Dick Allen

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 02:14 PM) How is that relevant? Very relevant. Does he fit the rebuild if he opts out after 2 years?

Machado certainly will have an opt out or 2 in his deal.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 01:25 PM) They took on >$20 million a year to pick up a top of the league pitcher. I don't care how the White Sox do it. There's nothing wrong with doing so in a trade. If the Angels want to make Mike Trout available am I going to be mad that we had to trade for the player that put us over the top rather than signing a free agent? God no. The Sox can make their call about what guy fits them best after they play this season, but this piddling "Mike Moustakas/Todd Frazier/Jeff Samardzija is good enough!" thinking is what we needed to throw in the trash after 2015. We know how this game works out. You would have a problem with the White Sox trading for Trout once you saw what it cost them in prospects.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 01:28 PM) If this team isn't willing to spend what it takes to bring in the kind of guys that can actually push this team over the top, because they've decided they just wont spend that much, then you're right. If they're not willing to spend money when they have plenty of money to spend, then you're right - they should have just kept spending $110 million a year and been satisfied with 4th place and 75 wins. Hell, this year they'd probably have moved up to 3rd after the Royals fall back. Being willing to spend it doesn't mean it will happen. Others are willing to spend it too.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 12:10 PM) Oh so you're operating on an entirely different assumption of his "likely" contract than anyone else involved in the conversation has been using, but haven't found the time to mention that until now. And your assumption has him, for some unknown reason, agreeing to be paid like a bench player for FOUR YEARS. And I'm the one being purposely deceptive with my numbers. BS I mentioned discount 100 tmes and mentioned my term earler. I think if the Sox thought it was OK for a guy to be aound for 2 years and influence others, they may have gone after Frazier for what he ultimately settled. I have said many times it is unlikely Borax would settle for what the team is willing to pay.

QUOTE (Dam8610 @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 10:55 AM) Where did anyone get the idea that 2019 was part of the window? The only way this team is even competing for a WC spot in 2019 is with a mega signing like Machado, which is why signing Moustakas now makes no sense. Hahn has been hinting 2020 for some time, but recent articles have stated their timeline has been pushed up. If Giolito, Kopech, and Lopez, and Rodon are ready to really pitch in 2019, and Mocada and Jimenez are ready to go, and Anderson takes a couple of steps forward, you are pretty much right there. It may be depend on Cleveland and Minnesota a bit. I was around for the last toal rebuild and the 1990 season. They were hoping to be back to some winning ways for the opening of the new park in 1991. But in 1990 they had the second best record in the AL and 3rd best in baseball, and this was with only a couple of months of Frank Thomas. Of course they didn’t make the playoffs that year. But easily would if history repeated itself. The Cubs also were a year ahead of where they thought they would be.

