caulfield12

The sturdy lefty is in line for a market-value contract ($24 million-$25 million per season) and that’s suddenly too rich for the Red Sox’ taste. It doesn’t matter that Lester is a player who has proven he can succeed in the crucible of Boston baseball and had the second-best pitcher WAR (wins above replacement) in major league baseball at the start of Wednesday. There is no question being burned by bad long-term deals given to Carl Crawford, Adrian Gonzalez, and Josh Beckett has distorted how the Sox view re-signing Lester. Aging baby-boomers can identify with the Sox’ new team-building approach. They don’t trust anyone over 30. Meet the risk-averse Red Sox, who are willing to cede one of the single biggest advantages derived from being in this baseball-obsessed market — the financial might to write off bad contracts. Deals that would be crippling for other clubs can be sold off by the Sox because they have a fan base that is willing to have its fealty monetized. But the Sox want to build their team now like they have the budget of the Kansas City Royals. You don’t have to be legendary political economist Adam Smith to figure out that if the Sox are going to try to legislate a one-team market correction for baseball they’re going to miss out on some quality players. The persistent trade talk and seeming inevitability of a Lester deal made being at Fenway feel like waiting in line at the RMV — tedious, joyless, but entirely mandatory. It only got worse during the game, as the Sox sank back to 12 games below .500 (48-60). At about 3:15 p.m, Twitter reports filtered in that the Sox had traded away a homegrown lefthanded pitcher who overpowered the Cardinals in the 2013 World Series. But it wasn’t Lester. The Sox shipped malcontent Felix Doubront to old friend Theo Epstein and the Chicago Cubs. Doubront just beat the Sox by two days in completely quitting on this team, after his embarrassing relief “effort’’ on Monday in a 14-1 drubbing by the Blue Jays. Lester, who has been one of the few bright spots for the Sox, going 10-7 with a 2.52 ERA, was originally supposed to start Wednesday night against the Blue Jays. But the Sox announced Tuesday that Brandon Workman would make the start. No need to risk damaging the merchandise before you hawk it for maximum value. www.bostonglobe.com

Aaron Hill, Chase Utley or Martin Prado...all of those guys are a lot more interesting to the Giants than Beckham, and they're all familiar with the NL West/NL in general.

QUOTE (SoxnGiants @ Jul 31, 2014 -> 07:31 AM) I think we will add a guy and trade a guy. 1. Gordon will be traded to the NL for a low level prospect 2. We will acquire Cervelli from the Yanks for a mid prospect, nothing special. Why would we want a veteran back-up in Cervelli? How is that the solution to the catching problem?

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jul 31, 2014 -> 05:21 AM) So you listed a 1B, two IFs, and two AA OFs as better replacements for Viciedo than Danks, which makes no sense. On top of that, the only one of those players that actually has a shot of being an important member of our next playoff team is Semien, who hopefully will be replacing Beckham at 2B in the near future. Him playing OF is possible but unlikely, especially this year. If we trade Viciedo, Danks or Taylor will take his spot on the roster until Garcia is ready. Saladino and Semien can both play the OF. Micah Johnson's most likely the choice for 2B, so that leaves Semien as a jack of all trades replacing Leury Garcia unless Alexei Ramirez is traded. I wouldn't put Semien in CF, but I'm sure he would be fine in LF. The point is that if Garcia is playing in September in RF/LF/DH, then they should give those at-bats to someone who has a future with the White Sox. Michael Taylor is already 29. We're dumping Viciedo at age 25, why would we want to invest time and development with Taylor at the major league level? Sierra makes just as much, if not more, sense than Taylor. We know what we have in Danks, he's a 4th/5th outfielder at best. Of course, they also have to trade/waive DeAza if they want to open up LF, since what's the point of keeping DeAza on the roster? DeAza is either going to sit on the bench or take away time from another player.

