caulfield12

QUOTE (DirtySox @ Dec 11, 2011 -> 08:03 PM) Reports at the winter meetings had Lillibridge as one of the most sought after players the Sox have, believe it or not. I could believe it...and would be the perfect example of a "sell high" guy of almost anyone on our roster, except for maybe Konerko and Humber (although the luster came off the last couple of months of the season). With all the uncertainty around Beckham and Morel, with Rios a huge question mark...he's more valuable as a backstop at every position on the field, including 1B. Some have advocated putting him at SS and 3B, and he played first last year at times for Konerko/Dunn defensively. I'll give Greg Walker and/or Brent himself some credit with his baseball resuscitation.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 11, 2011 -> 01:48 PM) Enough to win a world series, apparently. They became a fully united team when they dumped Rasmus (same argument we'd be making were we able do dump Rios on someone). It was more an example of benefitting from what they lost rather than the actual personnel gain from the trade...although some of those spare parts did come together nicely in the end for the Cardinals. They still might end up regretting it in the end, but hard to do that when you win the World Series, right?

Stilll think it's better to get that ONE guy your guys are really confident than the 3-for-1 type trades that usually don't pan out. For every Colon/Sizemore/Phillips/Cliff Lee or Bonser-Nathan-Liriano for AJ deal that goes awry, there are 25 that don't work very well. We just brought a guy over from TOR who knows their system, particularly their Latin American/Venezuelan prospects, intimately. Probably why KW was so poorly-informed when he made the announcement about winter ball, he was putting trust in his staff. Wonder where Hahn was on all of this, the supposed Boy Wonder? I think we're all a little gunshy because of the 3 way deal with OAK for Swisher and Hudson/Holmberg, but, other than those 2, there have never been huge deals that went against KW since the Fogg/Wells/Lowe one at the beginning of his GM career. If you look at Reed/Morse/Olivo, none of those guys panned out long-term for the M's, and they weren't able to get either a position or much power out of Michael. Jury's still out on the PED's part of his career resurgence...we'll see how long-term it actually lasts. Obviously, they targed two specific guys (Stewart and Molina) who they liked the most. It's almost never going to correlate with BA or BP or the scouting reports because our scouts should be 2-3 steps ahead of those guys and us casual baseball fans, I'd have to hope. It does seem we "bought" Molina at his peak, rather than buying Chris Marquez/Lance Broadway/Kyle McCulloch on the downturn. No problem there. Let's say we had the chance to get the Blue Jays' version of three Mitchells/Trayce Thompson's in A ball. Odds are better when you take one starting pitcher talent that Cooper feels he can work with, rather than 3 raw/toolsy position players who are on the mend. The other thing about those position prospects (that Boston supposedly would have offered) is that MAYBE we're looking solely at starting pitching prospects to replenish the system after Buehrle/Danks/Floyd/Peavy depart and Boston or the Yankees don't/didn't have anything we wanted (or, most importantly, that they were willing to part with for an unproven closer in one of the most important markets in MLB). We might have been able to get a Josh Reddick, but we already had/have DeAza/Viciedo/Rios etc. at that position. If you look at our offense, we're pretty much set around the diamond....we actually don't have a place for DeAza to play everyday, despite what he accomplished last season.

It's hard to argue that the Sox have enough minor league pitching depth to risk losing an overachiever like Terry Doyle for $50,000. The Twins landed the 26-year-old right-hander with the second pick in the Rule 5 draft and will give him a chance to win a job on their staff next season, possibly even in the rotation. "We're looking for pitching," Twins GM Terry Ryan said of Doyle, who was 4-0 with a 1.98 ERA in the Arizona Fall League after a solid season that ended in Double-A. "He's a good fit here. … He's a worker. He's going to take the ball. He's big and strong and durable. We've had a lot of looks at him." phil rogers

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/135389103.h...amp;cid=8500544 Interesting, a full 2/3rd's majority of Milwaukeeians feel that Braun's career will be tainted even if he is eventually exonerated. Thought it would be closer to 50/50, since this should be his biggest groups of supporters.