Sean Miller caught on an FBI wire tap discussing a $100k payment to a recruit. He is done, but his contact is written where he gets 85% of his remaining money even if fired for cause. $10.3 million parting gift for getting the school in trouble and embarrassed. It is funny Jason Terry is leading the charge against this guy. He got caught taking money at Arizona.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 10:34 AM) How? You can only get a qualifying offer once? Yes. I edited my post, when I realized it. Still, if makes sense if 2019 is the year you expect to start contending. If not then the opt out after year 2would be a deal breaker, the fact remains that there are terms where this makes a lot of sense to the White Sox. I don’t think it will get that far, but like the White Sox actually signing Manny Machado, chances aren’t zero.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 10:16 AM) Effectively paying Moose $24M to “win some games” in 2019, losing a high draft pick & corresponding $2M in bonus pool, and then having a hole at 3B again heading into the 2020 seasonon is just dumb, dumb, dumb. Surely you can’t be serious with this proposal. I honestly feel like you’re trolling me right now. You’re usually one of the more logical posters around here, but this idea is just pure insanity. As for Kemp, sure I’d take his contract for a high-end prospect. We just spent $50M on Robert. If I can get Verdugo for eating the remaining $43M I’d certainly do that. The Dodgers won’t so the point is moot anyways. You would get a pick back if he opted out. Edit.I think his comp is done.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 10:01 AM) An opt-out at all would be absolutely stupid. Why are we spending $12M on a lost season AND giving up a high 2nd round pick to have an average-ish player for only one season in which we’re trying to compete? I’d demand Hahn be fired on the spot if he made such a dumb move. Whether we could add Arenado or Rendon after the fact is completely irrelevant to the decision to give Moose a deal with an opt-out clause. The only benefit to any potential Moose deal is cheap long-term control, the moment you give that up all logic for the Sox goes out the window. As I wrote, and opt out after year 1 would make no sense.Weren’t you all over paying Matt Kemp $43 million just as long as they sent over a decent prospect? You value these guys way too much. The second round prospect isn’t a deal breaker. If Moustakas opted out in 2019, and it was a contending year, chances are he help you win some games. That’s far more than you can say about the $43 million you had no problem the White Sox paying Kemp.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 09:54 AM) I find this comment to be insulting. Just because I don’t agree with a potential move, doesn’t mean I’d hate the actual player if they were added to the team. Moose isn’t a bad player or some sort of scumbag. I’d have absolutely no will towards him. I simply don’t align with the strategy behind adding him. There’s nothing personal about this. You say he is average if he is a 3B and bad if he is anything else; and wouldn’t agree with his presence. You would be pissed off he is with the team.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 09:24 AM) I don’t see Boras ever agreeing to that deal without opt-outs. And the moment an opt-out is included, the deal makes zero sense for the Sox. But if there is an opt out after year 2 and he opts out, it means he must have played pretty well and opens up 3B for the other two potential signees, or then they pay him the going rate. If they White Sox will have all this flexibility you have claimed, it’s a non issue. I would admit an opt out after year 1would make zero sense to the team,

QUOTE (ron883 @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 09:26 AM) It's ok to admit you were wrong DA. You dont need to argue your opinion to the death. Exactly what I am wrong about? If Moustakas flops, then I will have been wrong, although I have never mentioned anything about signing him at full price, when will you start the next Jose Abreu is a bum thread?

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 09:24 AM) I don’t see Boras ever agreeing to that deal without opt-outs. And the moment an opt-out is included, the deal makes zero sense for the Sox. I don’t think you have anything to worry about. You more than likely won’t have to hatefully watch Mike Moustakas is a White Sox uniform.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 09:06 AM) Ignore the numbers? I’m aware of the numbers. Being the the 3rd or 4th best DH right now doesn’t mean you’re a big contributor. I just said I don’t agree with how the position is being utilized, but clearly ignore that. And I don’t want to pay $12M to $16M on a 1 WAR DH. Us having a lot of money to play with doesn’t mean we have endless amounts of money and it definitely doesn’t mean we shouldn’t allocate it as efficiently as possible. And how often are guys traded a year after signing a multi-year deal? How do you think our players would feel about that? How would future potential free agents feel about that? Things don’t happen in a vacuum and that sends a bad message IMO. And who exactly is trading for him when they could just sign him right now to this disoc***ed deal? Considering Moustakas is getting only one year offers, if the White Sox sign him for 4 years and trade him, most likely to a pretty good team if it comes to that, I don’t think there would be much outrage. And that is not even considering they did it because they gave another player $350 million.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 09:12 AM) Give me an example of a discounted price? 4/$48 million

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 08:59 AM) Yolmer improved his 3-season OPS by over .130 last year. If he takes another step up, he may be more than a utility infielder. The "super utility" guy would be more likely Leury, as he can play OF. He had a similar improvement in OPS, but he also had a bump the prior year (in AAA and the majors). It's pretty clear they can be utility players...the quest is to see if they can become more. But even discovering utility players is helpful - the Sox spent large sums on utility level veterans this decade. Yolmer took a huge leap and was still below average offensively. To expect another one isn’t realistic. Most projections think he will go the other way.He has a nice glove and is perfect as a back up.p on a contending team. No team has ever had too many good players. Let alone the White Sox. If the opportunity to get one for a discounted price comes along, it is probably a good idea to take it. I doubt the price will come down far enough for Moustakas considering his agent and his agents ability to pull things out the last second, but there is probably a small chance, it would probably mean Tyler Saladin would need to hire a mover.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 08:44 AM) With the way pitchers get hurt, probably longer than "second straight." It's a shame. You are right. And there will be more soon, unfortunately.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 08:35 AM) I don’t care how teams are utilizing the position, he’d be a poor, over-paid contributor at DH. And I’ve said multiple times I value the DH spot and don’t really buy into the rotating DH concept. I like a dedicated guy that is a proven plus hitter, which is why I was pushing for a JD Martinez signing all offseason. That would not be Moose. So don’t look at the numbers , ignore all you have said about how much money the White Sox have, ignore he would be a top 3 or 4 DH. Just say he was bad. OK. Why don’t we move on to the other thing that is ignored. If you sign someone else, why couldn’t you trade him?

