caulfield12

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ May 12, 2013 -> 03:46 PM) Again we repeat: Viciedo's biggest asset in the field is his arm. If you put him at 1b, you lose what is actually an asset. If he's average at getting to the ball, or becomes that with time, then his arm will make him an effective OF. And again, I repeat, DeAza is not part of the long-term picture and Viciedo will go back there as soon as a trade that nets us something productive in return is possible. With a sub 300 OPS and striking out as much as he has and playing close to the worst LF in the majors...that's not in the cards right now. However, without a escalating contract and still relatively close to his prime, there's no DIRE need to trade or dump him ASAP unless there's a suitable replacement.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 12, 2013 -> 09:42 AM) So why is Bell getting blamed for the players not developing? Because he's in charge of overseeing the entire minor league system/operations.

Well, the Tigers playing sloppy baseball keeps us within hailing distance of first place. But it's also stacking up three more teams right behind the Tigers that are all playing better than the Sox. The more we play this way or tread water (the upcoming road trip probably won't help our record, either)....the more flavum's mathematical win prediction models turn against us from a statistical probability perspective.

QUOTE (2nd_city_saint787 @ May 12, 2013 -> 02:49 PM) it's May 12th guys, the weather has yet to even really heat up. With the pitching we have and the fact that we're ONLY 6 games out I don't see why we can't compete this year. We probably don't have enough to actually catch the Tigers but I can certainly see us being competitive this year. We've seen Lexi carry this team at times, Dayan has the potential to get hot and carry the team, Beckham coming back could be a positive thing, Dunn has shown signs of light lately, and hopefully PK starts to turn it around at some point. If we can swing a trade at some point for a quality catcher I think we can be an above .500 team. The last thing we want to do is trade someone like Erik Johnson for a "less than sure thing" return at catcher. Those are the kinds of trades that will kill off our future. We're a LOT more than just a good catcher away from competing this season. We're at least 3 players away, if not more. Without Dunn or Konerko hitting and staying on the roster and playing nearly every day, it's impossible, to be honest.

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ May 12, 2013 -> 03:05 PM) The team has a real strength at pitching. We are solid with gld glove fielders at SS and 2B. We need a 1Bman only because Konerko will retire soon. We need a 3Bman. We seem to be set pretty good in LF and if we decide to sign Rios again then we are good at RF. CF could be iffy. De Aza ain't bad but we might upgrade. Catching is an issue. Now we do have some good looking OF prospects in the minors. How far away are they? Two years maybe? This team ain't bad now but we do need a resurgent Dunn and see if Gillaspie can perform at 3B. Now that one takes a bit of time. With Adam Dunn you just don't know if the time has run out. I hope not but he just hasn't shown anything If Beckham hits, we're solid/he's solid as a starter. That's whether he's at SS or 2B, doesn't matter...he has to be more than a 625 or 650 hitter with the offensive holes in other places. DeAza, with his defensive lapses and low OBP, is far from "set." Good looking prospects doesn't equal results at the major league level...in fact, there's nothing in recent Sox development history to believe ANY of them will become successful. The last two that even stuck at the big league level are Ryan Sweeney and Chris Young. Finally, we're DOUBTFUL to give Rios ANY type of long-term extension at his age. We hold a 2015 option on him, but the odds, at the end of the next two seasons....of still wanting him around when you're totally revamping/rebuilding your offense and looking to get younger....? Plus, his defense this season has been almost as lackluster as his CF play in 2011.

QUOTE (chitownsportsfan @ May 12, 2013 -> 12:46 PM) Yea as Balta noted these "bold moved" are nothing but crazy. Let's see, the defense stinks so lets trade the best defender on the team so we can move a guy who hasn't played there full time since he was in Birmingham 5 years ago and then, we can put the excellent (sarcasm alert) Keppinger at 2B full time! (Ummm...no, eventually Sanchez/Semien/trade acquisition would go there...where did anyone ever say they want Keppinger playing full-time at ANY position?) Do you know how god awful that infield defense would be? Gillaspie/Beckham/Keppinger/Dunn/Konerko. There are softball teams in Chicago that have better infields than that. That's only a slight exaggeration. (Konerko is obviously not part of this team's future.) Furthermore, if the Sox are having a fire sale with "bold moves" the last thing they want back is sunk costs like Upton. The Sox would be much better off just working out a buyout with Dunn rather than taking on salary back in any trade.(When's the last time this happened with guaranteed contracts in MLB? We're not talking NFL fantasy world, the MLB Player's Union and agents would KILL Dunn for doing that.) You want to bench a 24 year old Viciedo (who, by the way, has the 3rd highest OPS on the team) so you can bring in Justin Upton? That just doesn't make any sense either.(Long term, you trade DeAza when you can get something back in return, and reinsert Viciedo because it's never a good idea to make someone a full-time DH at that age. For the remainder of this season, it's fine. He goes to 1B as soon as Konerko retires/is traded.) Fairly paid, still usefull players like Ramirez and Viciedo are hardly part of the problem. The big problems on this team are, in order: Dunn, Keppinger, Flowers. Those guys are worse than replacement and in Dunn's case, he's eating up over 20% of the payroll. ($15 million is not 20% of $108 million) Any sort of "bold move" starts with committing to a complete rebuilding. That means working out a buyout or trade with Dunn (eating most of his salary), and then trading the few assets the team has, maybe packaging them together to get the most value. That means Konerko, Peavy, Crain, Thornton, Lindstron should all be on the block. (That's exactly what I am proposing, except the White Sox are too stubborn to give away more than $5 million, it has NEVER happened, EVER. Who is Lindstron?) Rios and De Aza should be available in the right deal. Everyone is tradeable in the right deal on a team this bad, but to suggest that the first player off the island should be Ramirez is absurd. (Is Ramirez going to have more value in 2014 or 2015? What about his declining OPS and inconsistent defense makes you believe that?)

