NorthSideSox72

QUOTE(Dick Allen @ Jul 5, 2007 -> 02:06 PM) Phillies fans must be laughing that White Sox fans are excited to see Gavin Floyd pitch. Although when he was with the Phillies, White Sox fans would have been excited to see him pitch against the White Sox. I don't think any of them are laughing. I talked to one the other day. Its pretty much universally accepted that the Sox fleeced the Phillies in that trade, even if Floyd never becomes anything great.

QUOTE(WHITESOXRANDY @ Jul 5, 2007 -> 12:58 PM) I can't see the White Sox having any chance of finishing ahead of Detroit, Cleveland and the Twins anytime in the next 5 years so I would take the fire sale all the way - trading everybody before next season that makes a $ 1 mil. and Jenks also, since he would bring some good value back. I would trade our players not for the most prospects but for the best ones. I wouldn't be very interested in draft picks since the Sox suck at picking them and don't like to sign them. I'd be happy to come out and watch Danks, Floyd, Gio, Fields, Sweeney, Anderson, Richar and about 12 more like them. This team is bad right now, but you are telling me there is no chance this team finishes above 4th in the next 5 years? I don't think you could say that about ANY team, let alone one with this much talent.

I was at the game last night. I cannot remember seeing a game previously where there were 6 errors and couple PB/WP's. That was just terrible. On the other hand, if we win tonight, we split the series, and that's something acceptable at this point.

QUOTE(BearSox @ Jul 5, 2007 -> 12:48 PM) The guy is 6'2" and weighs 230 I really don't understand why people use height and weight as measures of talent or potential in baseball. I'm 6'3" and 230-ish, but the folks who played for the ST softball team last month will tell you I'm not exactly ready for the big club.

QUOTE(whitesoxfan101 @ Jul 5, 2007 -> 12:08 PM) Lin with another strong outing last night.... http://www.tricities.com/tristate/tri/spor...07-05-0010.html Bristol won 14-1, btw. Jeez, he finally gave up a run (in his 4th game). He must be losing his stuff.

QUOTE(Cerbaho-WG @ Jul 5, 2007 -> 10:29 AM) Vazquez is on the 40-man while Wassermann is not. That being said, calling up Vazquez would be asinine. He's walked 22 batters in 33.1 innings in Charlotte and had an ERA of 5 last month. It doesn't matter anyways since Day seems to be healthy once again and will probably be activated from the DL on Saturday after Gavin pitches his part of the doubleheader. OK, that makes sense (about the 40-man). Unless the 40-man is reduced during the upcoming flurry of transactions.

QUOTE(jackie hayes @ Jul 4, 2007 -> 03:26 PM) As it is July 4, I think it is an appropriate time for Democrats to stop and reflect on our nation and its ideals. For over 200 years, the United States has persevered, as a beacon of liberty to all those outside the country, as a refuge for those who suffer from persecution, political and religious, abroad, as a place of economic opportunity, as a champion of equality and democracy, as an idea. So now on this our country's birthday, when we celebrate the willing of our independence by the immortal words of Thomas Jefferson, I ask you this one question, Democrats. Why do you hate America?

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Jul 5, 2007 -> 02:30 AM) Wasserman isn't the answer. Just curious... why not? Seems like the guy has been lights out at every level he has pitched at from low A ball up to AAA, and we could use him in Aardsma's spot. If we are going to experiment with the spot anyway, why not Ehren?

QUOTE(dasox24 @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 05:05 PM) Yeah, actually, I wrote a nice little article about Wasserman for FutureSox about 2 summers ago. However, I tried finding it and I can't. And after watching the Sox' pen last night, I am thinking the big club could use him. I couldn't find an AAP page for him either, I was considering picking him up myself.

QUOTE(dasox24 @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 01:34 PM) If Wassermann were to ever make it to the bigs, it would be quite a story going from just showing up at an open tryout in which only a few guys (out of a couple hundred) were signed to pitching in the majors. He couldn't do worse than Bukvich, right? Check out his Baseball Cube page - he seems like an interesting story. Very pedestrian college numbers, undrafted, try-out to make the team... and his numbers at every minor league level above Rookie ball have been fantastic.

