Dick Allen

His right wrist has been a problem for him since spring training and has flared up recently. He is very injury-prone. His wrist, shoulder, knee or hammy can go at any moment.

QUOTE(quickman @ May 24, 2005 -> 07:18 PM) THis is totally out of left field, way out there... what if Mcarthy was a show case against the Cubs to set up this trade. El duque is scheduled top come back friday and was compeltely reluctant to go on the DL, in addition the sox were so secretive on this whole BMAC thing, plus the fact that Ozzie pulled him early. Just speculating and being totally off the wall Ozzie said the McCarthy is going to be with the White Sox a long time. Ozzie always tells the truth.

QUOTE(quickman @ May 24, 2005 -> 07:28 PM) of course its BS, but isn't this fun? It is fun. People are making pretty good arguments each way.

QUOTE(quickman @ May 24, 2005 -> 07:24 PM) the why is that chavez is an all star thrid baseman who will not be batting like this as the year goes on. In addition the man can put us over the top. The trouble is do you give up a talent like BMAC. but there is no doubt I give up crede and any other minor leager they want. While this rumor is BS, lets just say its true, the bigger question is whether or not JR would be willing to pick up the additional payroll this deal would give the White Sox. Not only this year, but the next 4 or 5. Its not only going to be Chavez's contract but also the cost of another starter, and he's going to be a lot more expensive than BMac. I know people are going to say let Konerko walk, but unless one of the young outfielders moves to 1b, his replacement, if decent, is going to cost some money.

QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ May 24, 2005 -> 06:11 PM) Wait, is there any substantial evidence that this is a true rumor and not some rumor started by some guy on the mlb.com boards that Mac, Jurko, and Harry just started to pick up. No, it was a caller who claimed he heard the rumor on Bay Area sports radio. Its BS.

KW has emphasised pitching this year. Pitching, pitching, pitching. Plus the White Sox are a team with a budget. Chavez hasn't done much this year, but he does usually start off slow. Or maybe his performance has been "enhanced" in past years. I just don't see the rumor coming true.

Couldn't the Sox option Frank to Charlotte if he agrees to it?

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ May 24, 2005 -> 04:25 PM) Not with Anderson/Sweeney/Owens/Young down in the minors. I'll take the proven pitcher in Garcia anyday for Reed. Reed will be a good player, never a superstar. Olivo is looking more and more like nothing. That was a tremendous deal for the Sox cause Freddy is a good pitcher. Chavez for Crede and Bmac would be a good deal for us even if Bmac turned into a good pitcher. If Bmac busted or didn't live up to the hype it would be an unbelieavable deal for the Sox. Chavez is a proven stud...Bmac a minor league stud. Now I think Bmac is going to flat dominate, but there is no guarantee of that. Now if I were making any offer, I'd be offering the entire rest of the farm system but Bmac, but if it came to Crede/Bmac/Filler for Chavez and maybe a little cash, I make that deal every single time. Chavez is an all star and one of the best 3rd baseman in the game. I'd still hate and cringe at losing Bmac (he's been the best prospect to come up in a long long time). That being said, I think if KW played tough enough he could put together a good enough package without giving up Mac. Plus I still think Oakland could use someone like Brian Anderson just as much as Bmac. I do think the A's will dump Chavez though because they are in financial mode and don't want to pay his contract. I don't think trading a stud pitching prospect who can and is contributing now, and adding $8 million to the payroll is going to appeal to KW or JR. This was a rumor that someone called MJH with anyway. He claimed they were talking about it on sportsradio in the Bay Area. Its all BS. I really doubt BB has any intention of trading Chavez, and if he does, maybe that says he doesn't think Chavez's recent struggles are temporary.

QUOTE(JDsDirtySox @ May 24, 2005 -> 04:15 PM) All this talk reminds me of all of the Jeremy Reed lovers who were ready to end it all when he got dealt with Olivo for Freddy Garcia. If there is a way to get Chavez do it. One huge difference is BMac is a pitcher. The Sox have a few OF prospects, although I bet one day they will regret trading Reed. Good starters are very expensive. BMac will be pretty affordable for several years.

BMac is untouchable.

BMac is under Sox control for 6 years. The only way KW would make this trade is if Oakland picked up most of Chavez's contract, and even then he probably doesn't do it. You don't trade away cheap stud pitchers. This deal will not happen.

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ May 24, 2005 -> 09:17 AM) Here's one that I thought could make sense. Raul Ibanez and Eddie Guardado. You know, if the Cubs got Guardado they would have Eddie and Jo Bo in the bullpen.