Source: Braun will be vindicated e-mail print By Tom Haudricourt of the Journal Sentinel Dec. 10, 2011 10:02 p.m. |(5) Comments I just talked to someone familiar with Ryan Braun's positive drug test and he insisted that the Brewers' star left fielder will be cleared on the appeal process and that this information never should have come out. The ESPN report said Braun tested positive for an abnormally high level of testosterone in his system. No player ever has had a positive drug test overturned in appeal. If Braun’s suspension is upheld, it would start at the beginning of the 2012 regular season. Brewers spokesman Tyler Barnes said the club had not been informed by the commissioner’s office that Braun tested positive for a banned substance and faced a suspension. Creative Artists Agency, which represents Braun did release a statement indicating the positive test is being vehemently disputed: “There are highly unusual circumstances surrounding this case which will support Ryan's complete innocence and demonstrate that there was absolutely no intentional violation of the program. While Ryan has impeccable character and no previous history, unfortunately, because of the process we have to maintain confidentiality and are not able to discuss it any further, but we are confident that he will ultimately be exonerated.” A CAA spokesman said that neither Braun nor his agent, Nez Balelo, would have a comment during the appeal process. But a source familiar with the situation told the Journal Sentinel that a second test requested by Braun was negative and was being used in the appeal process to overturn the first results. That source also indicated the banned substance was not a performance-enhancing drug. “The truth will prevail; I really feel good about that,” said the source. “It just stinks that this got out before the appeal process is finished. Initial positive tests have been overturned before, proving the player is innocent, and nobody ever knows.” Obviously, this person was on Braun's side of the story but he was vehement that he knew enough details to support his comments. Former NBA star Reggie Miller, not an analyst for TNT, lives next to Braun in Malibu, Calif., and posted this tweet after the report surfaced: “Just spoke with my neighbor, Ryan Braun. He says test is bogus, can only believe a man for his word. Truth will always come out.” And, I'm not sure how USA Today's Bob Nightengale got hold of Braun, but he quoted him as saying "It's B.S.", referring to the ESPN report that he tested positive for a PED and faces a 50-game suspension. The source said Braun was tested in early October, at the start of the postseason, and was apprised of the positive result a couple of weeks later. Braun immediately requested a second test, which came back normal. Whether the lag time between the first and second test compromises Braun's appeal, I couldn't tell you. A first positive test results in a 50-game suspension, followed by a 100-game suspension for a second and a lifetime ban for a third. A player is not paid his salary during such suspensions. Braun, who signed a five-year extension in April worth $105 million that committed him to the Brewers through 2020, was a major force in the Brewers’ surge to their first NL Central crown and 96-victory season. He batted .332 with 33 home runs, 111 runs batted in, 109 runs scored, 33 stolen bases and a .597 slugging percentage, tops in the league. No reigning MVP ever has been suspended for a positive drug test. The reward is presented by the Baseball Writer’s Association of America, and that association’s president, Bill Shaikin, noted that Alex Rodriguez’s 2003 American League MVP award was not stripped after admitting later to steroid use during that period. Braun has admitted to no such use, so any calls for stripping his MVP Award are premature until all of the facts of the case are made public. The ESPN report indicated Braun’s positive test was triggered by elevated levels of testosterone. A more comprehensive tested revealed that testosterone was synthetic and therefore not produced by his body. ESPN’s sources did not indicate how high above the threshold Braun’s sample tested. But the report said Braun told people he did not knowingly take a banned substance and hoped to prove that with his appear. Even if that’s true, however, it does not mean Braun’s suspension will be overturned. A player must prove that he was not in any way negligent to successfully appeal.

QUOTE (Princess Dye @ Dec 10, 2011 -> 08:08 PM) Interestingly, not offering Buehrle a contract creates the side benefit of protecting his legacy here. It's a gift to him, in a sense, in that there's no zero chance he gets the Thome treatment in CLE (even though the chance of that happening was tiny to begin with) It also saves some money for the inevitable KW statue on the concourse, lol. (I bet WSI is having a really hard time these days defending every organizational move...must be an ugly mood over there this past week.)

http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseb...0,1788782.story Not revealing the slogan until it's clearer what KW's plan is...which u can't blame him, if they come up with a "competitive" analogy again and dump half the veterans, he's going to look stupid and be mocked. So...apparently the plan (with the $127 million payroll) was to draw 2.5 million in attendance (they ended up just a notch over 2 million), which would have had us at 6th in the AL and 14th in the majors. Right now, you'd have to project 1.7-1.8 is the much more likely scenario heading into 2012.