Some play-by-play from discussions about a certain sleazy CEO in the Buster... QUOTE(Steff @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 10:09 AM) The heart wants what the heart wants. QUOTE(SleepyWhiteSox @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 01:31 PM) That isn't always the intention when a boss and employee are having sex... QUOTE(Steff @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 01:50 PM) You are correct. What the penis and vagina want, is usually what the penis and vagina get.

QUOTE(kapkomet @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 01:24 PM) Actually, at the heart of it all, I agree with you all as well. However, it is EXPRESSLY in the Constitution, so there are reasons that this was put in. I'll see if I can come up with some research to see why, because now I'm curious. I think perhaps the legislature was seen as having more teeth when it came to going after rogue executive branchers. They do have powers that can be equated to arrest and trial, just under different guise. But nowadays, those powers seem minimized, either in perception or practice.

QUOTE(Steff @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 01:25 PM) Fans continuing to pay for a s***ty product because the park is pretty and the neighborhood is building up... Sounds like the fans of some other team.... It does. But it doesn't change the reality - they exist, even in Sox fandom. This site doesn't tend to attract a lot of casual fans - more superfans. So sometimes its easy to forget that they are part of those attendance numbers.

QUOTE(Steff @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 01:14 PM) It took a World Series to get fans to open their checkbooks... To think that they will CONTINUE to pay when it's obvious that the team is NOT going back to the World Series any time soon... IMO is simply not realistic. And there's 20+ years of back up to prove it. Last year there were nearly 30K st holders. This year I believe it's mid 20's. That waiting list was over 4K long at one point and it's all gone. I think the fans are clear on what they think about buying anymore season tickets. I think the assumption you make is that the team winning and winning now is the only thing drawing fans. While it is the single biggest reason, its not the only one. The park, for example, is looked at much more favorably now than it was. That, for some folks, is huge. Also, the neighborhood is changing, and that too will have a positive effect going forward. So will the new Metra station. Its also a battle for the casual fan - the ones who don't really care about either Chicago team much, but who wouldn't have thought of coming to the south side to see a game until 2005. Now, having seen the park and enjoyed it, they are likely to return, even if the team isn't so hot. We are very focused on team performance here, but there are other dynamics at work too. If the ST base this year is, for example, 24k... I'd bet it stays above 20k next year.

QUOTE(Greg The Bull Luzinski @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 12:46 PM) The only everyday/opening day players that I am sure will be back are A.J., Konerko, and Thome. Beyond that, the 2008 White Sox will be a very different team. I think either Uribe OR Iguchi will be back, but not both. And I think its Fields or Crede at 3B, so those are sort of in-house. The whole outfield, though, might be gone - or 2/3 of it anyway. And one of the middle infielders. That is 3 or 4 of the starting 9. But the starting staff will probably see only one turnover for Opening Day 2008 - Contreras' slot (likely to Floyd). Some of the bullpen is set too - Jenks, Logan and Massett are all going to be there I'd bet. Thornton too, most likely. So just a couple bullpen slots. The bench may change wholesale, other than Hall. Out of 25 on the roster, my over/under for new faces on 4/1/08 is 10 (plus Fields maybe, not sure he is really a new face). New faces to include guys in our system as well, like Sweeney or Richar. Outside faces, people who aren't in the org now - I'll say 67, but mostly on the bench or in the bullpen.

QUOTE(Steff @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 01:04 PM) Not anymore they aren't. Those several thousand names on that waiting list at the start of the year... all gone. So let's say there is no waiting list right now. Season ticket base is in the low 20's somewhere, as I recall. That alone is big, when one considers that for decades, this team had average attendance numbers well below that. There maybe a dropoff next year, but it won't be an enormous one, I'd guess. I just don't see it going back to pre-2005 levels anytime soon, unless this team is really bad for a few more years. I think the WS, and the general winning attitude for the club during this decade has drawn a lot of new fans, and not all of them will abandon ship.

