gosox41

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Aug 6, 2007 -> 03:20 PM) The mailbag is out, and Scott Merkin brings up some interesting stuff. He hints at things like... --Fields in LF --Pods not returning --Contreras still possibly being moved --Owens maybe getting th e inside track for CF All things discussed here, but always interesting to see it actually in print on the Sox' site. Makes them slightly more believable as possibilities. I'm particularly excited about Fields maybe in LF, and Pods not returning. Good to see someone is listening to me, Too bad he is not GM. Bob

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Aug 5, 2007 -> 02:32 PM) Too early for me to start saying "I told you so" in the Floyd bashing threads yet...but there's 1. Way too early. Bob

QUOTE(Yossarian @ Aug 1, 2007 -> 02:04 PM) Come on people. Floyd's had his chances and more. He's awful. He has no stuff, it's almost cruel to send him out there anymore. You know Danks hasn't been all that great this year, but if you want to extend some chances, then he's the guy. Danks doesn't back down when things get rough. I say work with young pitchers like Danks, who have some moxie. Floyd melts like a campfire marshmellow. I've seen enough of him. He's a bust. Most prospects don't pan out, and baseball is a very hard game. I wish Gavin Floyd all the success in the world in the game of life. Some here think Floyd needs a fair chance to prove himself. It's too bad he's so mentally weak. Just pitch and he'll be fine. But that won't happen. Bob

QUOTE(JUSTgottaBELIEVE @ Aug 3, 2007 -> 10:20 PM) http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/standings?date=20050804 that Indians team caught absolute fire the final 53 games until the final weekend that is... I don't think this team has it in them either. Bob

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Aug 1, 2007 -> 10:33 PM) Oh come on, you're better than that. Who in this thread is a Floyd "enthusiast"? You and DA may be right, he might suck and never be anything more than a AAAA pitcher. We "enthusiasts" just want to see Floyd given the chance to prove that he sucks, and three or four starts certainly isn't enough to show that. You guys still haven't given a good reason why letting Floyd start the rest of the season is a bad idea. It won't burn out the bullpen -- that's what Haeger is here for. There's nothing wrong with Floyd starting the rest of the season. That way when he craps his pants over the next 10 starts we don't have to waste our time with him as a starter next year. Bob

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Jul 31, 2007 -> 04:49 PM) After today, I thought we might be able to see what direction this team was going in, and what path we might take this off-season. The deadline is now over, and I still have no idea. What direction does this franchise have right now? Are we just letting Dye walk at the end of the year? Even if they do re-up with him, what is happening in left and center? Are they really going to stick with Uribe next season? The pen? Contreras? Now I didn't expect all these questions to be answered today, but I thought we might have a little better idea, and we got nothing. Right or wrong, I just want to know this franchise has some sort of plan, direction, or idea, and it really seems like there is nothing. Kenny has a plan, it's just not a very good one. It involves taking the same core that sucked this year and tryng to fill holes without spending money. Not a good plan, but it is a plan. Bob

QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Jul 28, 2007 -> 09:49 PM) The Astros traded Dan Wheeler for Ty Wigginton. Wigginton has just over 3 years of service time in the league, can play 1B, 2B, and 3B along with some emergency OF, and is putting up a .275/.329/.458/.786 line after a year in which he put up almost a completely identical line. He's one of the more underrated players in the league and is pretty damn valuable. The Astros aren't looking to trade their relievers for cheap, so the Sox shouldn't be scouting them at all. If he's trying to fix the bullpen this year by picking up a reliever from the Astros, he's fighting a ridiculous battle. The Sox have live arms in the minors that should be in the bullpen rather than paying anything for a proven reliever at this point. Russell and Vasquez should be up to showcase what they can do for the organization, as should Floyd and Broadway. I would give FGloyd every chance to pitch this year only because I am down on him and I don't want to start 2008 with him in the rotation. I hope he proves me wrong, but I'm not holding my breath. I wouldn't mind see the rest of the guys, but please no more Dewon Day. Bob

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jul 28, 2007 -> 03:32 PM) Fine. Take that into account in the argument as well...so in other words, you weight the value you get back of someone who could help us next year in comparison with the value of the 2 picks. If you don't get what you want, you still don't make the deal. The Sox are sort of in a win-win situation either way; if no one meets their price, the draft picks are ok, if someone does meet their price, then they can take it. In theory they're in a win/win scenario except they can't seem to draft very well at all. All more picks does is give the Sox a chanc to throw more crap against the wall to see if something actually sticks for once. Drafts under KW have been an exercise in futility. Nothing like blowing a few million in signing bonuses every year plus a few more million in scouting and player development to get virtually no returen. Bob