In our division, you should be able to compete more quickly if you have the starting pitching. Still, I'm a bit concerned that we're doing this halfway. Obviously we can't deal Dunn/Rios/Peavy just yet. But they really have to go into the season with the roster as it stands or just basically gut the whole thing....which means goodbye to Danks, Thornton, AJ, Quentin, Konerko and Alexei Ramirez. Probably you keep Floyd, Frasor, Ohman and Crain around just for their veteran presence and to stabilize things, but there's also a compelling argument for dumping all of the players I mentioned if you still can't compete in 2013. The outlook is not as dire as it looks...nor will it look as rosy as post 2005/entering 2006 again for a LONG time. My guess is that one of the starters and Thornton will go, along with Quentin. At mid-season or in the 2012 offseason, anyone on the roster might be up for grabs. We'll also have a lot better idea what Viciedo, DeAza, Molina, Stewart, Reed, Beckham, and Morel are going to give us over a full season. Sale, to me, seems like the key to the whole puzzle. If he's great, we're back closer to competitiveness. If he fizzles, then there's absolutely no reason not to do a full rebuild and gut the entire team. You also can't feel that comfortable with Humber as your #3 guy going into a season if most of these guys are traded, but there's no choice.

Why don't they bring back Joe Crede in some kind of capacity, infield instructor/defense coach? (Especially with Cora gone...that was SUPPOSEDLY his specialty). I guess since Ventura played the same position...it would be a bit of overkill, but they're already going to have a bobblehead night and it would be better to have Crede as coach than Rowand as player. Then again, they have McEwing who also played all those infield positions.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 10, 2011 -> 09:53 AM) Considering all the missteps that have occurred since 2005, the White Sox are in this mess because of 2 moves. Picking up Rios on waivers and not re-signing Thome when he was willing to do so for pennies. They sign Thome, he has a decent year like he did when he first went to MN, he gets resigned . Adam Dunn, even with all his consistent numbers doesn't even enter the equation. And both Swisher deals...but especially losing Gonzalez, who would have been the heir-apparent to Danks/Buehrle. No Dunn, they would have had another 1st round draft pick this year and the money to keep Buehrle and either Danks or Gonzalez, despite what happened with Rios and Peavy. Of course, if Chris Sale becomes an ace as some suspect, then it's not as hard a blow....but losing both Hudson and Gio with nothing to show for it, other than Stewart/Frasor, really really sucks.