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 12, 2013 -> 10:00 AM) His stats were ridiculous, but he wasn't considered a top prospect with Toronto. I do agree, his approach was sustainable. The White sox haven't produced a bat in almost a decade and they still were contending. If guys were just average offensively thus far this year, we would be talking about who they would be adding to make a run at Detroit. As long as you have some projectable arms, teams will dump payroll eventually and will take some lottery tickets in exchange for payroll relief. The problem is we're more than one Edwin Jackson or bat away from competing in the Central still. We have four teams stacked up ahead of us...and that's 3 1/2 games ahead in the standings. So let's not trade Erik Johnson unless someone who knows something about pitching (and not Buddy Bell) is 100% convinced he's not going to be the next Gio, Hudson or McCarthy.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ May 12, 2013 -> 10:05 AM) Why would the Braves trade for a guy who is worse than the guy they are trading and send money back? If Rick Hahn can get rid of Adam Dunn's contract, he deserves a lifetime contract. Have you seen Upton's stats? Don't you think a lot of NL teams believe he might do better back in the senior circuit? The White Sox are never going to take on an extra $42.5 million commitment for Upton. Maybe it's not $30 million we would be asking for, but there has to be a number between 0 and $30,000,000 that would satisfy both parties (at some point soon).

QUOTE (Lillian @ May 12, 2013 -> 09:48 AM) I think that Caulfield's argument makes sense, if I understand it correctly. I guess the point is that the only way the Sox can likely rid themselves of the Dunn contract is to trade him in exchange for some other team's bad contract. If that could realistically be accomplished, and the player offered some positive benefit to the team, it might be worth it. As it stands now, Dunn is not only incapable of making any positive contribution, but he is killing the offense. The only thing that I wonder is whether or not it might make even more sense to simply not play him. Why couldn't we just treat him as though he were an injured player, and go on without him? At least it would afford an opportunity for another player to get some playing time. That would be fine if we had anyone on our major league, Charlotte or Birmingham roster who could be a capable DH right now. Black and Wilkins are long shots, but definitely not ready for PT yet. Maybe Phegley's the best bet...for now, but he might be needed for catcher. He needs to prove he can hit consistently for at least 2-3 months at the AAA level first. Theoretically, it would be Wise, but he will go south if played extensively against RH and LH pitching. Not to mention his age...and the fact that what we get out of him in the short term (advantageously) would be more than offset negatively by shutting down Dunn, essentially.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 12, 2013 -> 08:32 AM) So does this mean Kenny didn't draft so badly afterall? Why would you possibly say that? And wasn't Laumann the main advisor to KW on the draft, not Bell?

Depends on how much cash is involved. The most money we've ever eaten at one time is Linebrink's, and that was less than $5 million. Like it or not, Rios is our best player. If we're going to sacrifice Dunn, so to speak, it's better to get talent back for Rios and keep the Dunn situation separate.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ May 12, 2013 -> 08:29 AM) After the Nick Swisher disaster, why would we look to trade our players for nothing at their lowest value? Because we're buying equally low on another player who will contribute more to our future in Upton. It's a new GM, and the past is not always prelude. It's a calculated risk, like assuming the Rios contract. Or trading for an injured Peavy. Or signing John Danks and Chris Sale to long-term extensions. But having 2011/2013 Adam Dunn on the roster and hitting 3rd/4th/5th until doomsday is going to do more than merely $30 million in damage to the payroll. It's going to kill the interest of all but the most die-hard fans. It's a business. At some point, the ROI or cost-benefit analysis of getting rid of Dunn is going to be more than the potential payoff of him POSSIBLY turning it around. It didn't happen in 2011, and he had the appendectomy excuse. This is not just 2013, it's for most of 2012 as well...after the hot 2+ month stretch that carried him statistically for a large part of the year. Things finally turned around with Alex Rios....but the Las Vegas odds of it happening with Dunn AGAIN have to be less than 15%.