QUOTE (The Ultimate Champion @ Jul 31, 2014 -> 07:14 AM) I very strongly diagree with the bolded. We're still a few core pieces away from being at that point. Maybe a couple of them will come in-house, like a 2B for one, but we won't know until they are here showing themselves as MLB ballplayers. For all purposes we're a contender no sooner than 2016, that's how we should approach the deadline & offseason. Danks is a back end starter getting paid like a mid-rotation starter. There are several contracts that are worse, and Danks isn't too much of an overpayment, and Danks *could* even perform up to his deal or even slightly exceed it assuming he continues to develop into a different type of pitcher. But I'm not seeing any leverage here in possessing a likely back-end SP at market value or above that isn't in demand. If there's no real demand where does our leverage come from? No we don't *have* to trade Danks but if we pass this up and keep him we could really end up regretting it. The Yanks are in a tough spot ATM where they need SP and can't afford much, and so maybe the extent of our leverage in negotiations is forcing them to take on at least 90% or more of the remaining deal. Maybe there's a good amount of leverage in that. You're assuming we could just basically give the Danks contract to the Yankees and they would take him off our hands, like Rios when KW claimed him off waivers. I think if that was the case, Hahn would let him go in a heartbeat. I don't understand why we would have much leverage with the Astros flooding the market with their top 3 starters...and the Yankees already having picked up Capuano and McCarthy. The only real leverage we have is working against us, those other AL East teams (Blue Jays, Orioles) knowing that Lester is out there and that the Red Sox don't want him to go to the Yankees. Especially if Hamels is off the market...looks like the Rays will hold onto Price until the off-season or next trade deadline.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jul 31, 2014 -> 12:49 AM) I'm guessing Seattle finally gets Viciedo. I'm hoping Beckham gets traded to the Giants. Danks' brother replaces Viciedo the rest of this year. Semien replaces Beckham. That's one sure way to get a Top 10 draft pick next season, lol. If they're going to play someone, it might as well be Saladino, Wilkins, Semien, Mitchell or even Trayce Thompson in LF. Like, someone who's actually going to be an important member of our next playoff team.

This month’s Kenta Maeda watch: the 26-year-old Japanese righty is down to a 2.08 ERA in 15 starts. Can't remember the name of the Korean pitcher who was being hyped in the off-season. Found him. http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1946537...xt-hyun-jin-ryu Here's a story on the Korean pitcher represented by Boras who has drawn interest from at least six teams... Suk-Min Yoon Yoon is on the small side, standing at an even six feet and weighing 180 pounds. He throws in the mid-90s, though, and complements his fastball with a hard, biting slider and a change-up that MLB scouts describe as above average. Though a starter, he has only thrown what we would consider an entire season's work (~175+ IP) once, in 2011. As best I can gather, the average starter in the KBO throws around 150 to 180 innings, making 25 to 30 starts, per season, often supplementing those starts with relief outings here and there. Based on the above video, Yoon doesn’t feature a devastating splitter like Tanaka or a tantalizing breaking ball(s) like Yu Darvish. However, as is the case with most Korean and Japanese pitchers, everything he throws has late movement, which should aid Yoon’s effectiveness as he transitions into Major League Baseball.

QUOTE (VAfan @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 12:48 PM) Exactly!! The closer job should have been between Petricka and Webb, once Jones was gone and Lindstrom first semi-failed in the job and then made the choice easy by getting hurt. Putnam should have made the 3rd guy in the "close games" bullpen group. In addition to getting better performance out of these guys, they are guys the Sox can potentially groom and cultivate like they did with Reed and Jones. Whereas Bellisario and Guerra and Downs were all rent-a-players with no future in the Sox pen. Except exposing Webb to that role would have had him back in AA before the end of another month of games. He's clearly not ready for high-leverage situations and they've been nursing him along hoping he could turn it around and get a run going to build his confidence. Petricka's never been a minor league closer, and was a starter for most of his time in our system. It would have hardly been fair to just thrust him into that role when you have experienced guys who have been in those situations before. You never know...this treatment has worked in the past, we protected Santos even with his great stuff and he evolved into the natural candidate. If there's one issue with Ventura this year, it's not misusing Petricka and especially Webb. Finding the most favorable closing situations for Petricka vs. Putnam is the right approach, just like Ozzie protected Viciedo from tough RH pitching from 2010-2011, and now we know why (although he's done okay against RHP, finally, this season).

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 12:47 PM) That supports Ventura walking Harper to get to Zimmerman. Which is exactly what happened. The one thing I'll say about this is it's not like Dylan Axelrod was Jon Garland circa 2003. I'm pretty sure KW and Hahn never believed with his lack of stuff that he was a long-term solution. We can say that he was testing/teaching Axelrod all you want, but your first responsibility is to win games. Unless you're dealing with one of the top pitching prospects in the system, "teachable moment" or finding something to build upon for future use shouldn't rank high because where's the payoff from that? I wouldn't even accept it if it was Noesi on the mound, because he has more ability...but not with a Carroll or Axelrod. In those cases, you do what it takes to preserve the lead or hold the tie unless of course your bullpen isn't rested and the starter has to stay in.

Has anyone noticed that Hammel has quite quickly come back down to earth pitching in the AL?