Good thing you are not a Cardinals fan, then....can't imagine what you would be saying about Pujols. At least Albert HAD the option to come back for something like $40-50 million less in total dollars, and he was offered more by the Marlins. Mark never was offered by the Cardinals or the White Sox, to our knowledge. As far as grading the Winter Meetings, it's way too early. Most of baseball has been waiting on Pujols and Wilson. Fielder's still out there....I just read an article praising Boras for not striking too quickly, so the same thing has to be true about holding onto Quentin, Danks, Floyd, Thornton and potentially AJ/Ramirez/Konerko. There are 7 teams out there (at least) still looking for a 1B. I would actually rather they traded Konerko and stuck Dunn/Viciedo/Quentin at 1B and let DeAza play everyday. Now that Buehrle's gone, they aren't so much better off waiting for Konerko to recede back to norm/mean. They could actually get something decent back in return and clear more contract space for 2012/2013. Frasor was all about KW's ego and having to prove the value of that Jackson deal. But with Sale, Santos and probably Thornton gone, they thought he was needed for additional depth. In reality, the pen will probably be Reed/Crain/Frasor/Ohman/Santiago/Molina or Stewart. The only expensive pitchers in that pen are Crain and Frasor, the two veterans. Ohman's 'meh' as far as contract dollars, sure, a bit of an overpay, but he's going to have to earn his money this year. But there's just no way to possibly grade KW at all until we see what our final roster is heading into April. That's 4-7 players who could all be traded, which is obviously a significant portion of the payroll going forward.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 10, 2011 -> 09:39 AM) The Bulls won 6 championships with Jerry Krause as the GM. At some point it becomes obvious that people lose their touch. No one came knocking at Krause's door to build them a winner. I doubt any team wants a guy who has a $127 million payroll in the AL Central and finishes 3rd. Now you want to trust KW to rebuild your team. Lets look at the first round picks since Kenny has been calling the shots: SEASON PLAYER POS SCHOOL/HOMETOWN PICK 2010 Chris Sale LHP Florida Gulf Coast University 13 2009 Jared Mitchell OF LSU 23 2008 Gordon Beckham SS Univ. of Georgia 8 2007 Aaron Poreda LHP San Francisco 25 2006 Kyle McCulloch RHP Texas 29 2005 Lance Broadway RHP TCU 15 2004 Josh Fields 3B Oklahoma State 18 2003 Brian Anderson OF U. of Arizona 15 2002 Roger Ring LHP San Diego State 18 2001 Kris Honel RHP Providence HS, New Lenox 16 You really think it would be a 2-3 year process with this bozo? He needs to go, pronto. Say thanks for 2005, but we actually want to win, not come up with excuses and catch phrases like "Chicago tough". How JR can't see through all his BS, especially his Ventura story, and make no mistake, I actually don't mind his hiring, but the whole BS about interviewing for a managerial position while he was playing, is beyond me. Trying to make himself actually be what most erroneously think he is, a Stanford educated intellectual who happens to have a background in baseball is more BS. The reality was he was there on a football scholarship and lasted one semester. He's a phony. If JR was only going to get of one, he did the right thing and launced Ozzie. Ozzie would have been a huge problem if he won out over his boss. But he really needed to get rid of both. The first clear sign that the rebuild is going wrong, I think KW will finally be moved upstairs. He was owed the chance to at least try to fix his own mess without Ozzie around to sabotage things. Everyone knows the history of first round draft picks, and our barren minor league system. Just a year ago, Beckham looked like a future All-Star, and Sale a future rotation fixture, if not Randy Johnson Lite. Mitchell was doing great the year he was drafted....unfortunately, that ankle injury set him back 1 1/2 years. There's nothing KW could have done to prevent that one. It's not like everything he's done has been horrible recently. They got more than anyone in the majors could get out of both Humber and Santos. Have nurtured Dayan Viciedo along quite nicely. Selected a future closer in Addison Reed. Picked up DeAza for nothing. Morel showed lots of promise the final six weeks of the season, if only he can continue to build on that. Tyler Flowers finally showed some signs, Lillibridge even moreso. We're we saying the same kinds of things about KW after 2001, before 2005, after 2007 and again now? One way or the other, we have to live with JR's decision, so I've decided it's easier to think optimistically rather than just be upset about the last 3 seasons. The NBA is all about superstars, and everyone knew that Jordan and Pippen were 60% of the reason for the Bulls' success. That's so hard to replicate in baseball or the NFL.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 10, 2011 -> 07:58 AM) I think to have a pitcher of Buehrle's calibur, one where it was reported there were 14 teams on him, to NEVER even make him an offer looks bad. Not before he became a free agent, not at the end of the process when from what he said and I was watching, he wasn't looking for a match. Buehrle signed a 4 year $58 million contract and he called it a sad day. What's even sadder is where the White Sox apparently are at right now, and the people most responsible for that are still making the decisions. I can't fathom why anyone would be optimistic with a rebuild with KW at the helm. Because we won our only World Series in most of our lifetimes with him as the GM, Rick Hahn's still around and we've added some experienced guys in scouting and development. I get it....the last 3 years have been brutal and it's easier to look at the glass as half empty rather than half full, but we've been fooled before when we had high expectations (2001/2006/2009/2011) and we've excelled when we were the underdogs and nothing was expected out of us.

http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=Amn6...s_losers_120811 Winter Meetings Winners and Losers

QUOTE (pktmotion @ Dec 9, 2011 -> 11:49 PM) I posted this trade a few days ago in a different thread: "Floyd and Thornton + $2M for Jarrod Parker, Adam Eaton, and Ryan Wheeler." I hope this means the A's are holding onto Gio. Why would we possibly want Adam Eaton?

QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Dec 9, 2011 -> 10:09 PM) Promotions for the thousands of college students that live within 15 minutes of the Cell couldn't hurt. Something like $5 tickets with a college I.d. It wont generate a whole lot of money, but it never hurts to try to generate some buzz among young people. It'll expose new people to the Cell and hopefully expand the fanbase. A lot of those kids become permanent transplants. Converting them could happen. Hopefully the positive experience at the ballpark will outweigh the product on the field.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 23, 2011 -> 01:22 PM) http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/news/artic...rticle_26024804 See Buehrle, Mark. Bradford, Chad. Fogg, Josh. Even Matt Guerrier.

QUOTE (Soxfest @ Dec 9, 2011 -> 07:16 PM) Rebuilding teams do not need a 6 mil aging catchers! Is it $6 or $6.5 million? One of those two.

