Dick Allen

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Mar 12, 2008 -> 06:27 PM) So maybe, just maybe, my BA 44 jersey won't be completely useless... I hope so, but I keep reminding myself that a team starving for someone who can hit left handed pitching had a player known to do that hit .500 with 3 homers in 22 AB last spring and he was released. (Eduardo Perez) Of course, the only team that picked him up was ESPN.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Mar 12, 2008 -> 03:14 PM) I know you have grabbed onto that sidebar detail. I should have never mentioned Quentin. He doesn't fit in the Cf arguement. I WAS WRONG TO MENTION HIM. That still leaves us with Williams needing to replace Anderson because he failed. Then he had to replace Erstad because he failed. That left him with unloading three big prospects to get someone to play CF. All of which STILL have the common thread of Brian Anderson falling down on the job, NOT based on the 17 ABs in 2007 which you keep pointing to, BUT the HALF OF A SEASON FAILURE in 2006. Erstad had an option for this year. He is the one to blame. Either that or Jerry Owens who obviously didn't show enough last year. Anderson also had a season ending injury last year. If it were all about him, KW would have been in the same boat this offseason wondering how the injury would affect him. I supposed we could blame Frank Thomas for a screwing up the Sox as well. If he hit in 2005 like he did in 2006, Thome would have never had to be acquired and Rowand would have been in CF. Its ridiculous to blame a guy with less than a full season of major league at bats. With all the poor starts many good players have in their careers, this guy had the pressure to produce for a defending champ. Its not surprising his offense fell short.

QUOTE(The Ginger Kid @ Mar 12, 2008 -> 02:07 PM) a sore groin on a young player vs. a veteran with a recurring habit of blowing a hernia? I think the best argument to be made for keeping BA is that Detroit is going to run away with this division and the Sox will be in a re-build mode next winter. They could start in July by moving some veterans (cabrera, dye, maybe even crede) and re-stocking. BA would be a nice building block if he can ever figure out MLB pitching, which he hasn't yet. Owens isn't much younger than Pods was when he started having leg problems. Owens + leg problems= worthless.

Broadway, Day, Haeger,Getz, Liefer among those reassigned. Carlos Vasquez was waived. Harrell, Huffman, Perez, Rouse, Smith also reassigned.

QUOTE(witesoxfan @ Mar 12, 2008 -> 01:47 PM) I do hope that Brian Anderson makes the Sox take him up north and become the CFer this season. I love Quentin, but I could handle him in AAA/off the bench this year and next, so long as he's getting quite a few PAs between DH, LF, and RF. If Anderson does finally put it up this year and become a CFer, that instantly takes the OF defense from slow and among the worst in the league to one of the best units. Swish-Anderson-Dye looks like average to above average range in the corners with outstanding range in center, with strong arms on all of them, and then Quentin is on the bench and he's a good defensive corner too. I'd love it. I don't necessarily hope Owens stays injured, but it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world for the future of this franchise if he did and Anderson become a legitimate CFer. Owens was scratched today. They say its because tomorrow is an off day and they wanted him to have 2 full days off, but this is looking like a Pods rerun.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Mar 12, 2008 -> 01:35 PM) And every GM in baseball knew the 8-ball K-Dubya was behind and would make it tougher for him to get fair for fair trades. If he keeps his head out of his ass, he could be truly great in this league. I don't know about that. He traded for Edmonds. He didn't want to come here. He offerred the most mney for Fukudome, he would rather play for the Cubs, the Angels and Giants were willing to overpay for Hunter and Rowand. At the deadline in 2006 he met with Konerko and Thome and they evvidently decided there really was nothing wrong with Anderson and decided not to make any trades. Soriano was rumored to be a White Sox. Just like any other team in baseball, if KW wants a guy who is available he has to make what is the most desirable offer to the player's current team. Some want prospects. Some want major league ready players, some want financial relief and some want a combination.

QUOTE(RockRaines @ Mar 12, 2008 -> 01:07 PM) You are such a drama queen. Why exaggerate everything that everyone says to try and prove your point? He's the one that said BA screwed up the White Sox. I have decided to agree.