Well, considering we've always wanted to avoid paying relievers in arbitration since the Jenks years...and we're not even sure if he is going to be capable of being a high-quality 7th and 8th inning set-up guy in 2016, I'd say it's an interesting decision. Since the White Sox have adopted the philosophy that they can turn someone else's junk (Guerra, Noesi, Carroll, Belisario, Putnam, Cleto, Boggs, H.Rodriguez) into a bullpen piece, I'd say it's 50/50 at best they keep him. If he was left-handed and this was Matt Thornton after his first couple of seasons with the Sox, there would be no question about it. Otoh, Nate came up with the White Sox through our system, so there's going to be more of a likelihood to be "loyal." That said, baseball is a business and it's not only a UCL, it's the back issue, which we don't know a whole lot about. Can we be 100% sure his mechanics weren't/aren't going to be thrown off in the future compensating for back issues and putting undue stress on another part of the body. That's basically what happened with the Marlins' young ace, unfortunately.

QUOTE (BigHurt3515 @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 03:36 PM) I think we can get a similar return for Danks or maybe better if we take some salary Which the White Sox almost never do...unless you count $1 million for Rios. Or Linebrink. But 90% of the time, they would rather save the money and forgo the prospects.

Big decision now for the front office whether they want to pay him for another year of non-activity.

Being inside the protected picks isn't going to matter that much, because we're not going after Lester, Scherzer or Shields. Same thing with Sandoval and Hanley Ramirez. Who else would we be interested in that's going to get a QO? Russell Martin, I guess. But 15 teams will be after a catcher. Yasmani Thomas and Rusney Castillo wouldn't be affected by being in the protected 10 picks. Same with the Japanese starting pitcher (although I think after what happened with Tanaka they would steer clear). Nelson Cruz should be on our target list...but for nothing more than a 2 year contract with an option for a third year. Victor Martinez...maybe? But probably going back to the Tigers in all likelihood. Seems we'll be picking through the bargain/flawed/damaged goods bin, looking at guys like Masterson, Colby Rasmus, Michael Morse, etc.

I think I actually like the second one in the Hobbit series more than the first, but you always knew it was going to pale in comparison to the Lord of the Rings Trilogy. Can't say it was the wrong step not to have the Hobbit first, because the interest might have waned before they ever got to LOTR. Sort of like what happened with the C.S. Lewis series following The Lion, The Witch and The Wardrobe.

QUOTE (oldsox @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 06:17 AM) Hawk used to say, "I love to watch Ray run." I love to watch Eaton run. First to home, who is faster? Eaton by a hair I think. I'd give the advantage to Durham on triples by a half-step, on the other hand.

QUOTE (Feeky Magee @ Jul 30, 2014 -> 03:01 AM) This is great info for a stats/farm nerd. Keep posting man! Sounds like Pitching 101 from the Minnesota Twins from 2001-2010 (Rick Anderson)...first pitch strikes can make up for a lot of deficiencies, although having Radke, Santana and Liriano helped a lot, too.

1) Relievers are fungible Who were the five best non-closer relievers in baseball last season? About about in 2012? And in 2011? The list in 2013, judged by ERA+ is Neil Cotts, Luis Avilan, Alex Torres, Craig Breslow and Tanner Scheppers. In 2012, it was Scott Atchison, Eric O'Flaherty, Darren Oliver, Robbie Ross and Jake McGee. In 2011, it was David Robertson, O'Flaherty, Scott Downs, Mike Adams and Greg Holland. One name duplicated on the lists, which looked at relievers who did not have a start, threw at least 50 innings with an ERA+ of 150 or better and less than 10 saves. In 2014, none of the players from 2012 fit that criteria, much less make the top five. That's despite lowering the inning cap to 30 for the current season, too. The point is that relievers are fungible. They rarely sustain success from year to year. Remember when Mike Adams was a setup man extraordinaire? Outside of San Diego, he's proven just as unreliable as any other non-closer. Closers, too, will often be unreliable, which is why so many teams look to bolster their bullpen as they try to contend. Who would have thought two years ago that Koji Uehara would become unhittable or that Zach Britton would turn into a great closer for the Orioles? But, that success rarely lasts. With someone like Houston's Tony Sipp, what are the chances that he's able to remain this good for multiple seasons? What are the chances he pitches like he did in 2013 with Arizona or his 2010 or 2012 seasons in Cleveland? If teams are lucky, they nab one reliable closer for a two-year stretch. That's what Houston did with Chad Qualls and why they're likely to keep him around next year, too. But, counting on multiple guys performing that well? It's asking for trouble. Houston's not going to just give Sipp away. After all, he's cheap and under team control past this season. But, if a contender needs a lefty and is willing to give up talent for him? They make that move 10 times out of 10. www.crawfishboxes.com You likely won’t find a reliever cracking the top 10, but closers David Robertson, Francisco Rodriguez, Casey Janssen and Rafael Soriano have been excellent, while Luke Gregerson and Andrew Miller have been lights out in a setup capacity. www.mlbtraderumors.com (Tim Dierkes power ratings for FA's)

