nitetrain8601

10-1 in favor of it.

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Nov 23, 2005 -> 03:55 PM) Removing Haigwood and Gonzalez from our system hurts our pitching status years from now. Confounding problems is within the next two years, nearly our entire rotation will be eligible for FA. Neither may have been pitching in 07 or 08, but by that time either they're regressing or on the brink of promotion. At 2008, either our payroll should be hovering around 95 million or there better be several prospects (both pitching and hitting) ready to contribute. It's going to become difficult finding the funds to keep our rotation entact. Honestly, I don't mind Thome--but I'm weary of our club handing over these particular prospects. Well I don't think Haigwood would've been anything with this team. As far as Gonzalez, he probably would've replaced Contreras if we didn't resign him after next year. With that said, KW will probably lock up the rotation when they're contracts are up. Basically KW is trying to win it all again next year.

QUOTE(Greg The Bull Luzinski @ Nov 23, 2005 -> 03:50 PM) Arow is a great defensive CF. However, I think he is a lot like Edmonds in that he makes SOME plays look tougher than they are. Still Rowand is probably in the top five defensive CFers in the game. Still, he is replaceable as much as I like him. Exactly. Great post.

I'll miss him. Thanks, but that's all you get from me Rowand.

We traded some depth, and killed 2 birds with one stone by getting a LH power at bat in the 3 hole. OMG though, we traded Rowand. We're soooooo going to finish in last place.

QUOTE(Jeckle2000 @ Nov 23, 2005 -> 03:21 PM) Seriously... Worst defense in the league.... Great defensive prospect... and we need defense.... Unless Ozzie and KW became retards in the last month Pierre won't be coming here... Maybe you should've taken Rowand44 for a new username when he offered it to you. Just because Rowand isn't on the team doesn't mean the defense will be the worst in the league. They won't even be the worst in their division. If Brian Anderson is our CF, then I'd say our defense is better considering he's a better defensive player and has a much stronger arm. So quit yo' b****in'!

I loved Gio. Damnit, I wish he wasn't included.

I'll miss Rowand, but I'll love having Jim Thome way more than I miss Aaron.

QUOTE(jphat007 @ Nov 23, 2005 -> 01:46 PM) Yah, but you can't go by numbers alone. They wanted a really good young pitcher and a pretty good first baseman type of player or somebody like Ryan. Bmac and Sweeney are probably the two highest of our prospects that fit that bill, so thats who they would have asked for. Not just 2 and 4. and it is close to 2 and 4 anyway. Bmac would be 1 and Sweeney would be probably close to 4 depending on who you ask. And Petit is not 1 because Lastings Milledge is in front of him. Then that would probably Gio Gonzalez and Sweeney.

QUOTE(CrimsonWeltall @ Nov 23, 2005 -> 12:51 PM) Of course the scarcity is manufactured, but making more XBOX360s is certainly a lot more involved than burning some WinXP cds and stuffing them in a box. That makes too much sense. NOOOO WAY is that a possibility.

QUOTE(jphat007 @ Nov 23, 2005 -> 12:36 PM) Jacobs + Petit + Salary for Delgado's whole deal = Good for the Mets Bmac + Sweeney for 1 year of Delgado = Incredibly bad for the White Sox Just because a trade is good for one team doesn't mean it would be a good trade for everyone. That's what I said for both Boston and NYM's deals. But you sit there and say "He thinks any trade not done by the White Sox is a horrible trade." Right, wtf are you talking about? The Mets gave up their 2 and 4 prospects in this deal IIRC. So it wouldn't be BMac and Sweeney. It would be Josh Fields and Brian Anderson if you go by Futuresox.com which is a pretty good site in terms of rating our prospects. That deal doesn't seem so bad at all.

I wouldn't trade Crede. I would venture to say that Crede saved our pitching from giving up more runs than Rowand did.

What are your majors?

I highly doubt that. I know SOSH has a huge following, but if you were to combine WSI, Soxtalk, and NSBB SOSH would be outnumbered big time.

QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Nov 21, 2005 -> 09:57 PM) This quote just proves you don't know what you're talking about. Rowand played shallower than any CFer in the history of USCF. I noted he was playing about 5 feet farther in this year as early as the second week of the season. It's the reason he was much better defensively this year. Before he was going back and waiting under the ball at the wall. When he moved closer, he was still able to get back on the ball, but was able to cover far more ground in front of him and in the gaps. But yeah, he just played farter back so nothing got over his head. :rolly: I value Rowand's defense, yes, but I don't think he's super human. I may be one of his biggest critics when it comes to his play at the plate. I have a very realistic view of his value. It varies from team to team. To the Yankees, he has less value than say Torri Hunter, but to the Fish, he has more. Why? salary. It's simple. The Marlins are looking to dump payroll. But a Rowand for Pierre trade saves them a minimal amount. Rowand+Marte+specs for Delgado unloads tons of money. I'm all for trading Rowand. 1) he's in demand. 2) Because he's locked up on the cheap, he's never likely to have a higher value. 3) there appears to be a replacement in Brian N Anderson waiting in the wings. 4) The Sox need to get value out of their system. I shall respond to this post tommorow. It's simply too long for me to read. Look, Remember the '01-02 Twins. They had a ton of OFers on the cusp of the Majors. Kielty, Mohr, Kubel, Restovich, Ford. They had Jones and Hunter locked up... They appeared to be in a position to acquire a few arms and make a real run at the title. Instead they hung onto those chips for too long, and found that they didn't have much value anymore. They would be in a much different position if they were looking to trade some of those guys at the beginning of '01 instead of playing is close to the vest and holding on to them all. You don't trade from your strength, to acquire more of the same. With Rowand, Anderson, Young, and even Podsednik and Owens to an extent. We have an abundance of speedy centerfield types. What we don't have is a left handed bat with power anywhere close to being ready to contribute on the major league level. So you package one of those 5 names with some pitching and you find that on the open market. Pierre for Rowand at best is trading a quater for 2 dimes, a nickel, and a penny. I'll read all of that later today. It's too early.

I have no problem with Bill as a backup. Think of it as upgrading our backups. Mueller > Blum, though Blum will forever be in White Sox history.

QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Nov 21, 2005 -> 07:16 PM) The quote you replied to cited ESPN saying Pierre was a great defender. My thoughts aren't based off ESPN's. His defense is good. Some people are so in love with Rowand that they think he demands a Delgado in a trade back when in reality, Rowand isn't that good. I'd say Pierre is a better overall ballplayer while being a little worse at defense, but still good enough. I'll take the better, more complete ballplayer over Rowand who just plays the wall close. Pierre could do that too and I bet his ZR would jump up like crazy.

QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Nov 21, 2005 -> 07:09 PM) Boston Doesn't have a GM! Who's making the deals over there? Gammons? Probably. I can't wait to see how Beckett handles being in Boston after suffering another blister on his finger during a game. Over/under on him having 3 blisters by the end of the first half.

QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Nov 21, 2005 -> 07:00 PM) ESPN also thinks Derek Jeter is the best defensive shortstop in the history of the game. What does ESPN have to do with the conversation?

QUOTE(JimH @ Nov 21, 2005 -> 06:31 PM) I can't say I've seen this guy play as much as Rowand but I've noticed he does have great range, at least in the games I've seen. Blasphemy

I dream of Scott Podsednik leading off a game with a single. Then Juan Pierre trying to bunt him over and in the process getting a INF single while he's at it. To cap it off, with no outs, they cause the pitcher so much stress after a double steal and Thome/Dye/Thomas drive them both in with one or two outs.

QUOTE(beck72 @ Nov 21, 2005 -> 05:55 PM) I don't know where you get your scouting report on Pierre's poor defense. But I'll take ESPN's view, after the 2004 season: "His defense remains a huge plus at spacious Pro Player Stadium. His range allowed the Marlins to get by with Miguel Cabrera and Jeff Conine flanking him for the first four months. Pierre's arm probably precludes him from Gold Glove consideration, but he never gives up on balls in the gap and makes his share of highlight catches. His resemblance to a young Mickey Rivers remains eerie." Exactly. It's laughable how people say his defense sucks or is considerably worse than Rowand's.

QUOTE(SleepyWhiteSox @ Nov 20, 2005 -> 10:37 PM) Green? Nope. Bledsoe was better overall in my Yahoo League than Brees and Bledsoe was playing the Lions.

s***, I benched him in favor of Drew Bledsoe.

QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Nov 20, 2005 -> 07:22 PM) This isn't what we should be arguing over. It should be whether the Sox will score more runs by upgrading their #2 position, where they posted a .276/.335/.422 line, or the #3 spot, where they managed just a .234/.296/.419. Only the Bay Area teams had less production from the #3 spot. There are much more pressing needs than "who should bat 2nd?" Kenny knows this. He ain't wasting his time appeasing Ozzie behind the scenes. He's going to do what's best for the club, and that's finding a LHed bat that can get on base and put the ball out of the yard. And why can't we do both? If Philly is willing to eat enough of Thome's contract, it's certainly doable.