scenario

I am completely disgusted with what I see on the field tonight. Pitiful.

Scott Kazmir pitching for the Rays today against the Twins. Yeah, we have to take care of our own business, but.... go Tampa!!!

Two other pitchers who should appear somewhere on prospect lists... Leroy Hunt and Johnnie Lowe Their stats may not be impressive so far. But they are probably two of the best arms in the system.

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Sep 19, 2008 -> 11:40 AM) And he was at B-Ham this year? This is the guy who we lost to OAK in the Rule 5, then re-signed when OAK dumped him, yes? There are 3 pitchers on the Birmingham roster with major league experience: - Fernando Hernandez (23) - Dewon Day (28 in about a week) - Ryan O'Malley (28) Day's problem is getting the ball over the plate on a consistent basis. O'Malley can get the ball over the plate, but people pound the crap of him when he does. I don't see either of those guys with the Sox for much longer. Fernando still has time. He should be in Charlotte next year. And with our current bullpen situation, if he does well in Charlotte, he could very well get a shot with the big club.

QUOTE (JPN366 @ Sep 18, 2008 -> 02:02 PM) "The White Sox only like guys who throw hard, they don't care about ones who can pitch." So that's why we drafted guys like Broadway and McCulloch (Charlie Haeger... Heath Phillips... etc, etc, etc.) Seems like we've been drafting soft-tossers who could "pitch" forever. I think the guy you talked to is probably a victim of the pendulum finally starting to swing the other way. Maybe the new regime is putting an emphasis on guys who have enough oomph on their fastballs to get major league hitters out. That would be a nice change.

Continuation of my "youngest on their team" list above... Players at Kannapolis who are younger than 21... Leroy Hunt (20) Hector Santiago (20) Eduardo Escobar (19) Jose Martinez (20) Sergio Morales (20) Players at Great Falls who are 20 or younger... Nevin Griffith (19) Jesus Avila (19) Jordan Cheatham (20) Kent Gerst (20) Players at Bristol who are 19 or younger... Steven Upchurch (19; just turned 19 in September) Kenneth Gilbert (19) Juan Silverio (17) Hancer Vargas (19) *Brandon Short (just turned 20 in September) *Murillo Gouvea (just turned 20 in September)

QUOTE (Greg Hibbard @ Sep 18, 2008 -> 10:22 AM) So in other words, we can't say that the 03 and 04 white sox, who were projected not to necessarily win the division didn't choke either. They just "overacheived" I think you really stretched to make that connection. Those Sox teams were loaded with veteran players. This current Twins team is not. Alot of these guys were playing for Rochester last year... some of them THIS year. Big difference.

QUOTE (Palehosefan @ Sep 18, 2008 -> 11:20 AM) lol yep Scenario, couldn't help it. When are you going to post your top 10-15? I'm still chewing on it... and doing a little more digging on the younger guys.

Just thinking out loud... One of the things I look for when trying to determine a players potential is their age for their level. It's not the main factor, of course, but it is interesting to take a look at who the players are that are the youngest on their team. As a guideline, I assume the following league/age relationships (keep in mind this is just my opinion... no science): - Rookie (Bristol): 19/20 - Advanced Rookie (Great Falls): 20/21 - Low A: 21 - Advanced A: 22 - AA: 23 - AAA: 24 (Each of the numbers above is below the league averages.) So, for example, I think of players at Winston-Salem who are 22 for the majority of the year as being 'on the curve' or the normal progression path for their age. And players who are younger than 22 being ahead. (Etc., same concepts applied for different leagues/levels). Just for interests sake, here are the players at Winston-Salem younger than 22: Justin Edwards (just turned 21 on September 7th); Jacob Rasner (turns 22 in December); Cleveland Santeliz (turned 22 on September 1st); and Sergio Miranda (just turned 21 in May). Players at Birmingham younger than 23: Aaron Poreda (21), Brandon Allen (22), and Kanekoa Texeira (22). Players at Charlotte younger than 24: None. (Although both Gio and Ryan Sweeney would have qualified if we still had them.) When you do the same for the other teams, it creates an interesting list. I'll probably put it together later when I get a little more time. This is not to say that these are the best prospects or that other players who are league age or older are not prospects. I just find it interesting that these players were 'advanced ahead of their ages'... and therefore probably worth paying attention to.

QUOTE (Palehosefan @ Sep 18, 2008 -> 10:38 AM) 11. CJ Retherford(a little old, but could be a late bloomer 3B option in a year or so) Come on Palehose... picking on my boy. Actually CJ is 8 days younger than Shelby. Both just turned 23 in August. So they'll both play almost a full season of AA ball next year at age 23 (then be 24 in AAA). That's not bad. The only starter at Birmingham this year younger than 23 was Brandon Allen.