QUOTE(Jenks Heat @ Mar 12, 2008 -> 12:39 PM) The flaw in your logic is KW has yet to get a CF. Of the players you mentioned Erstad was brought to be a fourth outfielder but his wondeful spring with that of the Prancer buried Anderson after Anderson won a job. Thus Erstad, the ultimate Grinder, plays just long enough to kill Anderson's season (19 AB in a month will do wonders for a young player) and render 2007 a disaster becasue of flawed KW logic on the player he brought in and handed a job to. Erstad played until the end May and did little to produce. Quintin is not a CF. Swisher is not a CF but he may be more equipped to do so than Mackowiak.... Owens can run and therefore is needed to get on base once a game and steal and maybe even score a run. The fact that he is no better a CF than Swisher is beside the point. If this team had a game plan that they truely believed in like they preach (pitching and defense) Anderson would have started last year and played just about every day in 2006. Anderson was no worse in 2006 than a majority of other rookies and did what was asked of him, played great defense. Which with statues in leftand right was really needed. The other flaw in his "logic" is what would BA failing in CF have to do with acquiring a corner OF in Quentin? I think BA can be a very good player, but injuries should be a concern. He gets banged up a lot. At least we know one thing, if the Sox don't win 95 games this year, its Brian Anderson's fault.

QUOTE(The Ginger Kid @ Mar 12, 2008 -> 12:34 PM) his wrist was injured in '06? How much worse was Brian Anderson offensively than Robin Ventura his rookie year.

QUOTE(NorthSideSox72 @ Mar 12, 2008 -> 12:05 PM) Owens has yet to succeed or fail. You're making my point. Anderson has about the same playing time, and he was blamed for the Sox ridding themselves of all their prospects. So if BA made the Sox go get Erstad, Owens must be partially responsible for the Sox having to trade a lot away for Swisher.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Mar 12, 2008 -> 11:44 AM) I think that is the difference between you and me. I am going to blame the guys on the field, for on the field preformance. If Brian Anderson fails, it is Brian Anderson's fault. What happens off of the field, I blame on Kenny, Ozzie, and/or Jerry. I still say if Anderson was half as good in CF Kenny would have never had to try to fix CF in the first place. But you're not. You pick and choose. Anderson not hitting shouldn't force KW to go get 2 OF. He got Erstad. Erstad failed. Owens apparently failed. Pods failed, yet you blame it all on Brian Anderson. If you're going to blame players, don't blame the ones that don't play. You blame BA for "forcing" KW to trade Carter. Last I checked Quentin doesn't play CF.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Mar 12, 2008 -> 10:50 AM) To be honest, if Anderson has his head out of his ass, I have said for two years now that he is our best option in CF. But I can also understand that Brian Anderson's meltdown has put this team behind the eight ball. I don't see how that is mutally exclusive, or means that Kenny Williams can do no wrong, but OK, have fun with the hyperbole. I am not quite sure how Williams is supposed to handle his players failing. Does he not do anything because he picked them up in the first place? Besides, if Anderson was the answer all along, why should Williams have gone out and paid a lot of money for another CF in free agency. That is talking out of both sides of your mouth. Then again, so would be critisizing Williams for the Linebrink signing when you called him cheap for not dipping into FA to fix our problems. Obviously Erstad wasn't the answer, so that means Williams screwed that up. He also screwed up by thinking Anderson was ready to be a major league CF. I guess that makes me a guy who thinks KW can do no wrong Why was it not Pod's fault that Quentin was acquired? Why was it not Erstad's or Owens' fault that KW had to pay the price for Swisher, or why wasn't it KW's fault for not properly assessing how certain players would perform? Ultimately, it comes down to the boss. If you don't like the current state of the team, he is who you should blame, not some guy who had 17 major league at bats last season. It makes absolutely no sense that BA's inability to hit made KW get 2 guys at least one of which maybe both won't even play the same position.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Mar 12, 2008 -> 08:46 AM) If the Sox win 90 games, and Anderson still preforms like a egotistical amatuer, he still gets replaced in 2007. The Sox record has nothing to do with that. Kenny goes out and replaces parts that need fixing. Anderson couldn't handle CF like a major leaguer in 2006, so the Sox had to resort to Darin Erstad in 2007. The failure of Erstad on top of the failure of Anderson led to the Sox flushing their minor leagues for Quinten and Swisher. The one constant in that trend is that if Brian Anderson could have stepped to the plate, none of the next steps would have happened. That is the first domino in that line. I would call requiring the Sox to aquire all of those OFs screwing up the Sox. I would much rather have Anderson playing at his earlier potential, along with Chris Carter, Gio Gonzalez, Faustino De Los Santos, and Ryan Sweeney still in our system. Wouldn't the Sox having to go get Quentin, Pods fault? Anderson was/is a CF and Quentin certainly doesn't play that position. But I suppose if Ozzie or KW rip a player, everything is their fault.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Mar 12, 2008 -> 08:46 AM) If the Sox win 90 games, and Anderson still preforms like a egotistical amatuer, he still gets replaced in 2007. The Sox record has nothing to do with that. Kenny goes out and replaces parts that need fixing. Anderson couldn't handle CF like a major leaguer in 2006, so the Sox had to resort to Darin Erstad in 2007. The failure of Erstad on top of the failure of Anderson led to the Sox flushing their minor leagues for Quinten and Swisher. The one constant in that trend is that if Brian Anderson could have stepped to the plate, none of the next steps would have happened. That is the first domino in that line. I would call requiring the Sox to aquire all of those OFs screwing up the Sox. I would much rather have Anderson playing at his earlier potential, along with Chris Carter, Gio Gonzalez, Faustino De Los Santos, and Ryan Sweeney still in our system. So if Quentin, Owens and or Swisher are just as successful if not more than the names you mentioned, remember you said Brian Anderson screwed up the White Sox. And if they all perform great, maybe you change your mind and say Brian Anderson fixed the White Sox. You probably also blame him for the economy, 9/11 and so on. You talk out of both sides of your mouth because you think KW does no wrong. You say Kenny goes out and replaces parts that need fixing, so the Sox had to resort to Darin Erstad. Appears he replaced a part that needed fixing with another part that was beyond fixing. What screwed up the Sox was trying to fix holes with guys who were worse. See the bullpen. KW could have kept the prospects if he wanted to shell out more money, but once again, he misread the market. His market correction never occurred/

