don't think going to AAA will do him any good. He's not going to see the 95 mph fastballs there that he needs to get more comfortable with.

QUOTE(Princess Dye @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 03:24 PM) Swisher's age, the length and value of the contract, and that much needed OBP are all reasons to like that trade. People who slam that trade do not mention Swish's age, b/c it's a component in the terms of their own argument. And on top of that, he's shown power and OBP in a pitcher's park already. My belief that trade will soon be seen as Swisher for DLS, if that, but thats me. Oakland's notorious for PED users, so maybe Sweeney can finally bulk up and hit the ball out of the infield.

QUOTE(SoxWS05 @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 03:22 PM) Are you more concerned with having a good MLB team or AAA team? Don't over value prospects because thats all they are...prospects. I think there's list a mile long of "can't miss" prospects who never made it. If Kenny wanted a good farm system he could have it tomorrow, but he wants the White Sox to compete now our farm system. We used all of our prospects to try and field a good MLB team, and as of right now, there's still a lot of holes on the team (starting rotation, CF, 2nd base, back-up catcher).

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 03:21 PM) Swisher not playing center is more with Ozzie wanting a bantam weight track star to jump start his marlinlike offense than Swisher. I would rather have Swisher in left and Anderson in center or Swisher in center and Quentin in LF than Pods JR out there. Thanks for saying what I wanted to, but didn't want to get into an Ozzie bashing debate.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 03:16 PM) I haven't seen Swisher play much out there, but he didn't look like a disaster. I still think both moves were excellent. I also think that Williams is more patient than people give him credit for (and people here seem to be). Quentin will be a difference maker, probably - this year or next. Which way it goes depends on a lot of things. What is wrong with that? And I don't think they've counted Swisher out of CF yet anyway. We still have half of ST left. As you said earlier, KW probably would have been better off using our resources (top prospects) to get another solid starter instead of relying on our mediocre 3/4/5 in the starting rotation. I still can't believe we used Garland to get Cabrera and his one year left on his contract. Don't get me wrong, I like Swisher. However, I feel as if KW misjudged his ability to play CF, as well as the talent level of Richar and possibly Quentin.

I'd also like to say that I think the Swisher deal was idiotic considering we traded our 3 best prospects for a left fielder when we had traded our best hitting prospect for Quentin, who basically is now blocked from starting. My belief is KW thought Swisher would be able to play CF, but we quickly realized he's a disaster out there.

I don't know where the link is, but a scout said last week that Crede's lost a step on defense, and would only rate as average now defensively.

QUOTE(SoxWS05 @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 03:00 PM) I'm pretty sure a ground ball in AAA is the same as a ground ball in MLB. Actually, it's not even close. The field conditions in the minors are as bad as Fenway and Wrigley, in terms of bounces. Fields isn't as bad on D as many think...we're not talking Ryan Braun.

I'm going to be rather disappointing if Owens is our starting CF, Uribe is our starting 2b and Crede is our starting 3b. That would be the final straw for me in terms of whether or not KW should remain our GM.

QUOTE(Gregory Pratt @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 04:00 AM) You seriously believe he could just rear back and throw that hard if he wanted to? I understand movement and all these things, taking off the ball, but if you have 100 MPH heat you use it. He doesn't have that anymore, until we see it again. That isn't to say he isn't a fine closer, because he is. Great post!

QUOTE(Princess Dye @ Mar 19, 2008 -> 02:16 PM) I'm no huge Crede guy, but the pitching staff really is going to need some glovework out there this year. I mean, if the book is already closed on this year, then fine hate on this move. But if we're awful by June, you'll see Fields up and playing anyway, so who cares? I believe we only have one starter who would be considered a ground ball pitcher. Fields D at 3b is the least of our worries this season.

Why am I not surprised? On the bright side, Fields could never touch a C.C. pitch, so at least Crede would likely have better at-bats on opening day.

Jason B. will not be on the major league team to start the season. Hawk and KW basically confirmed this on Saturday. The only guy I want to see get traded right now is Crede.

Not bad, an increase in double will certainly help this team. I don't expect us to have a high OBP team, as only Thome and Swisher are above league average at their position.