QUOTE (jasonxctf @ Dec 9, 2011 -> 09:33 PM) hey 2012 is an election year.. why not get the worlds most prominent Sox fan, come to the ballpark? I know Illinois isnt a swing state, but hey what's a 4-5 hour diversion from Wisconsin, Indiana, Michigan or Missouri for a night at home with the Sox. It would have to be tied into a non-profit program (through the First Lady's office) and Sox Charities. That I think most Sox fans would support (making it less clearly political)...some type of special charity game where XXX percentage amount of the tickets sold was split between Sox Charities and one selected by the First Lady, with both of them in attendance. Or maybe they could have him participate in a charity softball/basketball (tie it in with the Bulls or Bulls/Sox Academy and bring in kids from underperforming schools to hear him speak to them privately) game inside or around the park. Probably not time for such an event during an election year, but why not try? They're going to have to think outside the box to draw fans the next couple of seasons.

QUOTE (winninguglyin83 @ Dec 9, 2011 -> 08:01 PM) So the As get Jarrod Parker and Collin Cowgill (plus Ryan Cook) for Trevor Cahill and Craig Breslow. Cowgill and Parker would have been nice pieces for us to get for Danks. But I guess that wasn't possible. Cahill will be under team control through 2015 at $30+ million dollars. A LOT different situation from having Danks for only one year and then losing him to free agency. And Breslow was available to everyone in baseball numerous times. Obviously, there's much more of a premium on a starting pitcher than a reliever. This trade once again reinforces that fact. This would be closer to what we could get for Alexei Ramirez on the open market, though.

Maybe Verlander like numbers, but all the scouting reports have him at 89-93 and the HIGHEST at 96. That's basically the same repertoire Zach Stewart has...so we'll just have to wait and see what he actually shows us. Of course, it all depends on movement and location (as we quickly learned with Billy Koch or Jenks in his later years)...mixing in the offspeed stuff with a 10+ MPH variation on at least one of his secondary pitches. The most interesting number is always how many times he throws a pitch and the batter swings and misses the ball entirely. That's stuff, at least to me. No matter how hard Zumaya or Aroldis Chapman throw, Paul Konerko will eventually get to their fastballs if you keep chunking them up there.

They made a movie, that was all fine and good. He still has many fans from all around the world, but what's the connection to the White Sox? That he's from Gary, Indiana? Imagine having a Joe Paterno Night, for example, at USCF. That's essentially what you're saying with your Michael Jackson Night idea. Why would you do a promotion that will offend at LEAST 50% of your target audience, if not more? The White Sox have lost MOST of their African-American fans (at least those who go to the ballpark on a consistent basis) over the last 20-30 years, as has all of baseball, for that matter. If you were a black person, would having a Michael Jackson Night seem in good taste? Fine, have a Janet Jackson Night and have her do a concert after the game (or Jackson 5 reunion event/concert)...that would be okay, to do more concerts and events to draw fans to the ballpark.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Dec 9, 2011 -> 08:26 PM) So my question is ... how many blown saves in a season is acceptable? Didn't Detroit go all year without a blown save? If we go through 2-3 closers, my estimation is we will blow up to nine saves. That means our team is going to suck again. Now if we write it off saying, 'We're rebuilding. It's OK if our closing situation sucks," fine. But "what if" several of our s***ty hitters (of last season) rebound as we are all hoping and the team has a decent offense?? Then the closing situation will cost the team dearly, if you assume Detroit (OR SOMEBODY) in the division could have a closer with 1-2 blown saves ALL SEASON. p.s. I just saw your Reed post. Are we to assume he will only blow 1-3 saves? Just asking. That first six weeks of the season with Pierre/Thornton failing absolutely killed any momentum this season. (And Dunn's surgery, I guess). By and large, a closer should have an 85% conversion rate or higher to be considered good. Until the last two DET blown losses, he was in that range or above. The problem with Sergio is that when he was bad, he completely imploded. Jenks would have quite a few games where he would blow the save but the game would still be tied and we'd go on in extra innings or the bottom of the 9th to win. With Sergio, it was pretty much all or nothing....dominant stuff or a complete implosion.

Maybe the Molina deal will turn out to be a win in the future, but we certainly didn't WIN anything this week. I would doubt they sold a single new customer any type of season ticket package based on the results of these 4-5 days. On the other hand, losing Santos and especially Buehrle is going to cost them 5-10% of their season ticket renewals, if not more. Suppose you could argue they cleared future payroll space by signing Santos to a "friendly" deal that they seemingly thought would go bad in the future. At some point, it would be nice if KW was actually right on a trade instead of on the wrong side of the ledger over and over again.