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Jul 28, 2007 -> 05:03 PM) One more thing to realize, there is a reason Floyd hasn't been sent down, and it isn't because he is wanted in the bullpen. Kenny is going to deal a starter before the deadline, and he can't send down Gavin because he will need him back up here in less than ten days. Floyd is about 85% sure to be in the 2008 starting rotation, so he might as well take his lumps now when the games don't matter. So with Floyd in the rotation, do the Sox still hope to contend in '08? Bob

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jul 23, 2007 -> 10:49 AM) Seriously, folks, he's a rookie. He barely has any at bats in the major leagues, and overall, there are high school kids who have probably played more baseball than he has. . That brings up a question, and I'm not picking on Owens specifically here, Do a lot of players that don't have much baseball experience in HS or college make it up to the big leauges. and have succesful careers? I mean guys that have played other sports besides baseball and are great natural athletes. It seems like most of these guys fail. Bo Jackson is obviously an example of a success but for every Bo, there seems to be lots of Borchard's and Henson's. Guys who are great athletes but don't have baseball skill. Is it worth investing tons of money in 'great atheletes' because they played ball well in college and showed some potential based on pure athelticism but never make it because they're ot polished baseball players? There are plenty of guys wiht less athelticism that make the majors because they do the little things. Bob

QUOTE(AWhiteSoxinNJ @ Jul 22, 2007 -> 10:12 PM) According to Peter Gammons on ESPN Sunday Night Baseball. The Braves made a trade offer of Édgar Rentería for Jon Garland. The White Sox rejected the trade according to Gammons because the White Sox have no interest in trading Garland. What do you guys make of this deal? I wouldn't do it straight up. Not a chance. Bob

QUOTE(BaseballNick @ Jul 22, 2007 -> 05:05 PM) Way to find the bright side. Hopefully there aren't many Boras clients atop the draft class because we're on the fast track to our first top 10 pick in about a decade. I can't wait for some of our youngsters to get here. Losing sucks, but losing with some of our young talent would be easier to watch. I especially want to see Richar, Sweeney, Russell and Gio out there (although I doubt KW would call up Gio so soon). At least it's one less excuse for the alleged minor league experts around here to bring up about why the farm system sucks. Like draft slot affected Oakland, Minny, and Atlanta. They've had bad draft slots and there farm systems are a ton more productive then losers like Pittsburgh and all the top 10 picks they have. Bob

QUOTE(elrockinMT @ Jul 22, 2007 -> 05:13 PM) Ozzie now feels (as of Saturday that is) that we are out of it. There is no chance for this team to make a run at it. It is all pride from now on. I hope that we don't have to settle for just concentrating on the race between the Royals and Sox to stay out of the basement. Hey Ozzie, welcone to yesterday, or in the case of the 2007 Sox about June 1. We've sucked for awhile. Bob

QUOTE(LVSoxFan @ Jul 22, 2007 -> 04:45 PM) Wow. When was the last time we were in last place? I cannot even remember. But the core is there to contend for next year---to paraphrase KW. Anyone believe that? Bob

QUOTE(fathom @ Jul 21, 2007 -> 10:26 PM) They won't be re-signing Dye. Then barring any trades for real OFer's, there's a good chance the Sox starting OF next year could be Fields in LF, Erstad in CF, and Sweeney/Mackowiack in RF with Owens the first back up OFer if Crede's back acts up an Fields has to go to 3B or when Estad gets injured. Bob

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Jul 21, 2007 -> 06:17 PM) No, not really -- it's because Floyd has nothing left to do at AAA. He can get AAA hitters out. I want to find out if he can get big league hitters out. And let's not get into the Gavin Floyd "mentality" discussion. Everybody said Jon Garland was a mental midget when he first entered the league -- apparently he didn't punch enough lockers or throw enough water jugs when he had a bad outing. People didn't like that he maintained a calm demeanor win and lose, so they took that as him not caring. One difference is people said Galrand didn't care, but there are reports that Floyd doesn't have confidence in himself. The difference is if you go out there with a loser menatlity, odds are you're going to lose. There were never issues of Garland's confidence just his calm demeanor. Bob