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jul 29, 2014 -> 11:27 PM) With Sale, Quintana, and presumably Rodon, Sox don't need to invest resources an another Ace level starter. What the Sox need is pitching depth. The gains from that aren't as great as the gains we would get from a couple of 3/4s, a LF who can hit. Or a 2b. Tyler Flowers and AJ Pierzynski are 24th and 25th (next to last and last) in OPS for catchers with 225 or more PA's.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jul 29, 2014 -> 11:27 PM) With Sale, Quintana, and presumably Rodon, Sox don't need to invest resources an another Ace level starter. What the Sox need is pitching depth. The gains from that aren't as great as the gains we would get from a couple of 3/4s, a LF who can hit. Or a 2b. Tyler Flowers and AJ Pierzynski are 24th and 25th (next to last and last) in OPS for catchers with 225 or more PA's.

I think it's worth remembering that Torre was fired by three organizations, the Mets, Braves and Cardinals. It took all those negative experiences for him to finally put it together with the Yankees. Yes, Ventura has a very calm and poised demeanor. He doesn't get too high or too low. He's not a rah rah type or a tactician. I still can't imagine him (RV) dealing with the press as well as Torre does in markets like NY, Philly, Boston, etc. You also have to remember that Torre had some great coaching staffs with guys like Stottlemyre and Zimmer to lend a helping hand. With the White Sox, other than Cooper and maybe Steverson, it's hard to say that we've consistently that one of the best support staffs because until recently we've usually been limited to former White Sox players except for hitting coaches. Ventura's definitely not one of the top 10-15 in terms of strategy/tacticianship...that's obvious. And I'm not sure what managers could have led the 2012 White Sox past the Tigers...or held onto the lead. We'll never know. That said, he's done as well as possible or better than expected with the 2012 and 2014 White Sox, and much worse than expected last year....a team that arguably had a lot more talent and more veterans but simply gave up and mailed it in. He's kept this year's team together (I think having a younger, hungrier team helps) until this point. There's not much any manager could do with only three decent starters, a mess of a bullpen....and outside of Eaton, Ramirez, Gillaspie and Abreu, there have been a lot of offensive disappointments (DeAza, Beckham, Viciedo, Flowers). Dunn has been about where we expected. In short, two superstars have really kept this team within hailing distance of .500 for most of the season. So once again it's hard to say Ventura has been great when there are 2 guys in Sale and Abreu capable of finishing in the Top 3 of the MVP and Cy Young races.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Jul 29, 2014 -> 09:40 PM) Giants make too much sense for Beckham They're looking at Aaron Hill or Chase Utley, if they can pry him away from the Phillies. Beckham doesn't make sense in that sentence. Both would be better fits than Beckham in the NL (especially Hill), and would have an easier transition to an NL playoff race/clubhouse.

QUOTE (LDF @ Jul 29, 2014 -> 05:41 AM) I just don't know, are they trying to soft soap HOU miss deeds by reporting that HOU has subtly improve the talent in the minors? I will admit I am confused on the intent of the article. I guess the national baseball media has really been hard on the Astros this year...and the Astros' version of SoxTalk, some of the main writers are wondering why all of a sudden the local media (it would be like if the Trib and Sun-Times suddenly had White Sox players anonymously complaining about Robin Ventura's managerial style or Don Cooper or something that always stays in the clubhouse leaking). Also, this idea that it's so weird or unusual for a minor league prospect to stop by in the morning on his way to another assignment (when he has to go from Lancaster, CA to Corpus Christi and Houston's in the middle anyway)...to work with the major league pitching coach. It's obviously a pretty negative environment in Houston right now....and the team has also gone into another tailspin after getting close to respectability about a month ago. Interestingly, nobody's complaining about possibly trading those three starters. Just that they might not get as much as they want for Kuechel (or Keuchel, however you spell it) and that Cosart has a reputation for being difficult for everyone to deal with (your basic prima dona, pain in the ass), so that might also hurt his value too despite having the best stuff of the three.

There's a reason we're proud of the fact that the White Sox had the most quality starts over a period covering much of the time Cooper has been here. Sure, worst-case scenario it's a 4.50 ERA for the game, but usually not. It's saying more often than not, a team with a good offense/bullpen has a chance to win the majority of his starts. Worth the money we're paying him? Probably not. Can we recover from trading him? Surely, just as easily as the Astros if they trade their top 3 (and Danks is really a 4th starter now, or a 3 on a bottom 1/3rd of the league team).

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Jul 28, 2014 -> 11:10 PM) Damn Goose, that's cold. He probably got confused with Ramon, Jose or Benito or something...wasn't exactly clear who the autograph was for.