QUOTE(Steff @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 12:59 PM) You're not wrong. The investment group has been doing the same thing for 20 years and stayed out of the red. I suspect they will stay status quo and not try to fix what isn't broke. Some good news might be that this year's ticket revenue (sale profit mainly) is for the most part used in projecting next years budget. So the payroll "cut" might not be much of a cut at all. And before I forget, I agree with you about signing both Mark and Jon to similar deals. Not a snowball's chance in hell. I am not so sure. I think KW likes the idea of a Braves-like pitching-based program. I think he wants to avoid full NTC's so that he has flexibility - but I don't think its his A-plan to get rid of JG or MB. I think he wants them as his anchors for quite a while.

QUOTE(iamshack @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 12:27 PM) Well, keep in mind that two things were driving last night's attendance: 1) pre-sold season tickets; and 2) the possibility of it being Mark's final start on the southside. The fact that it is season holders is exactly what I am talking about. People are buying tickets, seasons particularly.

QUOTE(WCSox @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 12:13 PM) When in the past have the Sox spent $56 million on ONE pitcher? Sorry, but I think there's no way in hell that they commit $100 million to two players. Years ago, I would have agreed. But right now, I think they would do it if the deals were right. Why, you ask? Here is why... Attendance at last night's game, a Monday night against the mighty Orioles: 35000+ Even 2 years after the WS, and with the team playing like crap... people show up. As long as the attendance stays up, which it looks like it will, and the money keeps flowing in... this club will spend the money. Especially on young pitching talent. It wasn't more than a few years back that there were only 4 games a year where they drew 35k - 3 Cubs games and Opening Day.

QUOTE(StrangeSox @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 12:16 PM) Kinda like how Republicans keep b****ing about Clinton's BJ and pardons for the last 6-8 years? It seems to me that giving the President the ability to pardon people at will distorts the checks and balances -- why should the president have this power, especially if those he is pardoning/ commuting are directly linked to him? It seems like its just something that is only ever abused and never really used for a good cause. Like I said earlier... if a person is prosecuted for a crime commited while part of the executive branch of government, the executive power to pardon or commute should be nullified. That would seem to be ideal.

QUOTE(kapkomet @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 12:14 PM) And now it's the good 'ole US of A's fault the electricity isn't on. Yes. Yes it is. Last I checked, we invaded a country. You invade it, you own it, until someone can take over from you. And that generally takes a whole lot of years.

QUOTE(Milkman delivers @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 12:01 PM) The question is not how far. The question is, do you possess the constitution, the depth of faith, to go as far as is needed? That was dramatic. Sounds like a line from a movie. Anyway, I don't think this team needs to be fire-saled (new word). I think a few of the right moves could go a long way. There is still a lot of talent there to base a new team around.

QUOTE(Rex Kicka** @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 12:03 PM) There are three pardons that Clinton made that were in my mind pretty craptacular (that stand out in my mind) and all were made in the last two weeks of his presidency. 1. Rostenkowski on two counts of mail fraud (although it was after his sentence was served) 2. Marc Rich (never tried) 3. Roger Clinton (two counts of cocaine possession) Oh yeah, another reason why this commutation is as craptacular as all these? Libby didn't even petition for it and go through the system. In August, Governor George Bush let a mentally retarded man be executed. But he finds two and a half years in a minimum security pen excessive for an aide who leaked a covert operative's name and lied about it several times to investigative arms of the government while under oath. Oh yeah, I had forgotten about Rostenkowski. That was complete B.S., I was quite angry at that one. Rosty deserved what he was given by the justice system.

QUOTE(ChiSox_Sonix @ Jul 3, 2007 -> 11:59 AM) 6 years and 7 months ago, whatever. And on his last day(s) in office he made over one hundred pardons including mark Rich and i think one of Hilary's brothers. He didn't pardon Berger, though, right? Samuel Berger? If we are talking about Hillary's brothers and their slimey business dealings, then I agree that was wrong too. But not nearly on the same scale - those people were not in the close White House decision-making circle.

I am going to add one more... Ehren Wassermann to take Bukvich's spot on the big club