QUOTE (Lillian @ May 12, 2013 -> 08:19 AM) What kind of assurances have the Braves given Justin that his brother won't be traded? How might such a move effect Justin's performance? At least the Dunn contract will be off the books after next season. Taking on Upton's contract could be a problem until 2018. If we received $30 back, the net payroll addition would only be $12.5 million over those future years. That's more than manageable. We're on the hook for $30 million to Dunn anyway. It's a calculated risk or gamble, and a GM would be staking his job on that kind of move (like acquiring Vernon Wells' deal from the Blue Jays).

QUOTE (Brian @ May 12, 2013 -> 08:17 AM) Why would the Braves want Dunn when they have Freddie Freeman at 1st? They would have to play him in LF, possibly RF. Heyward in RF, Justin Upton to CF, Dunn in LF probably. Or Heyward in CF, Dunn in LF, Upton in RF. Nobody said it would be the ideal solution...from a defensive standpoint. And Dunn failed in 2011 under Walker, so that goes against the grain as well.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/atlanta-brave...-043100830.html First bold move. Trade Adam Dunn to the Atlanta Braves for BJ Upton and $30 million (to be paid in three installments...$9 million in 2014, $10 million in 2015, $11 million in 2016). Obviously Greg Walker isn't going to "fix" Upton, and Manto can't fix Dunn again. Dunn gets to go back to the NL, where he found success throughout his career. Upton gets to play in a less difficult AL division, where he's more confident and familiar. Outfield becomes DeAza in LF, Upton in CF and Rios in RF, with Viciedo/Gillaspie sharing time at DH (Viciedo could also rotate in LF/1B, Gillaspie at 3B, possibly 1B). We have to shore up our outfield defense, and we've got to get rid of Dunn somehow. We're on the hook for $30 million more of Dunn (including this season), the Braves would get out of $42.5 million committed to Upton. Our net risk would be $12.5 million MORE in payroll commitment, but the odds of fixing Upton and making him a credible player in the AL Central are 10X higher than Dunn getting straightened out again. Plus, we'd get a player closer to his prime who would be around for the next five seasons and could be another player to build around...along with Viciedo and possibly Beckham at SS. Fresh start/change of scenery for both players. Maybe it would spark the Sox. No amount of money's going to undo the damage of a .130ish hitting Dunn in the 3-4-5 spots in our line-up for the next 2 seasons. Second bold move. Alexei Ramirez traded for salary relief, Beckham moved to SS full-time for the remainder of 2013. Wait until mid-July to decide the fate/s of Flowers, Rios, DeAza, Thornton, Peavy, Crain and Lindstrom. Let's also see where John Danks is in his recovery so we can decide whether to hold onto Jake or try to compete without him in 2014. It's worth noting how badly the 2010 team started out before catching fire. That team was 1-2 weeks from a full-scale firesale. Even the 2001 team without Thomas started out 14-29 and made it back to over .500 in July, for that matter. Third bold move. Package Addison Reed and Jake Peavy to get the best possible package back if the team's completely out of the hunt in July and Upton still appears a lost cause until the offseason...Reed might never have more value to the franchise than he does right now. But, if you know your White Sox history, you know every closer's replaceable.

QUOTE (Lillian @ May 12, 2013 -> 05:48 AM) Fortunately, his presence on this team is of very little importance. When Beckham returns he would have been relegated to the bench anyway. There is no way he should take Gillaspie's place at 3RD, except for the occasional LH starting pitcher. The Sox need Gillaspie's left handed bat in the lineup, and he's much better on defense than Keppinger. Keppinger's poor performance is the least of this team's problems, as is glaringly apparent to everyone. As long as we keep him for three years....well, can afford to keep him for the three guaranteed years of his contract, and don't do something idiotic like packaging him in trade with Peavy to save the remainder of his Teahen-esque deal to get a Zach Stewart or Nestor Molina back in return.

Catch as catch can: Sox pitchers entered Saturday night's game owning a .230 opponents' batting average (120 of 521) at U.S. Cellular Field. Manager Robin Ventura also gives credit to his catchers — Tyler Flowers and Hector Giminez — for the success of the pitchers. "They do a good job of being on task with what the game plan is and getting pitchers to execute," Ventura said. "Any time pitchers do well, there has to be some sort of connection with their catcher, and they are doing a good job." Mitchell, tribune.com/sports/whitesox