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 08:29 AM) Come on Dick, that’s an obvious marketing piece. He played 3B last year while Tim f***ing Beckham played SS. If needed to play SS why didn’t he force this move last year? I think he’ll be open to 3B or SS as long as he gets paid. Beckham came at the deadline. He wasn’t going to switch then.You can’t be sure. Maybe with the Yankees, the team he loved growing up. He clearly wants to be a SS. Who knows, maybe having Moustakas helps the White Sox cause, knowing he was signed to be a SS. I don’t think his market shrinks if he demands to play SS.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 08:21 AM) It’s not about the money, it’s the fact that Moustakas would be a bad 1B or DH. I just don’t see the allure of Moose unless you’re keeping him at 3B. And I don’t believe in buying average-ish players at this point in the rebuild, not when there are going to be four impact players hitting free agency when it makes more sense for us to spend. Why would he be a bad DH? Before you answer, you might want to check DH stats.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 08:08 AM) I would go after Bryce Harper too, but 3B is a much bigger hole for the organization than the OF. And Harper is going to get an even more ridiculous contract than Machado. Might want to read this if you think Machado solves 3B. He plans to remain a SS. https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/mlb/c...kees/347912002/

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 07:53 AM) But it doesn’t have to be Machado. Donaldson, Arenado, & Rendon will also be options. The idea we can’t land any of those players is ridiculous. Who are all these teams that are going to outbid us? Once the Yankees land Machado in your scenario they’re out of the equation for the other guys. Maybe the Dodgers eat the last year of Turner’s deal and go after Arenado or Rendon? I honestly think if those two teams are out, we’re in a tremendous spot to land one of the remaining guys. And I’m not completely ruling out the idea we can compete with those teams for Machado or whoever their favorite is, but I’d literally take any of those four guys over Moose. I know the idea of Donaldson gets a lot of hate around here because he’s in his 30s, but the dude is an absolute stud and would be a great addition at the right price. Sure there would be risk, but playing it safe with a Moustakas signing is not how we’re going to compete with the Astros & Yankees. But why don’t you ever mention Bryce Harper?who knows, Avi might return to the former Avi, the more people talk, the more Eloy is a LF. Anyone would take those 4 over Moustakas. But, if your financial scenario is anywhere near correct, signing Moustakas doesn’t preclude going after any of them. You can always upgrade later and fit them in on the roster whether it is trading Moustakas, making him a DH, moving him to 1b because Abreu is no longer there....

QUOTE (SoxAce @ Feb 24, 2018 -> 07:46 AM) Wasn't Harper the guy who blasted sox management on Twitter over the LaRoche (ex teammate/friend) situation? Yea, probably a good reason why he's not talked about around here. And I don't think the "money talks" will apply to Bryce either. He'll get his. I don’t believe he blasted the White Sox.

But why does not anyone pin the legitimacy of the rebuild on signing Harper vs. signing Machado? Harper seems to be the better of the 2 to me, and he is never mentioned. Is there a $350 million cutoff of being cheap? I guess the real question is why is everyone realistic about the chances of Harper being a White Sox, but no so much on Machado? 29 teams aren’t going to sign him, and most of those 29 teams aren’t cheap, could definitely use him, can fit ihim in the payroll, and are either in legit rebuilds or legitimately contenders. Signing Machado should be like winning the lottery. Awesome if it happens, but counting on it is pretty silly.