rowand's rowdies

Q and Nate Jones for Schwarber, Baez and Happ + (Cease or Underwood) work for everyone? Would you have a problem trading with the Cubs? It wouldn't feel good helping the Cubs out with Q and Jones but that haul would be exactly what we need. Yo to CF, Baez & Happ at 2B/3B Anderson at SS, Schwarber at DH leave Abreu at 1B. We find ourselves a Catcher and corner OFs and half our pitching prospects turn out well we're locked and loaded for 2019 and fun to watch until then.

All this hot stove talk has me interested in a game for pc. I used to have one 3-4 years ago and it was entertaining enough for $20 or whatever it cost. I see OOTP Baseball costs only $9.99 (probably because it was released in March of 2016. How was it? Do rosters update or is that the reason you need to buy OOTP Baseball 2018 in April?

Just saw Matt Adams is available. Without knowing their values too much, what about more MLB ready hitting talent like Adams & Grichuk? Pair those two with Reyes for Q? Maybe we throw in Melky? Am I way off base?

Good news is we won't have to cheer for losses they will just happen in the competitive AL. In the NL there are too many bad teams who have to play each other too often to really add up. Should have an edge up as far as a harder schedule than the other top spot contenders.

I agree with Rick trying to maximize value out of each player by not bunching them up, but if the Rockies offer Rodgers, Tapia, Murphy © and Dahl do we throw Q Abreu Robertson and maybe even Jones or Shields their way? Would they ever give up that much? Maybe some combination of those 4 for Q and Abreu?

I like it. No reason to compete right now. 1) Not close 2) AL is stacked 3) Cubs are loaded & Champs Take some lumps until the balance shifts towards the NL in a few years and we can reasonably compete in the AL. Imagine yourself 9 months ago during the Drake LaRoache saga. You got all these guys for just Sale & Eaton. Wow.

Since we have some $ to spend and Todd has been with young rebuilding teams I don't see why we don't sign him to a 5/90 deal and lock up 3B. We still can spend $ when it's worth it regardless of rebuild or contending. Todd seems like a solid teammate and 3B who can hit 40 HRs and field well don't grow on trees. I imagine he can transition to 1B or DH if his fielding declines. I realize YO might play 3B.

Can anyone profile these players being featured in the Nats & Red Sox deals? Some of us haven't really seen them play much if at all. Who do they remind you of as far as current or former MLB players?

We're at a pretty low point in White Sox history. We've had 11 seasons since we won the World Series. The Cubs just won it all. Our team looks to be going into a partial or full rebuild, which a lot of fans want to see. We have a unique situation because of the trade chips we have this off-season. We should also have some guys who can rebuild their value and be traded in season as well for potentially solid prospects/younger players. We have enough quality trade chips to really bring in a whole new team if we choose. 4 or 5 of our players could bring back 15-20 (no joke) prospects, many of which would be Top 10 prospects from other teams. If we traded Sale, Q, Shields, Abreu, Eaton, Jones & Frazier this off-season and traded Robertson & Melky during the season we could potentially net 20-30 new prospects/young players from those 9 players alone. This is unlikely to happen but could actually realistically happen. But who will play if we trade everyone you wisely ask? Ask the Phillies, Brewers, Reds, or 4-5 other NL teams last year. They found a way to play with no name players for 162 miserable games. It happens now. Before we hand the mic over to Jerry Kenny & Rick to hear their 3 man karaoke version of Don't Stop Believing with this roster, I would like to hear about your personal perspectives on what TYPE of team we should try to build if we go into a rebuild. What STYLE of baseball do you believe is the way to go in 2017 & beyond? If you personally believe we are just some fixes short of being competitive, what BRAND of players do we need to bring in and which current players need to go? I think this thread will allow us to dig deep and think about how we view the game itself and how we want to see baseball played by our White Sox. It's better than another Chris Sale thread, no? Obviously I'd like to see this team's offense and defense built in the likeness of this organization's minor league outfield and baserunning instructor. Starting pitching wise we should build around Q & Rodon. I'm really becoming a believer in bullpens. I wouldn't invest $100 million in a Chapman or Jansen, but loading up on high ceiling power arms who can be groomed for 1-3 innings instead of pushing them to become starters. Now for brighter baseball minds to chime in on their vision...

