Dick Allen

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Aug 26, 2007 -> 09:38 PM) Ah, the old W-L argument with pitchers. A fantastic way to tell you the capability of a pitcher... If you look at his ERA vs. the league ERA over his career, more often than not, his ERA is higher than the league's. I would rather base a guy's performance on wins and losses and ERA than strikeouts.

QUOTE(BearSox @ Aug 26, 2007 -> 07:57 PM) Yeah... Duque would probably be dominating for the White Sox in the AL central and would be able to give the team 200+ innings and such for the next 3 years since he is what, only 30? And Vizcaino would be the key to this bullpen... And can't forget about the fact that with Chris Young, we would have had so many more key runs driven in with that great average of his with RISP. It amazes me how people can underestimate how good of a pitcher Vazquez is. Believe it or not, but Vazquez is probably the best starter this team has. I wouldn't call Vazquez dominating. He had 10 ks today also 3 gopher balls. He's having a decent year, but he's been known to fall apart. If he's so great, how come he's not even .500 in his career? If you tell me its because he was on bad teams, how come he was below .500 last year on a team that won 90 games?

QUOTE(BearSox @ Aug 26, 2007 -> 07:44 PM) It might not show it in the boxscore, but the blown DP by Gonzalez opened up the game for the Red Sox. White Sox pitchers as a group need to do a better job of pitching over miscues.

QUOTE(jasonxctf @ Aug 26, 2007 -> 07:44 PM) fine, then the article and discussion should be why the Duque/Vizcaino portion of the deal was bad. Not Chris Young. Chris Young is the key to the deal. If he remains healthy, he most likely will be the best player out of all of the players in the deal. The Sox need a major league CF. Chris Young, while his OBP is not very good, is improving at the plate, hits with power, steals bases and according to Orlando Hudson is right there amoung the top defensive CF in baseball. Sounds like someone the Sox can use. The problem I had with getting rid of Duque wasn't really his pitching, which has really shocked me how good he's been, I thought his leaving would hurt Contreras. I don't know if it did, Contreras was pretty good the first half of last season, but I think if Duque was around right now, Jose would be a better pitcher. I have no proof, but just a feeling. Vizcaino is a pretty valuable guy himself. I didn't like the trade, Vazquez has been better this year, but I'm still not sold on him. The bottom line is if the trade hadn't been made the Sox still wouldn't have won last year, and they wouldn't have won this year.

QUOTE(jasonxctf @ Aug 26, 2007 -> 07:37 PM) personally i dont think chris young for Vazquez was such a bad deal. The sox were coming off a WS year knowing that Freddy Garcia was due to break down at any time, after El Duque broke down during the prior season. Hell Chris Young is hitting all of .233 with a .286 OBP. (21 SB in 117 Games) Jerry Owens is hitting .245 with a .295 OBP. (21 SB in 62 Games) Yes, Chris has more power than Jerry, but Jerry has more speed. Right now the Sox don't need power hitters. We need OBP guys with some speed. Vazquez by the way is 11-6 with a 3.66ERA. Duque is 9-4 with a 3.07' Vizcaino is 8-2 with a 3.66 Chris Young is 23 years old. He will eventually get on base more often than Jerry Owens, and he can drive in a run once in a while. He's far and away a better player than Owens.

QUOTE(BearSox @ Aug 26, 2007 -> 07:39 PM) was... He got roughed up today thanks to no help from his defense and offense. Unless he had defenders stationed in the bleachers, they weren't going to help him much.

QUOTE(GreenSox @ Aug 26, 2007 -> 07:20 PM) Exactly zero patience with young players; so he throws him into left, which is a longshot for him. In 4 years of managing this club, Ozzie still hasn't turned a single young player into a regular. Not a single hitter has signficantly improved under this coaching staff. Fields did play LF in winter ball. They might as well see if he can play out there. I like that this indicates Crede will be tendered. I'm sure the Sox have info on his recovery. If Crede's healthy, he's a pretty good player. Its better to see if Fields can play LF in games that really don't matter, instead of just throwing him into the fire. He doesn't need to be a gold glover out there, just competent, and if the Sox could acquire Torii Hunter, which is a longshot in my mind, it would even make it easier for him. If he can't play LF, maybe see what he can do at 2B next spring, especially if the Sox go with Richar. He and Richar could platoon, and he could occassionally spell Crede at 3rd.

They were interviewing Walker during the game yesterday and he talked about how the approach was to take Wakefield the other way, so everyone who says he preaches swinging hard and trying to pull the ball into the seats is just wrong. The only way to fix this offense is to sprinkle a few new hitters into it. Today, 5 batters in a row, Uribe, Richar, Gonzalez, Owens, Fields. That's just brutal. The highest batting average among the 5 is .242. You get through Thome, Konerko, AJ, and Dye, you have almost a 2 inning breather.

I wish I had JR as a teacher in High School. I would have been accepted at Harvard easy.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Aug 26, 2007 -> 06:15 PM) My new prediction is Contreras and a decent spec get traded for Tejada, and it happens relatively early in the off-season. That would be a hard sell on their rapidly declining fan base. Trading Tejada for an OLDER player who was awful in 2007, wouldn't fly with me if I was an Oriole fan. And I look at the White Sox prospects and see how they struggle and it would piss me off even more. No way on that trade.