QUOTE (Greg Hibbard @ Sep 18, 2008 -> 08:09 AM) I'm sorry, but they ARE most certainly choking. I'm sorry. I'm just having a hard time imagining how someone could say a lineup with Denard Span, Carlos Gomez, Brian Buscher, Matt Tolbert, and Alexi Casilla starting for them is "choking". Five position players with less than 5 years of MLB experience between them... and almost all of them performing above their minor league averages. Add that to 5 starting pitchers none of whom have a full year in MLB under their belt. Overachieving is a more appropriate term... not choking.

QUOTE (kyyle23 @ Sep 18, 2008 -> 10:12 AM) Other than the starting pitching, wasnt the Braves dynasty consistently broken up and rebuilt? The only constant in the offense seems to be Chipper In the last few years maybe, but their 1990s teams had a pretty consistent core that played from cradle to near grave.

QUOTE (Texsox @ Sep 18, 2008 -> 08:41 AM) What we want is a team full of guys who are approaching their high value mark, then trade as soon as they reach it for guys who will be approaching their high value mark. I'm not certain if we would ever win, but it would be entertaining. Trade people as soon as they become good. Sounds like the 1990s Blackhawks. You'll have to pardon my lack of enthusiasm for that approach.

Saw this quote on a Twins board and thought it was funny... Gardy comes out of the dugout with Mijares on the mound and I yelled, 'Please not Guerrier!!' Then they flash to the bullpen doors and here comes good ole meat. I threw my remote across the room knowing we were done. Why can we all see this yet Gardy sticks by him despite his struggles game after game after game after game............. All I could picture was Gardy going to the bullpen phone and dialing up the local Buffalo Wild Wings while asking, 'Hey guys, who should I bring in?' Guerrier has become Mahoney.

Sidenote: Freddy G. threw 5 innings of shutout ball in a start against Texas tonight.

QUOTE (Brian @ Sep 17, 2008 -> 05:57 PM) They said on the radio that Buerhle was pitching Friday. I didn't think that sounded right. I figured Danks was Sat. One of us is right. I could be wrong, but it's my understanding that it's Buehrle on Friday and Floyd on Saturday both on short rest; then Danks (with 6 days rest) on Sunday. After the day off Monday, Vazquez, Buehrle, and Floyd will pitch in the Minnesota series with regular rest.

3 pitch strikeout of A-Rod by Richard... 77 mph changeup 89 mph fastball 92 mph fastball on his hands Nice.

QUOTE (Brian @ Sep 17, 2008 -> 03:56 PM) Ugh. This wreaks of the Cotts Incident. How many shots is Clayton gonna get? Broadway has 1 start, it was quality. Don't care if it was KC. He deserves a shot. Broadway deserves a 'shot' against a team loaded with lefty hitters? That would be a suicide mission. He's proven all year long that he can't get lefties out. (He had a .317 BAA in AAA against lefties; a 5.78 ERA; and gave up 17 of his 24 homeruns against them.) That's why Richard is starting tonight.

The Yanks are 10 games over .500 against right-handed starters and 1 game below .500 against lefties.

I don't think the Twins are choking. When you have 5 starting pitchers who don't have even 1 full season season of MLB under their belts... and you compete this deep into a season... that's pretty amazing. They've been overachieving all year. I think what we're seeing is the long season finally catching up to those guys.

What "advancement" did Oney see? He had his butt parked on the bench for most of a season at Bristol last year. He played in 2 games at Great Falls in 2008 followed by 17 games on the bench at Kanny. Any players watching and concerning themselves with that type of "advancement", if you could call it that, need to look in the mirror and slap themselves. OK... he got one game at Charlotte. But there was logic behind that. The Knights needed a 2nd baseman for a meaningless end of season game. No way they were going to pull somebody up from Birmingham or W-S since both of those teams were preparing for their league playoffs. So, they had to bring someone up from Kannapolis. Was there any other low A-ball 2nd baseman who was passed over for 1 game callup to AAA.... somebody who did so well that they were worthy of that callup? No.

A few factors that could help Richard tonight... 1. He's left-handed. The Yanks have struggled against lefty pitching this year. 2. They haven't seen him before. That usually gives a pitcher a slight edge. 3. He's pitched in Yankee stadium before. He was the starting pitcher in the Futures Game this year.

QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 16, 2008 -> 01:23 PM) The rumor going around on another site is that the Sox believe Boras has talked to the Angels about Crede going there next season, and with those "negotiations" going well, he's advised Crede to not take any chances the rest of this season. The White Sox were made aware of this, and they told Crede/Boras to f*** off. Sounds like speculation gone wild to me.

I'm not sure I buy the 'cleaned out his locker' story. We heard last week from a couple of reporters that Crede had left the team... and Joe has clearly been visible in the dugout since. So... I'll believe it when I see it.

I find it sort of funny that anybody would really be irritated that we 'wasted' a 36th round draft pick on Oney.