CaliSoxFanViaSWside

You explained it perfectly and the modern fan doesn't understand the way the game used to be played. It was all about who owned the plate. No pitcher could be a great pitcher without some combination of stuff,control and fear. The fear factor has been removed from the game with hitters with body armor, making it that much more reliant on stuff and control/command. Now hitters go to the plate without fear knowing a weapon has been removed from a pitchers arsenal and because after an ump give you a warning even a pitch that gets away from you and you get kicked out of the game which means pitchers now lose a portion of the plate giving the hitter a huge advantage. A pitcher knocking a guy down often wasn't retaliation for hitting a HR it was the pitcher saying I made a mistake letting you own the plate and I am not making that mistake again.

There you have it . Trading Madrigal is bad luck waiting to happen. If Madrigal is somehow traded for Darvish then Darvish is injured and ineffective for 2 of his remaining 3 years. I understand the reason for wanting to trade him. He's not an impact player like Tatis, jr. ,but if his rookie year is any indication the kid can hit for average if not power. His fielding and base running should improve as he adjusts to the speed of the game and his own limitations. Hitting for average is a good thing around a bunch of guys getting extra base hits. He will score a lot of runs and sustain rallies, knock in a few runs. Look how long the Sox stuck with EE . Nicky brought way more to the table than EE without a single HR while EE hit 10. Nick had a .745 OPS with 3 lousy doubles among his 35 hits and a 108 OPS+. EE had a .627 OPS and 70 OPS+. Nick hit better than our DH for most the the year who cost the Sox $10M. It's hard to take a stance for acquiring guys when we start thinking old often injured guys contracts are worth it coming off a top year. No one liked Abreu's new contract and he was younger than Darvish without injury history. Do not overpay for Darvish . 3 years is too many for a 34 year old with too many injuries and too many incomplete seasons and with his best season in recent memory being one where he pitched 76 innings. I was against EE last year. I was against Shields and LaRoche. I thought the trade for Samardzija was idiotic. It's all in black in white somewhere in the archives. No more costly aging injury prone players.I'd rather trade a Steele Walker 100 times for a Nomar Mazara. 1 minor leaguer for a MLB young player with upside. It's really too bad he flopped because even with his normal production from his 4 previous years we win the division easy and if he had broken out imagine the trade chip he would've been. I want upside, not guys coming off their best year with the likelihood of age and injuries taking the toll they always take.

I guess I would've phrased it differently by saying we are not getting the 2 bests free agents on the market ,but are making a strong push for Springer. Or no chance on Bauer but they are trying hard for Springer. Jimmy's the only one I really pay attention to, the rest are just entertainment .

Ok I get it now, it's the combination of Bauer and Springer that is unlikely. I thought he meant separately each of them is unlikely. LOL i guess I couldn't wrap my head around anyone thinking it would need clarification that we wouldn't get both. That seems fairly obvious.

I just interpret it differently. If the Sox are still trying hard for Springer what reason does Jimmy have to say he is unlikely outside of the normal "it's hard to come out of top of such things ?" Seems overly pessimistic, which is why I'm hoping he means the Sox are trying hard for someone else. Keep in mind I always hope for the best.

I know all that . It's just he said the Sox are trying or going hard after someone and if that's true but he also says Bauer and Springer are out then I have to assume he either thinks trying hard won't be enough for Springer , or he knows Springer is now not an option but are trying hard for someone else.

I don't think so. He made it apparent in other posts that both Bauer and Springer weren't likely. Do you think he means they are trying hard for Springer but he personally thinks they won't get him ?

Which one ? Free agent or trade. Could you mean JBJ ?

This thread has died but seems to me Springer is still a top Sox priority.

I agree wholeheartedly. Many people of many ages are addicted to many substances and behaviors and should seek help.

I still think we see plenty of bargain basement deals. Sure guys signing early are going to jump on good deals when offered but 80% or more of the players will be waiting and waiting. The market will be flooded come Dec. 2nd.