QUOTE(SoxFan77 @ Jul 21, 2007 -> 05:36 PM) I agree on giving Floyd a shot.. but I can't see how this team is in contention with no farm, Old players not preforming and a high payroll right now. I guess I'm trying to be optimistic. Some don't like much negativity. Truth be told, with the $84 mill guaranteed to the 13 players next year and the fact taht they have 9 holes (I'm not exaggerating) to fill next year with hopefully at least $16 mill and no farm system pretty much puts this team up a creek without a paddle. If they sign Dye toa n $8-10 mill per year contract, it gives them that much less to spend on that crappy bullpen, a SS, etc. Barring any trades, I can tell you what I think they may do with the OF next year, but most won't like it. Bob

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jul 21, 2007 -> 12:58 PM) Seriously, what in the world is the harm of giving Gavin Floyd the next 2 months to see if he can't start adapting into a real big league pitcher? I see no harm in it. Too put it nicely, I don't think Floyd will show much, but I'd give him a shot now rather then next year when we are in contention. Bob

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Jul 8, 2007 -> 11:49 PM) Kenny saying "buyer's mode" is different than a GM like Omar Minaya saying the Mets are in "buyers mode". I'm taking this to mean that if (or, more appropriatey, when) Kenny trades Dye, Iguchi and/or Contreras, he's looking for young players who can step in and play within the next year. I think he feels that he's built up a strong enough rotation to where the Sox won't have to go through a total "rebuilding" mode, so he wants guys like Richar who, at the very least, will be competing for a spot in 2008. I don't take this to mean the Sox will be offering Gio Gonzalez and Ryan Sweeney for Ken Griffey in an effort to save 2007. I hope not. With KW, you never know. He has that football mentality of it not being over until the math says so. Baseball is different. The Sox season is essentially over. I hope KW is smart and trades the FA's who can help us next year. Bob

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Jul 8, 2007 -> 01:23 PM) There were people talking about sending Buerhle to the cubs. Yikes. The only thing worse from a PR standpoint from not signing a guy to a below market deal, would be to send them to the cubs and help them in their playoff endeavors. Dye for Murton and a prospect. I am all over that though. Really??? It better be a good prospect. Because Rogers idea reminds of the idiot Cub fan who called a radio show who suggested the Cubs send Jones and Izturis over for Buehrle. Bob

QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Jul 6, 2007 -> 12:04 AM) Buehrle wants to stay in Chicago. That's the reason for the full no trade clause. He will not accept a limited NTC. If there is any leverage in this deal at all, it's towards Buehrle's side. He's already given up a year and $19 mill in salary for the Sox; he will not give up any more. It's absolutely up to KW right now to either crack and give the full no trade clause, or for him to trade him while receiving less value. But wouldn't the extra year + extra money make giving up a NTC bearable. He could just as easily get traded if he signs with another team and that team goes to the crapper. The only way the Sox would trade Buehrle is if they suck. And I wold thinkg Buehrle wouldn't want to be on a sucky team anyway. Now he gets fairly compensated to get into a better position. I think the idea is a compromise. If I were the Sox I would give him the full NTC, but I'm not. I won't argue what the Sox are doing is ridiculous. As a fan, I want there to be resolution, preferably with MB in a Sox uniform. My idea at least prevents MB from signing a cheap contract and then getting traded to a team he doens't like. At least he'll giveu p his hometown discount in a trade and can rule out 10 teams right away. Bob

QUOTE(Milkman delivers @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 12:01 PM) The question is not how far. The question is, do you possess the constitution, the depth of faith, to go as far as is needed? KW doesn't. It should be done though, especially if they can't sign Buerhle. Bob QUOTE(thedoctor @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 10:52 AM) reading a lot of these threads the past few days i've seen there seem to be varying opinions on how far this inevitable fire sale should reach. some are ready to deal anyone and everyone while others are focusing more on players who's contracts expire after this year. kw's remarks in the s-t today suggest he's more thinking of the latter approach, but what would you do? No sense going half way. The way this team is set up financially next year, it's going to be very difficult to trade just Buehrle, Dye, and Iguchi and expect to get enough prospects to fill all the gaping holes on this team. There are 2 scenarios: 1. The Sox sign Buerhle. If this is the case, definitely trade Contreras and see what you can get for Vazquez. The team filled a gaping hole at a below market price. 2. If Buehrle goes, then KW might as well unload the ship. Losing Buehrle creates yet another big hole. With all these holes being created, odds are we're going to suck since we'll get no help from the minors. The reality is that Garland and Vazquez have more trade value then Buerhle because of their contracts. The Sox should use it to their advantage. Either way Contreras should be trades. And why stop at starting pitching? I'd listen to offers for anyone and everyone, especially a guy like Thome. I love Jenks, but if a team wants to give up a lot for him, KW would be foolish not to listen. I hate to hinge all this on one player, but getting a player of Buehrle's caliber for a below market price is huge IMHO. I feel good about a rotation of Buehrle, Garland, Vazquez, Danks and a # 5 then I do about the same rotation minus Buehrle. Bob

