nitetrain8601

QUOTE (fathom @ Oct 7, 2015 -> 10:15 PM) Absolutely there is. You have 3 potential aces on your roster for very cheap. Could be a long time before you get one pitcher as good as any of the big 3. It's not like sox have contracts that will cripple them the next 4 years. Who is out there to sign that's going to greatly improve your team? The Sox are at least 3 hitters away from being in any discussion.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Oct 7, 2015 -> 10:18 PM) Yeah there is, you'd be throwing away 4-5 seasons with no guarantees that you'll be any better off. It only makes sense if you are in a truly desperate situation, which despite all your wailing is not the case here. The thing is, there are no FAs out there. To get players that will help you, you are going to have to trade away that strong pitching which is the only strong aspect of this ballclub. They still will also have to find a way to dump LaRoche and trade Cabrera. On top of that, the season ticket list will dwindle even further next year and JR had to be convinced to pay what he did this year for a miserable failure. So in the end, even if JR was like "Fugg it, let's do this", the team needs to acquire the players via trade. Who are you going to acquire without trading your pitching? If you ask me, the Sox are in the same position as the Cubs were when Theo hopped on. Maybe only 3 keeps (2 for sure) and the rest was pretty damn trash.

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Oct 7, 2015 -> 08:50 PM) The thing with trading Quintana is your should get multiple top prospects back to fill multiple positions. The farm system is thin still and trading a bunch of prospects to get one bats is the wrong way of going. One bat is not going to fix the linup with to many holes. Plus those prospects listed are not going to get you a big bat that's needed. Agreed. Ideally, anyone you deal pitching wise is going to bring you back good hitting prospects or hitters who need a change of scenery and a prospect.

BTW, what the Sox need to do is stop performing patch work. They need to do a full on rebuild with someone other than Kenny and IMO, other than Hahn and their current scouts. Clean house, built it correct. Problem is, they've already taken like 2 or 3 years building it wrong. Any FAs you sign should be either cheap scrapheap guys or people you intend on flipping at the deadline. Stay the course regardless of what fans say. You have to. Otherwise, pull a Yankees and buy the best players either in trades or elsewhere. Trot out a lineup of: Eaton Cabrera Cespedes Gonzalez Abreu Frazier Kendrick Ramirez Castro

Hopefully the Cubs and Dodgers make it to the NLCS so I can watch Kershaw or Greinke dominate them.

QUOTE (VAfan @ Oct 6, 2015 -> 06:05 PM) If the Sox were to add two bats, for my money Cespedes and Frazier would make sense. Cespedes is not eligible for a qualifying offer, is Cuban, and has solid power numbers. Can he play right field? This is the question. But at least it's only a matter of money to acquire him. Frazier gives you a power hitting third baseman whose defensive WAR is at least positive. The question here is what would it take to land him in a trade? These additions would give you a preponderance of right handed power. But they would make a huge difference for the Sox lineup, which could probably hide LaRoche in a platoon, and get by with a weak bottom of the order. Eaton Abreu Cabrera Cespedes Frazier LaRoche/Thompson Ramirez Flowers Sanchez I think this is also a pipe dream, but I'd happily support it as long at Quintana isn't sacrificed for Frazier, because I have no objection to the Sox spending money. I like this plan, but I just don't like the batting order. I rather flip flop Cabrera and Abreu.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Oct 4, 2015 -> 09:55 PM) No, any moneyballer wouldn't, that's a ridiculous claim. There's a reason Sale is ranked #5 in Fangraphs' Trade Value column. Just because SP only pitch every 5 days doesn't mean they aren't as valuable as everyday position players. In fact, the top SP face more batters over the course of the season than the top hitters get PA. I disagree. No, they wouldn't take an everyday player like LaRoche over Sale since LaRoche is that bad and Sale is that great that even if he pitched one pitch every 5 days, he'd still be more valuable. But if you're comparing Arrenado and Sale, I think you'll see all of them take Nolan. I wonder what it would take to get Manny Machado.