Great piece of hitting by AJAX, one of the top 3 worst throws I've ever seen in a MLB game that wasn't raining. Nice catch Eaton! Quick story on this terrible ballpark: I went there in 2006 for an OAK vs DET game. It was then (and can't imagine now) the dirtiest, scummiest, worst ballpark I've ever been to in my life. Wearing a silver & black White Sox jacket, I was ridiculed by numerous fans for being an Oakland Raiders fan (which I wasn't, the jacket was sort of Raiders colors, but clearly a White Sox jacket). This was in the stadium where the Oakland Raiders play their home games. The fans were trash, the stadium was trash, the parking lot was trash, and the field is trash. They can't even do home runs right, there are lines and walls everywhere. No one attends and their new stadium can't come fast enough, although I'd be more than happy to see Portland or Las Vegas get a team. Keep dealing Rodon.

I doubt the interpreters have even bothered to tell the Latin players any of this nonsense. They couldn't even fathom how ridiculous this is. Some of them defected from their own country to have a shot to play this game at this level and many have family back in where rich people's family members are sometimes kidnapped for ransom. How can they even sympathize at all with LaRoache? This story just needs to go away. Eaton and Sale need to stop fanning the flames. The truth will come out in time.

Remember when people were saying last year we couldn't sit LaRoache against lefties because of some handshake agreement? It's time for some accountability. The Dunn mistake and playoff drough was bad enough. The White Sox aren't wrong to make this adjustment, they just made a huge mistake signing Laroche in the first place. LaRoaChe is obviously not a good teammate and more concerned with himself getting his way 100% over the team's objective to win. That might now be the leading free agency signing in terms of handshake deals. At least 2 that we've heard of...so far.

I'm sure he's a great guy and all but this is a huge opportunity for the team to improve. Crazy to think Robin let the guys try to talk him out of it. It is best for all parties, pretty much no matter the cause of it is.

I'll wait for confirmation, but wow. Good for everyone. He must have enough $$$. Now...who's looking to dump some salary?

Unless the Royals can opt out after year 2, which it does not sound like, this is an absolutely horrible signing. It still would be pretty bad at 2 years/ $28 million guaranteed. Especially losing the #24 pick. He's a #3 or #4 in the NL, on his better days. I don't care what the market or revenues are doing to contracts, this is an atrocious waste and I'm glad KC is the culprit. I don't think I would trade the #24 overall pick for Ian Kennedy straight up, unless he was making under $6 million per season for only 1-2 seasons. In that case you are still mortgaging the future and he could be finished any time. He is really that bad. I can't wait to face him 2-5 times instead of Chen or Guthrie. Go Sox.

Omar just mentioned the DBacks not being a part of the Upton and Cespedes sweepstakes. That brings up a good point. The DBacks are obviously all in with the Greinke signing and Miller trade. Why aren't they considering bringing back one of the more popular players in team history to help that offense? They have some solid OFs, obviously, but still. I lived in AZ the entire time he played there. They had a spot in the OF seats called "Up Town". He was for a few of those seasons of one the few bright spots on that team. You have to ask yourself, especially with them only having to give up a 2nd or 3rd rd pick and $ they have because of that gigantic TV contract, why don't they bring back Upton? In parts of 6 seasons with the team, he played 731 games and had over 3,000 plate appearances (3,030). He was drafted as a young kid and became a MVP candidate in his prime with that organization. Why haven't we ever heard about them considering him? #RedFlag EDIT - I realize this is a Cespedes thread, but the Upton thread is too far down now, so this is a vote for Cespedes! #CespedesOrNada

Sorry, signing them to long term contracts like they are asking for is probably not the answer so Rick wants an out because we currently could use their services as they are an upgrade over our current options. Posting on this site is really miserable. Every post is followed by a jerkoff comment. So much for adding something to a stale conversation.

Nick Cafardo of the Boston Globe says Alex Gordon wants to stay in KC but realizes they won't pay up. He also mentions Upton's market is slow because teams are worried about his effort and lack of passion. At least with Cespedes you don't lose a draft pick, although he might get the most $ and years. I'm beginning to think that none of the big 3 are the answer for our White Sox. I think Rick knows that and is probably pushing for mutual opt out clauses after a few years if he is going to sign any of them.