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Jul 5, 2007 -> 10:24 PM) I think mostly everyone expects KW and JR will be the ones who'll have to save face here, but I actually think KW will really stick to his guns here on this one. So really I don't know what's going to happen here. All I know 56/4 for Buehrle in this market, is well a pretty good deal. I have an idea where both sides can win. It's time for KW to get creative. Buerhle has given up a lot in salary and # of years. The Sox give Buehrle the contract they agreed to with a limited NTC of a list of teams today that he won't play for. Odds are they're small market teams that won't trade for him anyway. The Sox and Buehrle also agree on an escalation in salary in teh contract if Buehrle is traded. Say that his salary automatically increases to $16-17 mill per year + a fifth year is added on the contract. This helps off set Buehrle's home town discount if traded. The reality is if the Sox suck the next couple of years (and that may be the case) and Buehrle is pitching well, teams won't shy away from the contract. Heck, there'd probably be 7-8 teams chasing him in the FA market offering him $17 mill per year for 5 years. Now Buehrle gets compensated to get traded to a contending team taht will have pursued him anyway this off season if the Sox don't re-sign him. Is this too logical? Bob

QUOTE(GreenSox @ Jul 5, 2007 -> 11:19 PM) Actually any of the signed pitchers - Garland or Vasquez - would likely bring a lot more than a rent of Buehrle Is it safe to assume that if the Sox don't re-sing Buehrle, they're better off looking to trade every starter except Jenks? With the money owed to some players on this team, letting Buehrle go creates a gaping hole that will cost a lot of $$$ to fill. If the Sox do keep Buehrle, I'd only trade COntreras and bult around a pretty damn good rotation. Of course knowing, KW he'll fine the middle ground. But the team has enough holes that can be filled by trading a Garland or Vazquez since they're under long term deals. Bob

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Jun 30, 2007 -> 01:31 AM) Terrible, just terrible. There just was no reason for all of this. It really is not that difficult to keep things under raps. If the Sox really wanted to, they could have kept all this behind closed doors, and none of this gets brought up. Instead, Sox fans have to sit through a week of updates on "BuehrleGate", and now it ends like this. Everyone already is disappointed in how this season went, why not just toss another log onto the fire, Kenny. Oh, and you won't give a NTC to Buehrle but you will to Count and Javy? Sorry, but that just can't be true. If it is, then this organization has way bigger problems then I thought. Is it possible the MLBPA made Buehrle ask for the NTC. Here's one theory I've heard discussed: The Sox and Buehrle have been negotiatin at least all week on this deal. Why would it take all week for the NTC to become an issue. Surely, when Buehrle's agent first contacted the Sox about him wanting to stay ehre, this point had to come up. NTC is a major part of any long term deal. If the Sox didnt' want to give him one, why not tell the agent right away. Instead Hahn and Berry fly to Tampa to negotiate. It wasn't until after this was reported that there was a rumor that the MLBPA wasn't happy with the deal since they didn't want to see a premier free agent sign for below market value. Maybe they applied enough pressure for Buerhle to come back now and ask for it, maybe after everything else in the contract was agreed to. We all know JR and KW's character. They don't belive in no trade clauses period. I think it wold be idiotic to think that all week this point wasn't brought up by Buerhle's camp. I can see Buerhle's agent saying something early in negotiations like: "Mark wants to stay and will sign for less as long as you give him a NTC." This isn't like they were negotiating perks like how many free tickets Buehrle gets per game to give away. We also know JR and KW are stubborn and if they felt that a deal was headed one direction then all of the sudden the BS from the union changes things, I can see them telling the union to screw it by not agreeing to it. All that being said, if I were the Sox, I'd at least give him a limited NTC as a sacrifice for passing up all that money. Either way, I don't think we're getting the whole story on the NTC. Bob