This is not just an old people thing. On the contrary... In 2018 the highest percentage of drunk drivers (with BACs of . 08 g/dL or higher) were 21- to 24-year-olds, at 27%, followed by 25- to 34-year-olds, at 26%. Men are most likely to be involved in this type of crash, with 4 male drunk drivers for every female drunk driver. Among drivers with BAC levels of 0.08% or higher involved in fatal crashes in 2016, nearly three in 10 were between 25 and 34 years of age (27%). The next two largest groups were ages 21 to 24 (26%) and 35 to 44 (22%). The highest percentage of drunk drivers involved in fatal crashes during 2010 was for drivers ages 21 to 24 (34%), followed by ages 25 to 34 (30%), and ages 35 to 44 (25%).2 As we age many of us stop doing foolhardy things and consider ourselves lucky that our actions did not result in harm to others and ourselves. Speeding and drunk driving are mostly committed by those who do not contemplate their own mortality and are among the most selfish, i.e. young adult males.

Does Texas trade him ? They would be foolish not to trade him. Their team is in shambles.

I think neither of them open the season on the team. We will want the extra year for Kopech , I suppose how we end of using them depends on how the season progresses and who we get this off season. I agree that they should be stretched out and I think 100 innings is a bit of a reach for either and without a minor league season the workload is is harder for a fan to ascertain. They both could play key roles if we need them to in order to make the playoffs and keep them available without being shut down for a long playoff stretch which would mean judicial use of them through most of the 1st half ,once again depending on the length of a Covid shortened season. I would hate to try to make a long playoff run without at least 1 or both or them available for stressful innings out of the pen.

I'm kind of surprised we haven't seen Crochet mentioned much in trades. I know he looked like the 2nd coming of Randy Johnson but it's really hard to determine how much he will pitch next year and how his stuff will play when he starts. Plus there's a good chance he will need Tommy John just like most of our other pitchers. What do the Sox do with him if there are no minor league games again ? He could be a key BP piece but that just delays the things he has to do to become a starter. Kopech has had his surgery and the last pitch we saw him throw was 101 on the black to end a perfect inning back in March. 6 of his 11 pitches were 100+ MPH. It's really wild the Sox have 1 lefty and 1 righty, that throw that hard, who can either be key pieces in the 2021 BP or make some starts and build up innings and spend a lot of time either in the minors or in summer camp. If 2021 is a World Series type year I envision both of them in the bullpen.

I don't expect anything . Sometimes these things are made public. It's not unheard of.

I'm surprised Rosenthal or Heyman hasn't given you credit for this scoop yet .

Sure logically he wouldn't but people have their own reasons. I'd just feel better on speculating over a Darvish trade if I knew it had a chance to happen. I suppose he could waive that clause or change his list.

Ok so does anybody know if the White Sox are one of the 12 teams to which Darvish can block trades ?

Because tons or pitchers with the POTENTIAL to be TOR pitchers often end up just being competent. Giolito didn't exactly set the world on fire with his stats . He was basically the worst starting pitcher in baseball. After that terrible 2018 season he already had 240 MLB innings pitched. Cease has 130 MLB innings pitched . It's a game where you learn from your mistakes and experience. I don't think their odds are very high to become 1's or 2's but the potential is always there. I don't have blind optimism but as a fan I can always hope for better.

I think it's safe to say most people were thinking 3rd city in the continental US.

That's who I thought. I was just making sure. I did address why I think that just before this.

I don't rule anything out. I just was saying that the 2 most likely guys to be successful as starters in the near future are Cease and Lopez based on the fact that they have the most innings and if successful can contribute more than the others who need a ton more innings before they can give you a full regular season worth of starts. Of course if you are pitching 2 straight seasons of shortened schedules a lot of pitchers will be having difficulty once you get back to a full season. Having a lot of high quality BP arms becomes increasingly important in Covid years and the years following it.

Who's babyface ?

Out of all our guys who have the potential to be a TOR starter ASAP Cease is #1 and surprisingly Lopez is 2nd . Kopech, Dunning and Crochet all need a lot more innings.