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Oct 4, 2015 -> 09:55 PM) The Dodgers fans/hosts valuing Puig over Quintana just shows you how underrated Quintana still is. Puig also still has worldly potential and marketability if that counts for anything. To me, it'd be a pretty even trade if you did Q for Puig, but I just know, for the Dodgers, it isn't sexy enough especially when they got the money to get someone as good if not better than Q.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Oct 4, 2015 -> 08:10 PM) You honestly think we'd need to send prospects along with Quintana to acquire Frazier? You're vastly underrating him. He's young, left-handed, with a very cheap contract for many years, and he's solidified himself as a top 15 SP in baseball (at worst) and has been one of the most consistent pitchers in the game for more than 3 seasons now. You really think that couldn't get Todd Frazier? Also, I would take what people say on talk radio with a huge grain of salt. The common fan might not know how good Q is (IMO he's easily the most underrated player in the game), but I guarantee you GMs know how good he is. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/appreciating-jose-quintana/ I don't think I would do that trade(some trades simply don't make sense for both teams sometimes) from the Sox perspective or the Reds perspective unless there was another move lined up already.

QUOTE (SoxAce @ Oct 4, 2015 -> 09:12 PM) You are nuts if you think they are trading White, especially considering that is one of his guys/draft picks. I really didn't like the pick for the Bears when it was made. I thought it was pointless to trade Marshall, especially if you were going to draft White. And I also thought Cooper was much better and was the only WR in the draft who made sense for the Bears if they were going to do that.

It'd be wise for the Bears to sell the farm. Young wants out? Great. I'd deal any and everybody, especially Martellus, Forte and Alshon. Wasn't a huge fan of Kevin White or trading Brandon Marshall in the first place from a football perspective, but I'd trade White if he had some value. Everyone must go.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Oct 4, 2015 -> 07:52 PM) This is how you're trying to get a read on Q's trade value? LA talk radio?! I'll look at LA talk radio and Dodger/Angel forums to familiarize myself on what an organization and its fans think of their prospects. It's no different than me going on Soxtalk and listening to Waddle & Silvy. Let's put it this way, a team like the Dodgers rather just sign David Price and keep Seager than deal him for Sale or an ace of his stature which is why they didn't go make the trade for David Price during the deadline.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Sep 8, 2015 -> 01:29 PM) Chris Sale >>>> Nolan Arenado. Sorry, that's not homerism, that's just fact. In my scenario, Quintana would net us Arenado who is a free agent in 2020. That is a Puig like return because he is a GG 3B, which are so rare to find. I trust the Sox with their pitching, that's why I could trade Q for this type of player. Eh, I'll take an everyday player who is 24, plays a good 3B and rakes over a 26 year old stud pitcher who plays only once every 5 days. Any moneyballer would too. I would say it is homerism. Now, I wouldn't deal Sale for anything short of an Arrenado level player.

QUOTE (Lillian @ Oct 4, 2015 -> 06:50 PM) If it were actually possible to acquire Davis, he would be the DH. "Where would LaRoche play?" How about the bench. Does anyone actually believe that the Sox could be competitive with La Roche in the middle of the lineup? To me, he is the single biggest reason this season was such a disaster, in view of all the low scoring games, in which the Sox came up short, with him batting (striking out) right in the heart of the order. He'll probably be even worse next year, when he'll be 36. The front office has to accept that they have one more year of a sunken cost in La Roche. He simply cannot be the DH. If he were a middle infielder, who hit like that you might be willing to live with it, but not a middle of the order DH!!!! Regarding the remark about Eaton. I love him, and admire what he has accomplished. He is the prototypical "overachiever". However, I wouldn't consider him worth big money. He's contract is a bargain. Advocates of Heyward are talking serious money. Moreover, if you can acquire a potent bat to DH, many of those holes become less important. They don't need above average players at every position, with their starting pitching. I think the Sox need to improve everywhere possible minus maybe pitching and first base. So if someone like LaRoche or Alexei or Eaton need to go to the bench or change positions, so be it. This team is both bad offensively and defensively.

QUOTE (Dunt @ Oct 4, 2015 -> 06:45 PM) Q is worth more than both Frazier and Puig I hope there's reports of the Sox going after both so that you can see, his value isn't as high as you or many people here like to think he is. To expand a bit as well, on talk radio here in LA, someone even brought up trading Puig for Quintana and they said not without another prospect or young hitting MLBer. When prospects were brought up, everyone said no to Seager or Urias for Quintana (they also talked about 4 other players as well). This was before the Dodgers got Latos and Wood.