If they can make the big splash getting one of the 3 big OF names, they may have to run Avi out at DH vs LHP and LaRoache against RHP. Gives them both the biggest chance to succeed (not a good chance, but still) and rebuild trade value (of which they have little (Avi) to none/negative (LaRoache). Hit them 6th or 7th, it's not going to make or break this team in the 1st 40-81 games if we add Upton, Cespedes or Gordon. Maybe some of these QO guys like Fowler and D Murphy don't sign during the offseason, stay fresh and ready until after the draft. They can always pick the best situation for them in June after injuries happen and standings start to take shape. I wonder if this will start to happen more? Morales was one of the 1st to do this, no? Maybe Avi and/or LaRoache has some trade value by then? Trade them to restock the bottom of our system or clear $$$ (even if it's low level talent or some $$$) and sign someone like Fowler or D Murphy to play OF or DH, move Melky accordingly and go for it hard the rest of the season. It would be a ballsy move for sure, but crazier things have happened. It's pretty clear by now no one is going to give us anything or real value for those 2 right now, so best to try to rebuild value. If they both continue to be unplayable for very long, it's off to AAA for Avi and the street for LaRoache. DH isn't exactly the hardest position to fill, neither is corner OF. We have a DH ready, hurting us in the OF (Melky). I think Rick can fix this, he's just going to have to play it depending on the market, QO Free agents and how things develop with this team in Spring Training and the first 40 games. He can't trade LaRoache and Avi right now apparently, and he can't spend more than he can spend. All in all, at least things are looking up again on the South Side. What I've proposed isn't likely, but it is likely somewhere between Plan D-Z for our White Sox. Merry Christmas everyone.

Am I crazy to think about buying low on Big Game James Shields? Word is Padres are looking to move him. 3 years $63 Million left. Even crazier, what if instead of lower level prospects or eating $ we just send the Padres back a NL calibur starting pitcher in Johnny Danks and his 1/$13, a 1B rental who can be flipped if he has a decent year in Laroache and his 1/$13. What prospects would it take to make that work? Would cost the Padres an extra $5 million in 2016 but saves them $42 Million between 2017 and 2018. Meanwhile the White Sox can afford that contract for an AL caliber (excluding 2015, I know) pitcher, albeit an aging and declining one. Would give the White Sox time to move Fulmer slowly, not have to depend on Erik Johnson to be more than a #5, and some real SP balance and depth for the next 3 years. Then you can work on the offense, I'm still not for trading Q in that scenario. This is just a fun suggestion, it's the off-season. Have fun with it or ignore it, not meant to be taken too seriously.

What if we double down on our rotation while we continue to search for offense? Keep Q, Sale, Danks, Rodon & Fulmer. Add Shelby Miller, let Fulmer spend 2016 in AAA. Add some camp invite guys for SP depth. Would Erik Johnson, Montas, Micah Johnson & Tyler Danish get it done for Miller? Maybe get an infield prospect back as well? Would those assets be better used to get offense? Or do you like Miller enough with 3 seasons of control left? Would it take Fulmer & Adams to get him? Would you do it if it did? It's not like there are a plethora of options like Miller available via any means. I don't like Tyson Ross as an AL SP. He has a hard enough time staying mediocre pitching in SD and vs the NL West.

This is a move I love seeing as a White Sox fan. Let Detoliet sign an older overpriced overrated NL SP from a team that stole theirs, a real AL SP Stud in Scherzer. If they had this $$$ to throw at a guy who to me is an AL #3 or #4 SP at his best, why not splurge and keep Max? Enjoy this deal Tigers fans. You're paying Verlander, Sanchez & Zimmerman a combined $66 million to pitch in 2016. Their 2 best SPs may end up being Norris and Boyd, 2 guys that don't combine for $2 million in 2016! If the Tigers want to add that 2nd #2 Tier Free Agent SP like Cueto, be my guest. Maybe they can spend $90 million a year on 4 overrated starting pitchers that best fit in the National League?

...and you people said the game changing move of the off-season wouldn't happen until December...

I think the Astros match up nicely with us. If they send us 2 solid young bats, I'm ready to see D Rob in an Astros uniform. Otherwise, I don't mind seeing him dominate half the time he goes out there.

Even a child knows when there is a turd in the toliet, you flush it. We have solid starting pitching and to some extent a solid bullpen. Add a few low risk low cost arms to compete for both and otherwise don't touch them. If you can trade Danks without eating much $, of course go ahead, but otherwise let it play out and hope the lottery ticket prospect we get for him at the trade deadline becomes a cult hero. The offense & defense of this team are a joke. We have Abreu, a RH cleanup hitter who can play a decent 1B or DH. We have Eaton, a solid leadoff hitter and OK CF. We have the ace's pet Flowers who I am actually fine with as a backup catcher who catches for Chris. We have a couple utility grade infielders in Saladino and Sanchez. We have a guy that might be an OK 4th OF in Trayce Thompson. That's it. Trade the rest for what you can. If you don't want to sell low on those guys then I suggest reading up on the "Sunken Cost Fallacy" and improve your own life in the process. A sunk cost is exactly that. Don't sink future cost into a lost cause. This offseason should be about bringing in the 10-12 best options we can to try out for our many open positions - C, 1B, 2B, SS, 3B, RF, LF, OF. Focus on guys who can play defense AND hit. Bring in a new attitude & culture. Let's do this!