The White Sox as an organization should be embarrassed.

Anyone want to bet that if the Sox do go after Hunter he will eventually sign elsewhere and the Sox will say they were right there with the money it just came down to a no trade clause?

Richar has an OBP of .300 right now. His batting average is .200. Obviously, both of these should go up a bit, but I don't know how his working a count makes him a lock to be an exceptional hitter. Mark Johnson used to work a count pretty well and they really should have DH'd for him and let the pitcher hit. Richar has made some nice plays defensively, but as the scouting reports suggest, has flubbed some easier ones. He is 1 for 3 in steal attempts. I still don't know what to make of him. He may be good, he may be DeAngelo Jimenez. If he's already earned a starting job on the 2008 White Sox based on his little trial run so far, this team will not be a championship contender. His OBP is .010 higher than Brian Anderson's last season, and we have people penciling him in to lead off. That's a little too optimistic at this point IMO.

QUOTE(Friend of Nordhagen @ Aug 25, 2007 -> 05:47 PM) "Chris Singleton pulls out a knife, jabs me in the heart. That's what you do when you kill a man with a knife; you stab him in the heart. Line shot foul by Erstad. Bleeding on the mic now. That's what happens when you have a knife wound in your heart; you bleed on the mic. Erstad goes down swinging. Feeling faint now. That's what happens when the blood drains from your body; you feel faint. Here's Andy Gonzalez. Pretty much dead now, Chris Singleton. Good night, everyone. Go crazy." This is a classic.

QUOTE(Greg The Bull Luzinski @ Aug 25, 2007 -> 05:41 PM) Singleton isn't bored, he has to listen to Farmer all day. Personally, I would have taken my life long ago if I had to do that. Or Farmer's. I don't think a jury of his peers would convict Singleton if he took out Farmio

At least KW got Mike Myers. He's impressive.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Aug 25, 2007 -> 05:23 PM) So then why did Buehrle and Dye re-sign, for arguably below market value. Both have said a large reason they re-up'd was based on what Williams told them about next year's plan. I could see Williams and Ozzie blowing smoke up the fans ass, but not Mark and JD. Telling him what he wants to do, and actually getting it done are 2 different things. I would imagine after last year, if these guys were free agents to be then, he would have told them he was going after a real CF. He would have told them about the big plan to revamp the bullpen. KW needs to be held accountable and should be on a short leash at the very least.

QUOTE(Friend of Nordhagen @ Aug 25, 2007 -> 05:21 PM) "Fathom, Kenny Willams here. What you have to understand is that the market will correct itself at some point. In the meantime, we've locked up some fine power arms who looked great in Mexico this winter." Nobody else in baseball saw what KW saw in all the stiffs he acquired for the bullpen. He was bragging about it. Now he's hiding behind the "nobody could see us being this bad". On one hand he likes to mention how much smarter he is, but when it doesn't work out, all of a sudden those other opinions which used to mean nothing, are like gospel.

QUOTE(fathom @ Aug 25, 2007 -> 05:19 PM) Personally, I think all this talk about being spenders this offseason is bulls***. They'll act like they went after people, and then b**** about the contracts being too much and bad for business. I can't wait to see who's fired next, as we know it will be another scapegoat. I'll be shocked if they actually up the payroll. I agree it will be someone like Duane Shaeffer who will get canned, while the decision makers who screwed up again will live off 2005 for the rest of their careers.

QUOTE(fathom @ Aug 25, 2007 -> 05:15 PM) They're so far away from competing, it's scary. Assuming they trade Garland this offseason, that leaves you with two starters who you can even count on to have an ERA south of 5.50 next year. You have a horrible bullpen besides Bobby Jenks. Then, you have just no depth on offense. You need a new LF/CF/SS, and have to get better reserves. So basically.....unless they're willing to go on a spending spree (which won't happen with all the big contracts we have tied up right now), this team is looking at a ton of holes again next year. When Hawk who obviously has some inside, is trying to sell the public on stiffs like Gonzalez and Owens, you can only cringe.

This organization should be embarrassed they cannot compete at all. Its about time the "shock" of how horrible they are wears off and heads need to roll, from every level. KW should look at the bullpen he dislocated his shoulder patting himself on the back for and resign right now.

They should give the people at the park sticking this one out a shot at some souveniers. Bring in Floyd.

I'm pretty sure AJ calls the games. He's looking in the dugout not for pitches but for pitchouts, pickoffs and they also tell the young pitchers when to throw over to first base.

Thome is a DH only right now. It limits his market. You won't be getting back nearly what he can give you if you trade him. I don't know why giving up the guy who gets on base more often than anyone else on your roster and homers more often per at bat than anyone on your roster for some young unproven guys, when you are still trying to win is such a great idea anyway.

Supposedly AJ is the most pissed off at the Sox lack of success. I'm not going to mention game calling because we really don't know who is calling pitches and the bottom line is the pitcher is the one who calls the game. The catcher suggests pitches. AJ has probably as good of record catching games as anyone. Lets not deflect the blame onto everyone but the one it should be blamed on, the pitcher.