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Mar 12, 2008 -> 08:02 AM) How is it "pure fiction"? None of Vazquez, Buerhle, Politte, Cotts, Contreras, or Jenks play CF, so what do they have to do with bringing in Erstad? If Anderson preforms, Darrin Erstad isn't brought to the Sox in 2007. The pitching problems are the reasons guys like MacDougal, Sisco, and company were brought to the team. Because Anderson wasn't the problem in 2006 and CF wasn't the reason the team lost 90 games last year. Erstad blows, but he did not screw up the White Sox, he didn't cost much and certainly didn't cost them 20 games. Willie Mays in his prime could have been patrolling CF at USCF last year and the team would have been horrible. Erstad just performed and got injured like everyone except Ozzie and KW knew he would but they insisted they need a "grinder".

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Mar 11, 2008 -> 10:48 PM) God forbid if he faced CC, it would be so much better if we put Uribe and his .200BA against CC up there to swing for the fences. We were so impressed with Uribe that after signing him, we immediately traded our best trading chip for his position. Then after finding no suitors we are forced to use him. If it wasn't for the 4 million dollar salary Uribe he would be sitting on the pine as a utility guy. I'd bet my home if Ramirez makes the White Sox and plays everyday, you will hate his swing at everything approach, and will say its all Greg Walker.

QUOTE(TLAK @ Mar 12, 2008 -> 07:09 AM) The guy Nelson Cruz homered off of in the tenth yesterday is none other than Matt Anderson, late of the Tigers and Rockies. I didn’t know the Sox organization signed him. He sat out 2007 and started a comeback with Naranjeros de Hermosillo last fall. He got into 3 games, lost 2 of them. 3.1 IP, 2 ER, 4 BB (1 intentional), 2 K, 1 HR for an ERA of 5.40. He’s obviously a deep, deep reclamation project if the organization keeps him around at all. Yesterday was his only appearance for the big club this spring. Isn’t this the same kid who used to throw 100 mph for the Tigers? Has anyone seen him, does he still throw hard? Yes he's one and the same. If he's on the White Sox in 2008, it would be the pitching equavalent to Andy Gonzalez leading off. He wasn't so good before his injuries.

Keith Law had some tidbits on 3 White Sox. I'm not a fan of Law but he was employed for several years by the Blue Jays as an assistant GM. He thinks Ramirez can hit for a decent average with 20 homer potential, but feels his OBP will be extremely low and compared him to BJ Upton now an OFer I believe, defensively at 2B. He says he's a lot like Soriano, but lacks Soriano's explosiveness and has even less plate discipline than him. He said Gavin Floyd's stuff has gone backwards, that his curveball, once deemed as one of the best is now just "solid" average. His fastball is 91-93, with little command, and says his change isn't anything special. He likes Josh Fields but says his pitch recognition is still lacking which will keep his walk rate down and well keeping his strikeouts up, and says he doesn't have the defensive capabilities to fall back on. All in all, pretty harsh. I still don't know how you judge anybody at this stage, and obviously Law didn't talk to the 29 teams KW mentioned who would love to have Floyd, and that most people in the industry, according to him, view him as a top of the rotation starter.