http://www.chicagotribune.com/videogallery...lled-by-Ventura Other than watching and rewatching the Tom Emanski video starring Fred McGriff with the all-blue, knockoff Blue Jays cap...what ideas does everyone have for "fixing" our defensive issues and constant set of nightly miscues? http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-big-leag...-230358448.html Here's one suggestion! Another... http://www.google.com.hk/url?sa=t&rct=...XuwcflZMxABVKwg Dunn looks at bright side of Sox's subpar startDunn looks at bright side of Sox's subpar start The rest of this season has to be better than the first month and a half for the fifth-place White Sox, right? At least that's how Adam Dunn has it pegged. "We're only five or six games out of first place and we're playing about as bad as we can possibly play," Dunn said Saturday. "A lot of times there are not a lot of positives you can take out of playing as bad as we have been playing. But if there is one thing to take out of it, we're not out of it by any means." An unearned run was the difference. The Sox are tied with the Angels for the most errors (27) this year. Dropped popups, wild throws, booted balls in the outfield … and that doesn't even take into account passed balls, missed cutoff throws and mental lapses. The generally placid Ventura called a team meeting following Saturday night's loss. "I did say some stuff, I did," Ventura said cryptically when asked about the impromptu postgame session. Ventura says he is pretty much at a loss when it comes to solving the repeat defensive gaffes of his players. "It's more staying on top of it. Where we're at right now, it's not acceptable," Ventura said. "I mean, they understand that. You work at it, preach it, harp it. You do all of that stuff because you can't win unless you are playing good defense." After setting a franchise fielding percentage record of .988 in 2012, the Sox have been botching too many routine plays this season. Fred Mitchell, chicagotribune.com/sports/whitesox

QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ May 11, 2013 -> 10:33 PM) So, if we signed AJ, we would be overpaying a veteran, on a bad team, who also happens to be on the DL. Sweet. It's not so much keeping AJ or Buehrle, those were no brainers. It's misjudging the talent behind them, in the case of our current catching issues.

QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ May 11, 2013 -> 10:22 PM) When Pierzynski signed with the Rangers, my Dad was extremely upset. I told him we need to give Flowers a chance. He responded with "Are you kidding, we are stuck with another Ron Karkovice" Moral of the story here is, my old man knows his baseball and I was wrong. Flowers is indeed crap. He would make a decent backup but he has proven to us that he is not a good every day catcher. His defense is well below average and he can't hit water if he jumped out of a boat. The fact that we have two guys on our starting lineup hitting below .200 is an absolute joke! This team's current standing is a reflection of Hahn pretty much sitting on his hands this past winter. Karkovice was at least an excellent defensive catcher and could bunt better than almost anyone on the team. He had some skills.

QUOTE (Marty34 @ May 11, 2013 -> 09:25 PM) It's on that course as is. Outside of maybe Viciedo and perhaps Beckham there isn't a position player currently on this team who will be on it the next time they make the postseason. Jury's still out on Gillaspie. Probably more of a platoon player or PH-type, but we'll just have to wait and see what happens when Beckham comes back...how Ventura will utilize him and Keppinger. I'm actually getting behind the idea of Beckham at SS because I strongly believe it would make him more confident from an "overall" perspective, sort of like the "captain" on the team with Konerko gone...and, as one of the few remaining younger guys on the team still "youngish" but with a long history/identity with the Sox. I remember all the comparisons to Jeter when he first was drafted and came up...that cockiness and borderline arrogance. Maybe being at SS will help him. It can't get any worse for him offensively, and Ramirez is nearing his sell-by date. If we're not planning to compete for the rest of 2013 (and there's also MINN, CLE and KC between us and the Tigers), it couldn't hurt. At least it would be more interesting. And you simply can't afford to play Keppinger at SS. No way. An infield of Beckham at SS, Sanchez at 2B and Gillaspie/Keppinger 3B/util isn't going to be much worse than what we're currently going with anyway...and all those players are young enough to be a part of the future, if they can hold their own (over 625 OPS and solid defense).

Verlander had to use 110 pitches just to get through 5. Didn't have his normal stuff (still) according the announcers. Maybe this is the year all those high pitch counts start to catch up with him. CLE really battled with him, many elongated at-bats.

QUOTE (greg775 @ May 11, 2013 -> 08:47 PM) Dunn. Wow. 0-4 with 3 Ks at home. What a worthless baseball player. Indians actually have a decent team. They finished off that game by retiring Cabrera to end the game. If Sox get second pick in the draft this year behind the Marlins, are any certain stars available? Trout-like guys or Harper/Strasburg types? You're forgetting the Astros and possibly the Cubs, too After the #1 pick right now, no consensus. But five million things will change between now and next June.

Buried was a huge, sleeper (sorry, bad joke) hit at Sundance but never managed to take off in the mainstream.

QUOTE (winninguglyin83 @ May 11, 2013 -> 08:45 PM) when I said it's not going to happen, I meant it's not going to happen that Flowers becomes a competent big-league catcher. But I'm not sure how you can keep trotting a guy out there who leads the league in passed balls and hits less than .180. Occasional big homers and walks...