If it was this past weekend, Birmingham was playing West Tennessee, a Cub affiliate. Levine has said the Cubs were close to a trade. Bruce Wolf mentioned this morning the Cubs may be going after Wagner and Polanco. These Phillies scouts may have been scouting Cub prospects.

According to Bruce Wolf, CBS Sportsline says the Cubs have interest in Billy Wagner, and Placido Palanco.

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ May 23, 2005 -> 03:53 PM) Hell on a random sidenote. When I first saw the play I just assumed Juan had his arms up acting as if he was catching the ball. Not till I saw the thread had I thought he was signalling foul ball (and I know that having your hands up is also the sign for that...but its also about the same thing you do when your gonna deak a guy acting as if your about to receive a throw). Was I the only one who saw it this way as opposed to the other? That's what I saw, I was wondering what Lee was doing. Uribe's English is supposedly very poor. I don't know if he can say foul. Did he actually say something to Lee, which I find hard to believe that Lee would be able to hear him and understand him, or did Lee go by Uribe holding up his hands.

QUOTE(Soxbadger @ May 23, 2005 -> 03:46 PM) Damn work computer is blowing so this part should of been in the other post: Lie: A false statement deliberately presented as being true; a falsehood. Deliberately presented as true, compared with deception. Now a lie can be a deception, but a deception does not have to be a lie. If you can not understand that, then you just will not understand the difference between the 2 words. Jimh, I would have to hear the specific examples to get into the details of whether I thought they were low brow or not. This is just 1 specific fact pattern where I believe that Uribe should not have said, the ball is foul. He could have acted as if the ball was foul, he could have done other things to decieve Lee, I just think actually saying: The ball is foul, goes over a line of sportsmanship. I agree that Konerko should not have commented in the newspapers, its not his team, or his call. Steff, As I said before, lieing is always deception, deception is not necessarily lieing. I know this is a hard concept for people to grasp, but the words themselves pretty much state the obvious. Lieing is the act of decieving, but deception is not the act of lieing. It is getting some one to believe something based on their own manifestations of what they think is occuring. When Uribe said the ball was fair, Lee did not come to to this conclusion because he misinterpreted the reality, he came to the conclusion because it is what Uribe told him. SB But in order for it to be a lie, Uribe would have to know for a fact that the ball was fair. Has this been confirmed. I see a lot of quotes on the play, but none from him. What if Juan thought the ball was foul? He seems to be mistaken quite often.

When McCarthy plunked Derek Lee yesterday, even though it obviously wasn't on purpose, you better believe the entire Cub dugout was on his ass, trying to get in his young, inexperienced head. I guess in Dusty's world that's gamesmanship, and telling a guy the ball was foul is just wrong.

QUOTE(Jeckle2000 @ May 23, 2005 -> 03:31 PM) I'm not going to read the entire thread, but if your depending on the other team to tell you when a ball is fair or foul, you have problems. Exactly.

QUOTE(Steff @ May 23, 2005 -> 03:25 PM) To be honest.. I think I initially thought that ball was foul.. anyone else..?? I thought it was fair, but I had a great angle, and I thought Konerko should have had it. Derek Lee would have caught it. Uribe, for all we know might have thought is was foul.

Every team in the major leagues tries to deke players, even the Cubs. Outfielders when they don't have a chance to catch a ball will stick their gloves in the air like they are about to make a catch to try and hold the runner to 1 base. When there is a runner on and a groundball goes through the infield, middle infielders will fake trying to turn a DP to get the runner to slide, stopping him from advancing a base. When there is going to be a play at a base, the guy who is going to be making the tag will act like there is no play to get the runner to ease up. Outfielders knowingly trap a ball and act like they caught it. What Uribe did is no different from that. In fact, the crowd noise clearly indicated the ball was fair. Dusty calling it baseball ettiquette is hilarious to me.

If the Cubs are trading and OF and middle reliever for another outfielder and middle reliever AND are giving up 2 prospects you can rest assured they would be giving up Dubois or Hollandsworth, not Patterson.

Can anyone confirm that Levine really reported this?

If the Cubs trade Patterson, they are going to have to get a CF in return, unless with Walker coming back, they want to play Jerry Hairston Jr. there full-time. That would mean Hollandsworth and Dubois would get very little playing time.

If Konerko thinks a teammate did something "ethically" wrong, then he should talk to the teammate about it, not the press. True leaders don't hang teammates, especially ones with limited skills to communicate with the media, out to dry.

Players try to deke each other out every game. I don't have a problem with this. Lee should be running until an umpire tells him the ball is foul. Who knows, Uribe may have actually thought the ball is foul. Don't rely on the opposition to help you out.