QUOTE(Princess Dye @ Mar 11, 2008 -> 10:22 PM) right but the point is just about playing 2b. How much harder can MLB second base be....than Cuban second base? The hardest hit ball down there must be as hard hit as here. The hard slides... well, that would be about the only issue i could think of. If he's hitting the cover off the ball all spring, I think you look past it and give him a shot opening day. First off, Ozzie hasn't been too impressed with his glove at 2B this spring. I also think there's a comfort level he would have playing in Cuba that he wouldn't have March 31 in Cleveland. He was a star, now he's a guy trying to make a team. The major leagues is the biggest stage, he's bound to be a little tight. I also think Ozzie is referring to offensively as well, as he's probably rarely, if ever, faced a guy with Sabathia's stuff in what could be not the most ideal playing conditions. I wonder what the lowest temperature Ramirez has ever played in.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Mar 11, 2008 -> 10:14 PM) Give this team a solid coach, system, and maybe a leader somewhere and it could turn around real quick. And play the damn kids. I think I read that the Bulls are now the youngest team in the NBA.

QUOTE(southsider2k5 @ Mar 11, 2008 -> 09:17 PM) Brian Anderson screwed this team up by having the season he did in 2006, combined with his superman attitude, which made Williams feel like he had to bring in Erstad. Pure fiction. The first half of the year, he wasn't hitting, but the White Sox were in first place. In July and August combined he hit over .300 with an OPS of .800 when the team was fading. What did the 2006 White Sox in was the pitching. Vazquez was bad, Buerhle was bad, Politte and Cotts were horrible, Jenks spent the winter of 05/06 at Krispy Kreme and wasn't ready when the bell rung. Contreras hurt his back and went south. It wasn't Anderson. The manager said in spring training he didn't care what Anderson hit, he was concerned about his defense. He provided defense. Unfortunately he couldn't position himself in the bleachers.

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Mar 11, 2008 -> 05:14 PM) If Joe Crede was capable of hitting .260 this season with an OBP of around .330 and 20HR's, then yes I would agree with you, Crede would be more valuable to this team in 2008. However I'd say the chances of the above scenario happening aren't very good, based on Crede's rustiness at the plate so far, and you don't know if he'll ever be 100% again. And sometimes the above isn't so simple, you have to look at things such as the contracts of both players, and where both players fit into your long - term core. Fields does, but Crede at this stage does not. How can you judge Crede on 22 AB when he hasn't played in a long while, and not only is he getting used to playing again, don't forget the hand injury suffered when the White Sox incredibly had MacDougal, he of the hard throwing I have no idea where the ball is going MacDougals pitching batting practice to guys owed millions and the predicable occured?

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Mar 11, 2008 -> 01:42 PM) Sure because when I think about shortening the stroke, the whitesox minor leagues come to mind. They have produced many a short and quick swing. Don't you say Walker tries to make everyone swing for the fences? I believe "lift and pull" is the term you use. They actually have some new instructors in the minor leagues this season. Joe McEwing I believe is the Charlotte hitting coach.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Mar 11, 2008 -> 01:37 PM) Wow so now Fields will hinder the sox from winning. Who are these young players. The only one that looks to start is Owens. The rest will be in AAA or bench fodder as it looks. How is he going to develop in AAA. Feast on the crappy pitching of the International League. The same league that allowed Brian Anderson to hit 300 or better. Sure he can learn all sorts of bad things there. He can work on shortening his stroke. I'm surprised you think exposure to Greg Walker is good for him.

QUOTE(elrockinMT @ Mar 11, 2008 -> 12:34 PM) You can not just assume Josh Fields will get better. We can all hope he does, but I have heard of the sophmore jinx also plus sometime you see the flash in pan player do good in his first year and slip from there. However, can we all agree that we hope Fields does better and improves on his batting eye so we don't see the K's pile up? Exactly. When Crede was 24 he hit 12 homers in 200 AB and hit over .280. Fields hit with about the same power, but less average and a little less with the glove and a lot less contact. If you think Crede sucks and Fields being 24 is a lock to improve, you aren't being consistent. Crede is gone next year probably no matter what. What should be considered right now is who gives the White Sox the best chance to win in 2008. Initially, if Crede is healthy, he should be the choice. If he faulters, or the Sox fall out of contention then you can give him away and let Fields take over. Ron Kittle hit 35 homers as a rookie. He never hit 35 in a season again.