QUOTE (AustinIllini @ Oct 4, 2015 -> 09:15 AM) This is really smaller picture. The reality is, I don't want Mike Thomas hiring another coach. Illinois would be wise to fire him first. I don't trust him either. Ironically though, they're going to need a dirty AD to turn this around. I don't see the football or basketball programs getting turned around without a guy like Butch Davis coaching football and basketball competing with the Coach K and Calipari's of the world. Until they're willing to do that, Illinois' sports programs look dead.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Oct 4, 2015 -> 09:56 AM) And the year before that it was Q for Jason Castro. Q, for whatever reason, is still undervalued on this board. I just don't get it. As for Frazier. Cannot say I like the idea of trading for yet another player heading into their last season before free agency. No thanks. Q is slightly overrated by anyone who thinks he can be the main guy in a deal for Seager or Arenado. Both guys are going to command Chris Sale or Q and a s***load of good prospects. The best you can get for Q is either going to be Frazier or Yasiel Puig (which you'd still send some middling prospects).

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Oct 3, 2015 -> 03:07 PM) Just give me Heyward. Then move Q in a blockbuster for Arenado. Then add a SP in FA. Q won't happen straight up for Arenado. Sox would have to send 2 or 3 prospects with Q. It would take Sale for Colorado to sell Arenado. He's that damn good at a premium position.

One of the most overrated players by Sox fans. He was a good pitcher, but not 1st or 2nd ballot HOF like some people around here used to make you think the way they talked about him. Had a cool personality though. I think Toronto could use him in the bullpen for the playoffs as a long reliever. Just in case one of their guys gets in trouble, they won't have to burn their bullpen.

I do remember the knock on Rodgers being he's a Tedford QB.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Sep 25, 2015 -> 06:50 PM) Even if he's peaked he'll be easily worth his contract. But his power numbers and baserunning value are significantly better than last year. The argument I'm making isn't is he worth his contract. He is, and I'm happy with him as an individual player. At the same time, the overall hitting on this team sucks. He's been playing CF and pretty good at it. I think he's peaked, you maybe don't. I'd trade him unless the Sox plan on bringing in a lot more legitimate players with him which it doesn't sound like they plan on doing. QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Sep 25, 2015 -> 07:37 PM) You're just wrong on so many levels. If you want to package him, package him for what? Trading him would make Abreu the only one on offense that is worth a damn right now. Sox have a rotation you can win with right now, just a matter of finding the right offensive players to go along with that. Eaton is definitely in that discussion. With 9 games left in the season, Eaton has tied his doubles from last year, 1 less triple, 12 more HRs, more RBIs, SBs the same, more walks, more strikeouts (negative), lower average (.283), lower OBP (356), higher ops. If you want Trayce in the lineup and move Eaton to LF then I could do that, but flat out trading him on a team friendly contract is just wrong. You want Adam Eaton in your lineup, you can win with him. Only thing I agree with you is that his defense has regressed this year, but was great last year. Give him a 3rd year to see how it goes. You trade him for a position of need. That's what you do in all trades. Seriously, you trade something to get something. I would love to trade Danks and turn him into Trout, but that ain't happening. Instead, you can trade Eaton for someone in the infield (hell, you need all positions but one). That's just one idea. QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 25, 2015 -> 09:32 PM) He's still young. Why has he peaked? His defense has gone down. His average and OBP have gone down. He k's more. You have more or less seen the best of him. Not saying his peak won't last longer than a year or 3. I'm just saying I don't think he's going to improve dramatically anywhere.

Ownership needs to change or at least change their philosophy to be committed to winning more than that committed to friendships and loyalty.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Sep 25, 2015 -> 05:10 PM) Eaton has very good minor league numbers too, it's not like he's come out of nowhere. I'm not sure why you think he's peaked. Has he showed vast improvement from one year to the next? Not really. In fact, you can argue his defense has gotten worse.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Sep 25, 2015 -> 05:46 PM) That makes zero sense. Makes perfect sense, especially if you think Eaton has peaked, which I do. I don't like him long term for this team unless we decide to sign a bunch of boppers.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Sep 25, 2015 -> 10:17 AM) If you trade your above average players that are locked up to team-friendly, sub-market, pre-free agency extensions, you will ALWAYS be rebuilding. Which is what the Sox should be doing. Eaton is hardly someone you should build around offensively or defensively. He can't carry you in either aspect. For a team looking to contend, he's the right player as one of the missing pieces. As a team so far away like the Sox, he should be the top of your trade block. Maybe Trayce isn't that good, maybe he is. Point is, you pet him play and find out what you have with him while some team overpays for Eaton.